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Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup

From Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>
Newsgroups linux.kernel
Subject Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup
Date 2016-04-09 00:00 +0200
Message-ID <rlMBC-21s-37@gated-at.bofh.it> (permalink)
References (2 earlier) <rlkFl-6uI-37@gated-at.bofh.it> <rlJX4-7e-27@gated-at.bofh.it> <rlJX5-7e-49@gated-at.bofh.it> <rlLvR-133-11@gated-at.bofh.it> <rlMrT-1R1-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
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On Fri, Apr 8, 2016 at 2:29 PM, Eric W. Biederman <ebiederm@xmission.com> wrote:
>
> I don't think so.  For one it depends on getting s_user_ns which should
> happen but is not there yet.  For another the way you describe
> it you would break the case of
>
>         unshare(CLONE_NEWUSER);
>         unshare(CLONE_NEWNS);
>         open("/dev/ptmx");
>
> Which is actually more likely to break userspace than anything else we
> have considered.  I know people actually do that.

.. but you could just check that the ptmx node is actually the same
superblock that the pts directory is mounted on. If it's a bind mount,
that wouldn't be true.

But more fundamentally I still don't actually understand why you even
really care.

We get the wrong pts case *today*. We'd get a different wrong pts
namespace when somebody tries to do odd things. Why would we care? It
would be a _better_ guess.

I don't see the security issue. If you do tricks to get pty's in
another group, what's the problem? You have to do it consciously, and
I don't see what the downside is. You get what you ask for, and I
don't see a new attack surface.

The whole "somebody used chmod on /dev/pts/" argument sounds bogus.
That's an insane thing to do. If you want a private namespace, you
make *all* of /dev private, you don't go "oh, I'll just make the pts
subdirectory private".

In other words, your whole scenario sounds totally made up to begin
with. And even if it happens, I don't see what would be so disastrous
about it.

I mean, right now, /dev/ptmx is world read-write in the root container
and everybody gets access to the same underlying set of ptys. And
that's not some horrible security issue. It's how things are
*supposed* to work.

So I really don't see the argument. You guys are just making shit up.

                Linus

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[PATCH 00/13] devpts: New instances for every mount ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-05 02:20 +0200
  [PATCH 04/13] devpts: Stop rolling devpts_remount by hand in devpts_mount "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-05 03:50 +0200
  [PATCH 05/13] devpts: Fail early (if appropriate) on overmount "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-05 03:50 +0200
  [PATCH 08/13] devpts: Make devpts_kill_sb safe if fsi is NULL "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-05 03:50 +0200
  [PATCH 03/13] devpts: Cleanup newinstance parsing "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-05 03:50 +0200
  [PATCH 06/13] devpts: Use the same default mode for both /dev/ptmx and dev/pts/ptmx "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-05 03:50 +0200
  [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-05 03:50 +0200
    [PATCH 09/13] devpts: Move the creation of /dev/pts/ptmx into fill_super "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-05 03:50 +0200
    [PATCH 02/13] devpts: More obvious check for the system devpts in pty allocation "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-05 03:50 +0200
    [PATCH 13/13] devpts: Kill the DEVPTS_MULTIPLE_INSTANCE config option "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-05 03:50 +0200
    [PATCH 07/13] devpts: Move parse_mount_options into fill_super "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-05 03:50 +0200
    [PATCH 12/13] devpts: Always return a distinct instance when mounting "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-05 04:00 +0200
    [PATCH 11/13] vfs: Implement mount_super_once "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-05 04:00 +0200
    [PATCH 10/13] devpts: Simplify devpts_mount by using mount_nodev "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-05 04:00 +0200
    Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Al Viro <viro@ZenIV.linux.org.uk> - 2016-04-05 05:00 +0200
      Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Al Viro <viro@ZenIV.linux.org.uk> - 2016-04-05 05:10 +0200
        Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-08 21:10 +0200
    Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-04-07 18:10 +0200
      Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-08 21:10 +0200
        Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-04-08 21:10 +0200
          Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-08 22:20 +0200
          Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Andy Lutomirski <luto@amacapital.net> - 2016-04-08 22:50 +0200
            Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-08 23:50 +0200
              Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Andy Lutomirski <luto@amacapital.net> - 2016-04-09 00:00 +0200
              Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-04-09 00:00 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-09 01:20 +0200
        Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup One Thousand Gnomes <gnomes@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk> - 2016-04-09 15:20 +0200
          Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup "H. Peter Anvin" <hpa@zytor.com> - 2016-04-09 16:20 +0200
            Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-09 17:00 +0200
              Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup "H. Peter Anvin" <hpa@zytor.com> - 2016-04-10 00:50 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-04-10 02:10 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup "H. Peter Anvin" <hpa@zytor.com> - 2016-04-10 02:20 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-04-10 02:20 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Andy Lutomirski <luto@amacapital.net> - 2016-04-10 02:50 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup "H. Peter Anvin" <hpa@zytor.com> - 2016-04-11 17:10 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Al Viro <viro@ZenIV.linux.org.uk> - 2016-04-12 03:40 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Andy Lutomirski <luto@amacapital.net> - 2016-04-11 22:20 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup "H. Peter Anvin" <hpa@zytor.com> - 2016-04-11 22:30 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-12 01:50 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-04-12 02:10 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-12 02:30 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-04-12 03:20 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup "H. Peter Anvin" <hpa@zytor.com> - 2016-04-12 03:20 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-12 03:40 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Al Viro <viro@ZenIV.linux.org.uk> - 2016-04-12 03:50 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Al Viro <viro@ZenIV.linux.org.uk> - 2016-04-12 03:40 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-12 04:30 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-11 22:30 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Andy Lutomirski <luto@amacapital.net> - 2016-04-12 19:50 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-04-12 20:20 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup "H. Peter Anvin" <hpa@zytor.com> - 2016-04-12 21:20 +0200
                [PATCH 01/16] devpts: Attempting to get it right ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-15 17:50 +0200
                [PATCH 08/16] devpts: Stop rolling devpts_remount by hand in devpts_mount "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-15 17:50 +0200
                [PATCH 05/16] vfs: Allow unlink, and rename on expirable file mounts "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-15 17:50 +0200
                [PATCH 04/16] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to automount the appropriate devpts via path lookup "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-15 17:50 +0200
                [PATCH 09/16] devpts: Fail early (if appropriate) on overmount "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-15 17:50 +0200
                [PATCH 10/16] devpts: Move parse_mount_options into fill_super "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-15 17:50 +0200
                [PATCH 06/16] devpts: More obvious check for the system devpts in pty allocation "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-15 17:50 +0200
                [PATCH 01/16] devpts: Use the same default mode for both /dev/ptmx and dev/pts/ptmx "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-15 17:50 +0200
                [PATCH 12/16] devpts: Move the creation of /dev/pts/ptmx into fill_super "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-15 18:00 +0200
                [PATCH 11/16] devpts: Make devpts_kill_sb safe if fsi is NULL "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-15 18:00 +0200
                [PATCH 16/16] devpts: Kill the DEVPTS_MULTIPLE_INSTANCE config option "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-15 18:00 +0200
                [PATCH 15/16] devpts: Always return a distinct instance when mounting "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-15 18:00 +0200
                [PATCH 13/16] devpts: Simplify devpts_mount by using mount_nodev "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-15 18:00 +0200
                [PATCH 14/16] vfs: Implement mount_super_once "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com> - 2016-04-15 18:00 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-12 02:10 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-04-12 02:10 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-12 02:40 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated  devpts via path lookup Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-04-12 03:00 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 01/13] devpts: Teach /dev/ptmx to find the associated devpts via path lookup ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) - 2016-04-11 22:20 +0200

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