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Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies

From Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org>
Newsgroups comp.theory, sci.logic
Subject Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies
Date 2024-06-18 22:16 -0400
Organization i2pn2 (i2pn.org)
Message-ID <v4tf1t$ddeo$3@i2pn2.org> (permalink)
References (8 earlier) <v4pmb8$nmvq$1@dont-email.me> <v4rekj$180pg$1@dont-email.me> <v4rv45$1blnm$1@dont-email.me> <v4s8k7$1dcrb$1@dont-email.me> <v4s9cj$1dk9i$1@dont-email.me>

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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On 6/18/24 11:33 AM, olcott wrote:
> On 6/18/2024 10:20 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>> Op 18.jun.2024 om 14:38 schreef olcott:
>>> On 6/18/2024 2:57 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>> Op 17.jun.2024 om 17:56 schreef olcott:
>>>>> On 6/17/2024 9:49 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>> Op 17.jun.2024 om 16:34 schreef olcott:
>>>>>>> On 6/17/2024 9:18 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>>>> Op 17.jun.2024 om 15:47 schreef olcott:
>>>>>>>>> On 6/17/2024 8:30 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Op 17.jun.2024 om 14:20 schreef olcott:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 6/17/2024 3:31 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> Op 17.jun.2024 om 05:33 schreef olcott:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To understand this analysis requires a sufficient knowledge of
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the C programming language and what an x86 emulator does.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Unless every single detail is made 100% explicit false 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> assumptions
>>>>>>>>>>>>> always slip though the cracks. This is why it must be 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> examined at
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the C level before it is examined at the Turing Machine level.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> typedef void (*ptr)();
>>>>>>>>>>>>> int H0(ptr P);
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> void Infinite_Loop()
>>>>>>>>>>>>> {
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    HERE: goto HERE;
>>>>>>>>>>>>> }
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> void Infinite_Recursion()
>>>>>>>>>>>>> {
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    Infinite_Recursion();
>>>>>>>>>>>>> }
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> void DDD()
>>>>>>>>>>>>> {
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    H0(DDD);
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    return;
>>>>>>>>>>>>> }
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> int main()
>>>>>>>>>>>>> {
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    H0(Infinite_Loop);
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    H0(Infinite_Recursion);
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    H0(DDD);
>>>>>>>>>>>>> }
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Every C programmer that knows what an x86 emulator is knows 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> that when H0
>>>>>>>>>>>>> emulates the machine language of Infinite_Loop, 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Infinite_Recursion, and
>>>>>>>>>>>>> DDD that it must abort these emulations so that itself can 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> terminate
>>>>>>>>>>>>> normally.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> When this is construed as non-halting criteria then simulating
>>>>>>>>>>>>> termination analyzer H0 is correct to reject these inputs 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> as non-
>>>>>>>>>>>>> halting.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> For Infinite_Loop and Infinite_Recursion that might be true, 
>>>>>>>>>>>> because there the simulator processes the whole input.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> The H0 case is very different. For H0 there is indeed a 
>>>>>>>>>>>> false assumption, as you mentioned. Here H0 needs to 
>>>>>>>>>>>> simulate itself, but the simulation is never able to reach 
>>>>>>>>>>>> the final state of the simulated self. The abort is always 
>>>>>>>>>>>> one cycle too early, so that the simulating H0 misses the 
>>>>>>>>>>>> abort. Therefore this results in a false negative.
>>>>>>>>>>>> (Note that H0 should process its input, which includes the 
>>>>>>>>>>>> H0 that aborts, not a non-input with an H that does not abort.)
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> This results in a impossible dilemma for the programmer. It 
>>>>>>>>>>>> he creates a H that does not abort, it will not terminate. 
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> *Therefore what I said is correct*
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> No, that is not a logical conclusion. 
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Every C programmer that knows what an x86 emulator is knows
>>>>>>>>> that when H0 emulates the machine language of Infinite_Loop, 
>>>>>>>>> Infinite_Recursion, and DDD that it must abort these emulations
>>>>>>>>> so that itself can terminate normally.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That might be correct.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> When this is construed as non-halting criteria then simulating
>>>>>>>>> termination analyzer H0 is correct to reject these inputs as non-
>>>>>>>>> halting.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That is wrong. It only shows that H0 is unable to simulate 
>>>>>>>> itself. It tells nothing about the halting of the input.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> *Too late you have already affirmed the words above*
>>>>>>>>> Affirming the first part necessitates the second part.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That is not logical. If a non-aborting program is wrong, it does 
>>>>>>>> not follow that a program that aborts is correct.
>>>>>>>> Please, think before you reply.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So, I repeat:
>>>>>>>> The logical conclusion if both aborting and not aborting result 
>>>>>>>> in errors, is: a halt-decider cannot be based on such a simulation.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Your view here is merely ignorant of the fact that deciders
>>>>>>> must report on the behavior specified by their inputs.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It is incorrect to assume that a failing simulation is able to 
>>>>>> report about its input.
>>>>>> The simulation fails, because H0 is unable to simulate itself.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> There is no possible way for the call to H0 by DDD
>>>>> correctly simulated by any H0 to return to its caller.
>>>>
>>>> We have not seen a proof for this claim and since H0 has 
>>>> contradictory requirements nobody else has ever provided a proof.
>>>> But OK, lets assume your are right. Simulated H0 is unable to 
>>>> simulate itself op to its final state and return to its caller, 
>>>> because it was aborted one cycle before it would return to its caller.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _DDD()
>>>>> [00001fd2] 55               push ebp
>>>>> [00001fd3] 8bec             mov ebp,esp
>>>>> [00001fd5] 68d21f0000       push 00001fd2 ; push address of DDD
>>>>> [00001fda] e8f3f9ffff       call 000019d2 ; call  H0
>>>>> [00001fdf] 83c404           add esp,+04
>>>>> [00001fe2] 5d               pop ebp
>>>>> [00001fe3] c3               ret
>>>>> Size in bytes:(0018) [00001fe3]
>>>>>
>>>>> *THAT THIS IS OVER YOUR HEAD DOES NOT MEAN THAT I AM INCORRECT*
>>>>> DDD correctly simulated by H0 *is* the behavior that
>>>>> the finite string of x86 machine code of DDD specifies.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> It is such a simple fact that H0 cannot possibly correct. 
>>>
>>> Are you pretending to be incompetent about the semantics of the
>>> x86 language or you you actually incompetent?
>>
>> I understand x86, but I am afraid you don't. Because you assume 
>> results that are not there.
>>
>>>
>>> The C people already agreed that I am correct about this:
>>
>> No serious C people have agreed. They can't, because your H0 has 
>> contradictory requirements.
>>
> 
> It is a verified fact that serious C people have recently
> agreed to the following verbatim statement in the C group.
> You either lack this degree of skill in C or are only
> interested in playing head games.
> 
> http://al.howardknight.net/?STYPE=msgid&MSGI=%3Cv4pg5p%24morv%241%40raubtier-asyl.eternal-september.org%3E+

Yep the "Serious member of the C programming group Bonita, who is a 
laughing stock there for their strange ideas.

Of COURSE your "Appeal to Authority" is to Bonita.

>>>
>>> typedef void (*ptr)();
>>> int H0(ptr P);
>>>
>>> void Infinite_Loop()
>>> {
>>>    HERE: goto HERE;
>>> }
>>>
>>> void Infinite_Recursion()
>>> {
>>>    Infinite_Recursion();
>>> }
>>>
>>> void DDD()
>>> {
>>>    H0(DDD);
>>> }
>>>
>>> int main()
>>> {
>>>    H0(Infinite_Loop);
>>>    H0(Infinite_Recursion);
>>>    H0(DDD);
>>> }
>>>
>>> Every C programmer that knows what an x86 emulator is knows that when H0
>>> emulates the machine language of Infinite_Loop, Infinite_Recursion, and
>>> DDD that it must abort these emulations so that itself can terminate
>>> normally.
>>
>> You are repeating. It seems difficult for you to escape rebuttal mode.
>> It was shown already to you that the first two examples are very 
>> different from the last one.
>>
>> The last one is equivalent to:
>>
>>         int main()
>>         {
>>           return H0(main);
>>         }
>>
>> where your own proved that H reports a false negative. This is the 
>> same case as DDD.
>>
>>>
>>> When this is construed as non-halting criteria then simulating
>>> termination analyzer H0 is correct to reject these inputs as non-halting
>>> by returning 0 to its caller.
>>
>> It is incorrect to report the last one as non-halting, because H0 
>> aborts one cycle too early, which makes that it misses the fact that 
>> the simulated self would abort and halt.
>>
>>>
>>>> If it does not abort it does not return. If it does abort, it does 
>>>> not see the correct behaviour that was specified in the input, 
>>>> because it aborted its simulation one cycle too early to see the 
>>>> behaviour in the input.
>>>> H0 fails to do a correct simulation, because it does not process all 
>>>> of its input, but aborts its input before it can process the part of 
>>>> the input that also specifies behaviour. The final behaviour 
>>>> specified by the input is unreachable for the simulator, because it 
>>>> is unable to simulate itself.
>>>>
>>>> If even such simple facts are over your head, you must be stuck in 
>>>> rebuttal mode very deeply.
>>>
>>
>

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Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-16 22:33 -0500
  Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-17 10:31 +0200
    Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-17 07:20 -0500
      Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-17 15:30 +0200
        Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-17 08:47 -0500
          Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-17 16:18 +0200
            Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-17 09:34 -0500
              Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-17 16:49 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-17 10:56 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-18 09:57 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 07:38 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-06-18 14:42 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 08:34 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-18 22:16 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-18 17:20 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 10:33 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-18 17:47 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 11:26 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-06-18 18:28 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 11:34 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-19 10:08 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 08:00 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-19 15:56 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 10:01 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-19 17:47 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 11:08 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-20 10:17 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-19 20:23 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 19:44 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-19 21:39 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 21:02 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-19 22:17 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 21:25 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-20 07:33 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-20 09:58 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-20 21:55 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-20 22:48 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-20 17:52 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-20 23:05 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-20 18:09 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-20 21:55 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-20 21:29 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-20 22:43 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-20 08:17 +0300
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-20 00:22 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-20 07:33 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-20 17:54 +0300
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-20 10:06 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-20 21:55 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-06-18 17:56 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 11:29 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-18 22:16 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-18 22:16 -0400
      Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-17 18:42 -0400
        Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-17 20:16 -0500
          Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-17 21:24 -0400
            Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-17 21:04 -0500
              Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-17 22:33 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-17 21:36 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-17 22:44 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-17 22:01 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-17 23:15 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-17 22:28 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-18 07:36 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 08:21 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-18 17:06 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 12:25 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-18 17:57 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 13:16 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-18 20:37 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 16:29 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-19 08:48 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- test of dishonesty olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 08:12 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 16:08 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Alan Mackenzie <acm@muc.de> - 2024-06-18 21:36 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 16:54 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Alan Mackenzie <acm@muc.de> - 2024-06-19 09:29 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 09:05 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-19 17:51 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- The only reply until addressed olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 12:52 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- addressed joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-19 18:03 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- --- the only reply until FULLY addressed olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 13:26 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- --- the only reply until FULLY addressed joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-20 16:33 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-20 08:29 +0300
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-20 00:40 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-20 18:08 +0300
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-20 10:23 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-20 21:55 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-21 10:11 +0300
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-21 08:19 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-21 10:06 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-22 11:05 +0300
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-22 08:04 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-22 09:27 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-22 09:11 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-22 10:20 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-22 09:42 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-22 11:08 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-22 14:53 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-23 10:57 +0300
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-23 08:13 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-24 10:22 +0300
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-24 08:46 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-24 19:52 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met Alan Mackenzie <acm@muc.de> - 2024-06-24 20:27 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-24 16:10 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-24 19:48 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-25 08:48 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-25 14:14 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-25 12:27 +0300
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met Alan Mackenzie <acm@muc.de> - 2024-06-25 14:06 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-24 16:12 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-24 19:53 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- criteria is met Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-24 19:44 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-18 22:16 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 21:30 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-18 22:41 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 21:51 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-19 09:08 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 08:31 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-19 17:43 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- the only reply until addressed olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 12:48 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- the only reply until addressed joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-19 17:59 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-19 07:30 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 09:23 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-19 16:43 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 12:09 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-19 20:24 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 12:16 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-19 17:32 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 12:40 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-19 20:24 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-19 20:24 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-19 08:57 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 08:20 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-19 16:25 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-19 20:24 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-19 10:18 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 08:11 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-19 16:11 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 10:07 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-19 17:50 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 11:10 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-20 10:23 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-20 09:16 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-20 16:29 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-20 11:35 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-21 09:58 +0200
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-21 08:12 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-21 10:11 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-20 22:54 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-20 08:43 +0300
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-20 09:45 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-21 10:02 +0300
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-21 08:18 -0500
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-21 10:20 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers by dummies --- What does halting mean? Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-22 11:14 +0300
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-18 22:16 -0400
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-06-18 13:52 +0200
  Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-18 19:21 +0300
    Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 11:30 -0500
      Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-18 19:37 +0300
        Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 11:45 -0500
          Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-19 12:30 +0300
            Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 08:47 -0500
              Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-19 17:45 +0000
                Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies --- The only reply until addressed olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 12:49 -0500
              Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-20 08:53 +0300
      Re: Simulating termination analyzers for dummies Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-18 22:16 -0400

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