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iPhoto vs Photo

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  iPhoto vs Photo Otto Pylot <otto@bogus.address.com> - 2015-05-28 20:49 -0700
    Re: iPhoto vs Photo JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-05-29 02:21 -0400
    Re: iPhoto vs Photo dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2015-05-29 19:50 +1200
      Re: iPhoto vs Photo Otto Pylot <otto@bogus.address.com> - 2015-05-29 18:13 -0700
        Re: iPhoto vs Photo John McWilliams <jpmcw@comcast.net> - 2015-05-29 18:56 -0700
        Re: iPhoto vs Photo dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2015-05-30 14:36 +1200
        Re: iPhoto vs Photo JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-05-30 02:06 -0400
          Re: iPhoto vs Photo Otto Pylot <otto@bogus.address.com> - 2015-05-30 09:18 -0700
            Re: iPhoto vs Photo awoolmeyer@gmail.com - 2015-05-30 12:13 -0700
              Re: iPhoto vs Photo JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-05-30 17:01 -0400
                Re: iPhoto vs Photo Alan Baker <email@domain.com> - 2015-06-02 07:27 -0700
    Re: iPhoto vs Photo "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-06-03 22:58 +0000
      Re: iPhoto vs Photo sctvguy1 <sctvguy1@invalid.net> - 2015-06-05 16:27 +0000
        Re: iPhoto vs Photo "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-06-06 01:59 +0000
          Re: iPhoto vs Photo Calum <com.gmail@nospam.scottishwildcat> - 2015-06-06 11:53 +0100
            Re: iPhoto vs Photo Calum <com.gmail@nospam.scottishwildcat> - 2015-06-06 11:58 +0100
        Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-07 17:02 -0500
          Re: iPhoto vs Photo Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2015-06-08 08:02 -0400
            Re: iPhoto vs Photo android <here@there.was> - 2015-06-08 17:02 +0200
            Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-10 10:44 -0500
              Re: iPhoto vs Photo "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-06-10 21:05 +0000
                Re: iPhoto vs Photo Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2015-06-10 17:31 -0400
                  Re: iPhoto vs Photo Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2015-06-10 15:00 -0700
                  Re: iPhoto vs Photo nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-10 18:47 -0400
                  Re: iPhoto vs Photo "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-06-12 18:23 +0000
                    Re: iPhoto vs Photo Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2015-06-12 14:41 -0400
                      Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-12 19:50 -0500
                        Re: iPhoto vs Photo nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-12 21:02 -0400
                          Re: iPhoto vs Photo sctvguy1 <sctvguy1@invalid.net> - 2015-06-14 20:45 +0000
                            Re: iPhoto vs Photo nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-14 16:59 -0400
                    Re: iPhoto vs Photo sctvguy1 <sctvguy1@invalid.net> - 2015-06-12 14:30 -0500
                      Re: iPhoto vs Photo "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-06-13 22:17 +0000
                    Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-12 19:49 -0500
                      Re: iPhoto vs Photo "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-06-13 22:24 +0000
                        Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-16 11:33 -0500
                          Re: iPhoto vs Photo nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-16 12:35 -0400
                            Re: iPhoto vs Photo "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-06-20 01:11 +0000
                          Re: iPhoto vs Photo David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> - 2015-06-16 12:54 -0500
                            Re: iPhoto vs Photo nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-16 14:21 -0400
                              Re: iPhoto vs Photo David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> - 2015-06-16 14:57 -0500
                                Re: iPhoto vs Photo nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-16 16:54 -0400
                                  Re: iPhoto vs Photo David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> - 2015-06-16 22:46 -0500
                                    Re: iPhoto vs Photo nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-17 00:14 -0400
                                      Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-18 10:01 -0500
                                        Re: iPhoto vs Photo nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-18 11:53 -0400
                                    Re: iPhoto vs Photo dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2015-06-18 23:46 +1200
                                      Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-18 09:55 -0500
                                  Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-18 09:49 -0500
                                    Re: iPhoto vs Photo nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-18 11:53 -0400
                                      Re: iPhoto vs Photo JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-06-18 12:27 -0400
                                        Re: iPhoto vs Photo nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-18 13:32 -0400
                                          Re: iPhoto vs Photo dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2015-06-19 12:35 +1200
                                      Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-19 11:02 -0500
                            Re: iPhoto vs Photo Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2015-06-16 19:06 -0400
                              Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-17 18:29 -0500
                                Re: iPhoto vs Photo Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2015-06-17 19:42 -0400
                                Re: iPhoto vs Photo nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-17 23:38 -0400
                            Re: iPhoto vs Photo dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2015-06-17 13:19 +1200
                              Re: iPhoto vs Photo John McWilliams <jpmcw@comcast.net> - 2015-06-16 18:56 -0700
                              Re: iPhoto vs Photo JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-06-17 12:44 -0400
                                Re: iPhoto vs Photo nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-17 12:56 -0400
                                Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-17 18:28 -0500
                            Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-17 18:26 -0500
                              Re: iPhoto vs Photo David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> - 2015-06-17 20:28 -0500
                                Re: iPhoto vs Photo nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-17 23:37 -0400
                                  Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-18 09:44 -0500
                                Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-18 09:44 -0500
                                  Re: iPhoto vs Photo nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-18 11:53 -0400
                                  Re: iPhoto vs Photo Savageduck <savageduck1@(REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2015-06-18 09:32 -0700
                                    Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-19 11:07 -0500
                                  And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo) David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> - 2015-06-18 18:09 -0500
                                    Re: And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo) erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-22 10:46 -0500
                                      Re: And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo) Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2015-06-22 17:40 +0100
                                      Re: And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo) David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> - 2015-06-22 16:49 -0500
                                        Re: And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo) Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2015-06-23 09:35 +0100
                                          Re: And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo) nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-06-23 11:02 -0400
                                            Re: And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo) erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-23 18:50 -0500
                                        Re: And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo) erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-23 18:49 -0500
                                          Re: And Now For Something Completely Different erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-24 15:25 -0500
                                            Re: And Now For Something Completely Different Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2015-06-24 21:38 +0100
                              Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-18 09:22 -0500
                    Re: iPhoto vs Photo JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-06-12 21:42 -0400
                Re: iPhoto vs Photo erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2015-06-12 19:42 -0500

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#76734

In article <5581a405$0$41611$c3e8da3$5d8fb80f@news.astraweb.com>, JF
Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:

> This isn't a question of getting used to a new UI, it is a question of
> missing key functionality, like ability to cal photoshop.

if calling photoshop is important, then iphoto and photos are the wrong
tools. they are targeted at the casual user, not someone who is going
to mess with photoshop.

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#76738

In article <5581a405$0$41611$c3e8da3$5d8fb80f@news.astraweb.com>,
 JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:

> On 15-06-16 21:19, David Empson wrote:
> 
> > That is only going to be a short term solution. iPhoto is never going to
> > be updated again, and may break in future OS X versions. It would be
> > better to start getting used to Photos, and send feedback to Apple for
> > any issues you have with it.
> 
> I disagree. Keep using iPhotos until Photos gets upgraded to meet your
> requirements. But one must keep an eye out for the day iPhoto stops
> working, at which point you must choose to not upgrade OS-X until you
> find the new app to replace it.
> 
> This isn't a question of getting used to a new UI, it is a question of
> missing key functionality, like ability to cal photoshop.

The problem isn't using iPhoto or Photo as foto editor. They both stink 
for that.

-- 
Erilar, biblioholic medievalist

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#76737

In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1506161220330.43505@mako.ath.cx>,
 David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

> erilar, you only /think/ you want to replace Photos on your new box.  
> As Photos is part of Yosemite, you do not want to fuck with it.  
> Leave it alone.  Don't use it, if that's your choice, but DO NOT 
> attempt to remove it.

In other words, take very careful care of the old laptop, as it seems 
there is no way to find a replacement foto editor without paying through 
the nose for it before I can even find out whether it fits my needs.  
I'm certainly going to pay to "rent" one every month when I only use it 
occasionally, but then extensively.

-- 
Erilar, biblioholic medievalist

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#76746

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On Wednesday, 17 June 2015 18:26 -0500, 
 in article <drache-553895.18262817062015@88-209-239-213.giganet.hu>, 
 erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> wrote:

> In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1506161220330.43505@mako.ath.cx>,
>  David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

>> erilar, you only /think/ you want to replace Photos on your new 
>> box.  As Photos is part of Yosemite, you do not want to fuck with 
>> it.  Leave it alone.  Don't use it, if that's your choice, but DO 
>> NOT attempt to remove it.

> In other words, take very careful care of the old laptop, as it 
> seems there is no way to find a replacement foto editor without 
> paying through the nose for it before I can even find out whether it 
> fits my needs.  I'm certainly going to pay to "rent" one every month 
> when I only use it occasionally, but then extensively.

You're welcome to maintain your old laptop, for the remainder of its 
useful life.

The message is, "Don't fuck with your operating system, as it's likely 
to come around and byte you in the ass."  Attempting to move 
Photos.app to the trash will be denied, with the charming message 
stating it cannot be removed from /Application/, as it in now part of 
the OS X operating system.

You have enough self-inflicted problems with which to deal, without 
going out of your way to create very real problems, as compared to 
perceived inconvenience, like bricking your new computer running OS X 
10.10.3 and above.

I used Color It! under Classic Mac, but it was never my primary photo 
editing tool.  It's capable of doing things not found in many photo 
editing applications, with which I'm familiar.  Do keep in mind that it 
isn't specifically a photo editor; it's billed as an image editor.

While just as or more expensive that Adobe Lightroom, products such as 
Adobe Illustrator may be better choices for you.  While it may not be 
your ideal solution, looking for other 'image editors' for Mac may 
allow you to move forward.

    <https://www.google.com/search?num=100&q=yosemite+image+editor>

It's even possible you could use the Mac Paint annotation features in 
Preview, which is already installed.  It won't be Color It!, but it 
may be worth a try.  You certainly won't know, until you do.

    <https://www.google.com/search?q=yosemite+mac+paint>

-- 
David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com>
 Be kind to animals; kiss a shark.

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#76751

In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1506171931520.52815@mako.ath.cx>, David
Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

> While just as or more expensive that Adobe Lightroom, products such as 
> Adobe Illustrator may be better choices for you.  While it may not be 
> your ideal solution, looking for other 'image editors' for Mac may 
> allow you to move forward.

adobe illustrator is not an image editor!

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#76783

In article <170620152337585505%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
 nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1506171931520.52815@mako.ath.cx>, David
> Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:
> 
> > While just as or more expensive that Adobe Lightroom, products such as 
> > Adobe Illustrator may be better choices for you.  While it may not be 
> > your ideal solution, looking for other 'image editors' for Mac may 
> > allow you to move forward.
> 
> adobe illustrator is not an image editor!

Thanks for the warning 8-)

-- 
Erilar, biblioholic medievalist

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#76782

In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1506171931520.52815@mako.ath.cx>,
 David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

> I used Color It! under Classic Mac, but it was never my primary photo 
> editing tool.  It's capable of doing things not found in many photo 
> editing applications, with which I'm familiar.  Do keep in mind that it 
> isn't specifically a photo editor; it's billed as an image editor.

I've been looking around, but nothing I find described actually tells me 
in detail what its features are.  They probably all have some of the 
same tools, but do they have the ones I use most? What about free 
rotation so I can get the exact angle I want? Choice and fine control of 
filters?  And since you mention it, perhaps "image editor" is what I 
should be looking for.  

I'm not totally resistant to change, but am a stubborn adherent of the 
"if it ain't broke, don't fix it" school. I've had far more bad than 
good experiences with "up"grades in the past.   Whatever "improvements" 
are added, fine detail control is removed in favor of some new 
"foolproof" version full of preset categories which replace detailed 
control. 
> 
> While just as or more expensive that Adobe Lightroom, products such as 
> Adobe Illustrator may be better choices for you.  While it may not be 
> your ideal solution, looking for other 'image editors' for Mac may 
> allow you to move forward.
> 
>     <https://www.google.com/search?num=100&q=yosemite+image+editor>
> 
> It's even possible you could use the Mac Paint annotation features in 
> Preview, which is already installed.  It won't be Color It!, but it 
> may be worth a try.  You certainly won't know, until you do.
> 
>     <https://www.google.com/search?q=yosemite+mac+paint>

One of my problems with subscription model programs is that I may go 
weeks or even months without needing anything I can't do with 
GraphicConverter.  I've just spent much of the month since returning 
from my spring triple trip sorting and editing fotos to create album 
pages including text for the three.  No, not full time, but multiple 
hours most days.  Next month I'll have a shorter but intensive session 
after a short excursion. There's unlikely to be anything similar after 
that for months.

-- 
Erilar, biblioholic medievalist

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#76789

In article <drache-597772.09441618062015@88-209-239-213.giganet.hu>,
erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> wrote:

> One of my problems with subscription model programs is that I may go 
> weeks or even months without needing anything I can't do with 
> GraphicConverter.  I've just spent much of the month since returning 
> from my spring triple trip sorting and editing fotos to create album 
> pages including text for the three.  No, not full time, but multiple 
> hours most days.  Next month I'll have a shorter but intensive session 
> after a short excursion. There's unlikely to be anything similar after 
> that for months.

adobe offers monthly or yearly options.

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#76798

On 2015-06-18 14:44:16 +0000, erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> said:

> One of my problems with subscription model programs is that I may go
> weeks or even months without needing anything I can't do with
> GraphicConverter.  I've just spent much of the month since returning
> from my spring triple trip sorting and editing fotos to create album
> pages including text for the three.

Lightroom would make that work much simpler for you. Most importantly 
Lightroom is also availaible as a non-subscription edition.

> No, not full time, but multiple hours most days.  Next month I'll have 
> a shorter but intensive session
> after a short excursion. There's unlikely to be anything similar after
> that for months.

I suggest that you still consider buying, not subscribing to Lightroom, 
and take a look at Pixelmator.

<http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-65237578-Photoshop-Lightroom-6/dp/B00VWCKJVA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1434644978&sr=8-1&keywords=lightroom+6>
or
<http://tinyurl.com/qjaetfd>

...and
<http://www.pixelmator.com/mac/>

-- 


Regards,

Savageduck

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#76843

In article <2015061809325745035-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom>,
 Savageduck <savageduck1@(REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:

> I suggest that you still consider buying, not subscribing to Lightroom, 
> and take a look at Pixelmator.

I just did that and it looks very promising.  It may do what I need 
done.  I hadn't looked closely at it before, possibly because I was 
getting strong recommendations for other things.  It has a good tech 
specs list.  

First I have to fire up the new laptop and download it there.  I'm still 
reading newsgroups only on iPad and SnowLeopard.

-- 
Erilar, biblioholic medievalist

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#76809 — And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo)

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On Thursday, 18 June 2015 09:44 -0500, 
 in article <drache-597772.09441618062015@88-209-239-213.giganet.hu>, 
 erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> wrote:

> I'm not totally resistant to change, but am a stubborn adherent of 
> the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" school. I've had far more bad 
> than good experiences with "up"grades in the past.  Whatever 
> "improvements" are added, fine detail control is removed in favor of 
> some new "foolproof" version full of preset categories which replace 
> detailed control.

Perhaps you, and hence others, have approached the problems you're 
encountering from the wrong perspective.  Prior to your most recent 
trip, when you'd just started using your new computer and couldn't 
understand why things weren't somehow placed where you expected them 
to be, it was asked whether you migrated your files, libraries, 
application (which operate on the current OS) and the like, from you 
older computer; an automated system migration.  At that time, you 
chose not to do the migration; a migration which might have saved you 
much angst and anxiety.

Most recently you've stated that both computers are connected, in some 
unspecified way, to the same AirPort Time Capsule, which hopefully you 
are using to back up both machines.  That this is now known is a step 
forward.  That both machines have current backups is exceedingly 
important, at all times.

You'll want to connect the new computer directly to your Time Capsule.  
This may require the purchase of a special cable or adaptor, but what 
ever that may cost, it is more than worth the cost in the time and 
energy you'll save in getting back on track.  This should allow your 
new computer to mount the AirPort Time Capsule's hard drive, as if it 
were an ordinary outboard device.  As you've never mentioned the 
specific model your new Mac is, only you know exactly what connectors 
are available, with which you can connect to what I presume is your 
Time Capsule's USB2 port.

When the AirPort Time Capsule is mounted, you should be able to browse 
it from the Desktop.  You should find two different .sparsebundle 
files, one for each of your computers.  If there's only one, go no 
further, until you confirm it is the backup of your old laptop.  

Let me propose that you do a clean installation of Yosemite, by 
booting to the recovery partition on your new machine.  When the 
installation completes, it will take you through a handful of simple 
steps, prior to offering you the option to migrate from a time machine 
backup.  By selecting the most recent backup of the old computer, and 
performing the migration from it, all of the things you do want on the 
new computer will be there, when you need them.  This should, for 
example, alleviate the issues you're having with your iTunes and 
Photos libraries.  All you albums and groupings will remain arranged 
as they are on your old laptop.

After successfully completing the system migration, be sure to check 
the App Store, for anything you may have added previously, so they can 
be reinstalled.  The same can be done for any files you've created on 
the new Mac, which do not exist on the old one, restoring those files 
from its TimeMachine backup.

<https://support.apple.com/kb/PH18869>

Of course, you may end up copying files you no longer want hanging 
around.  It's far better to deal with the clean up of these after the 
migration, than to try to copy things in the wholly piecemeal fashion 
you're using now.  For example, it's unlikely you'll ever locate all 
hidden files and directories, which may end up making your life just 
that much less complex.

When the vast majority of Mac purchasers, who have been using older 
machines, Mac of Windows, migrate their old setup to the new machine.  
While I'm unclear on your reasons for not doing so are unclear to me, 
it's not too late to give it a shot.

With the the new machine connected directly to your Time Capsule, you 
may even be able to run /Applications/Utilities/Migration\ Assistant, 
without erasing your Yosemite installation.  This will manage to keep 
the newest version of any files which exist on both the Yosemite HD 
and in the old laptop's backup.

<https://support.apple.com/kb/PH18870>

Do note, Michelle started a new thread, yesterday regarding her spiffy 
new 27" Retina Display iMac (I am SO jealous!) and migrating from the 
old one.  If, as is said in the thread, that attempting a migration 
over Ethernet is an iffy proposition, rife with pitfalls, multiply by 
at least an order of magnitude, if you're thinking of attempting a 
migration over your WiFi network.

Later, you may want to consider file sharing between your two Macs, 
over your local network.  This would allow you to easily transfer 
files directly, rather than copy them from your backups.

-- 
David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com>
 Be kind to animals; kiss a shark.

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#76946 — Re: And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo)

In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1506181634220.67381@mako.ath.cx>,
 David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
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> NotDashEscaped: You need GnuPG to verify this message
> 
> On Thursday, 18 June 2015 09:44 -0500, 
>  in article <drache-597772.09441618062015@88-209-239-213.giganet.hu>, 
>  erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> wrote:
> 
> > I'm not totally resistant to change, but am a stubborn adherent of 
> > the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" school. I've had far more bad 
> > than good experiences with "up"grades in the past.  Whatever 
> > "improvements" are added, fine detail control is removed in favor of 
> > some new "foolproof" version full of preset categories which replace 
> > detailed control.
> 
> Perhaps you, and hence others, have approached the problems you're 
> encountering from the wrong perspective.  Prior to your most recent 
> trip, when you'd just started using your new computer and couldn't 
> understand why things weren't somehow placed where you expected them 
> to be, it was asked whether you migrated your files, libraries, 
> application (which operate on the current OS) and the like, from you 
> older computer; an automated system migration.  At that time, you 
> chose not to do the migration; a migration which might have saved you 
> much angst and anxiety.

Everything WAS migrated from the old machine to the new one. Some 
software doesn't exist at all in Yosemite. Some is grabbed and opened by 
a Yosemite version, after which I'm stuck with it, whether I like it or 
not.
> 
> Most recently you've stated that both computers are connected, in some 
> unspecified way, to the same AirPort Time Capsule, which hopefully you 
> are using to back up both machines.  That this is now known is a step 
> forward.  That both machines have current backups is exceedingly 
> important, at all times.

I have a home network. Time Capsule and printer are connected to both 
old and new laptops wirelessly. Only the power supply has a wired 
connection. I have a data file on the Time Capsule with foto and data 
files I don't want altered. Digging things out of backups is too 
irritating for anything small.

> Later, you may want to consider file sharing between your two Macs, 
> over your local network. 

They are connected and have been all along via Time Capsule's data file. 
Transferring is not the problem. Finding substitutions for software that 
can't be used with Yosemite, which I don't believe I will ever actually 
LIKE, is the main problem.  I prefer a calculous approach(fine control 
of detail) to basic arithmetic (set packets rather than fine detail 
control)  ClarisWorks 4 vs Pages

I am not as computer illiterate as many claim, but I'm very stubborn 8-)

-- 
Erilar, biblioholic medievalist

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#76948 — Re: And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo)

In article <drache-054906.10461622062015@88-209-239-213.giganet.hu>,
erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> wrote:

>Everything WAS migrated from the old machine to the new one. Some 
>software doesn't exist at all in Yosemite.

Such as?

>Some is grabbed and opened by a Yosemite version, after which I'm
>stuck with it, whether I like it or not.

I assume by "Some is grabbed", you mean "Some files/pictures/photos [1]
are grabbed". Is this the case?

If you *are* referring to files/pictures/photos [1], then to open with
the application you want it to be opened with, you right-click on the
file/pictures/photo [1], select "Get Info" and then in the "Open with"
section choose the application you want to open the file with. Once you
have selected one you can click "Change all" to make sure that all your
files/pictures/photos [1] get opened with that application in future.

[1] Delete as appropriate

-- 
"If you're not able to ask questions and deal with the answers without feeling 
that someone has called your intelligence or competence into question, don't 
ask questions on Usenet where the answers won't be carefully tailored to avoid
tripping your hair-trigger insecurities."                  - D M Procida, UCSM

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#76951 — Re: And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo)

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
NotDashEscaped: You need GnuPG to verify this message

On Monday, 22 June 2015 10:46 -0500, 
 in article <drache-054906.10461622062015@88-209-239-213.giganet.hu>, 
 erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> wrote:

> In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1506181634220.67381@mako.ath.cx>,
>  David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

>> On Thursday, 18 June 2015 09:44 -0500, 
>>  in article <drache-597772.09441618062015@88-209-239-213.giganet.hu>, 
>>  erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> wrote:

>>> I'm not totally resistant to change, but am a stubborn adherent of 
>>> the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" school. I've had far more 
>>> bad than good experiences with "up"grades in the past.  Whatever 
>>> "improvements" are added, fine detail control is removed in favor 
>>> of some new "foolproof" version full of preset categories which 
>>> replace detailed control.

>> Perhaps you, and hence others, have approached the problems you're 
>> encountering from the wrong perspective.  Prior to your most recent 
>> trip, when you'd just started using your new computer and couldn't 
>> understand why things weren't somehow placed where you expected 
>> them to be, it was asked whether you migrated your files, 
>> libraries, application (which operate on the current OS) and the 
>> like, from you older computer; an automated system migration.  At 
>> that time, you chose not to do the migration; a migration which 
>> might have saved you much angst and anxiety.

> Everything WAS migrated from the old machine to the new one.

Well, that's the first time you've made this claim.  It seems false, 
on its face.  Had a _proper_ migration been done, the fist time you 
booted the new laptop, you wouldn't still be manually copying items, 
such as you iPhotos, iBooks and iTunes libraries, from a backup of 
your old laptop.  These specific items, as well as items from /Library 
and ~/Library, such as Application Support and Preferences, would have 
been in place, the very first time you began using the new machine.

That they were not in place, when you first began using the new 
machine, is an indication that no such system migration ever took 
place.  Whatever you're calling a migration isn't the type of 
migration that the operating system provides, prior to your very first 
login, prior to any system configuration, other than selecting a 
language and location.  A system migration take place prior to 
establishing your user account.  Your user account is established, as 
part of the migration(!).

There's still time to perform a migration, before things get even more 
bollixed up, than they already are.

Many, if not most of the problems you're encountering can be traced 
directly to the failure to perform this system migration.

> Some software doesn't exist at all in Yosemite.

MT-NewsWatcher, which hasn't seen an update since roughly 2008, 
didn't run under OS X 10.9.x, either.  The same it true of Color It!, 
except OS 10.6.8 was the last version of OS X, under which it would 
run.

Changes were made to the operation system, to allow machines using 
newer chipsets to perform more efficiently, than they could otherwise.  
It's not as though Apple dropped support for these application; rather 
it is the developers who did not support their software, for a newer 
generation of chipsets and operating systems.

> Some is grabbed and opened by a Yosemite version, after which I'm 
> stuck with it, whether I like it or not.

Let me see.  You're still whining that Photos converted your iPhoto 
Library, the first time you opened Rosetta.app.  It's been repeatedly 
pointed out to you, that you can continue using iPhotos, as you have 
in the past, by simply selecting 

     ~/Pictures/Photos\ Library.photoslibrary

as the location of your iPhoto Library, assuming you've updated 
iPhotos via the App Store.  Do realize, Apple could drop support for 
iPhotos, when moving beyond OS X 10.10.3.  You may not know, unless 
you keep abreast of changes to upcoming versions of OS X.  It may be a 
few years off, but it's sure to happen.  It's best were you to try to 
get a handle on its replacement, Photos, without expecting it to 
behave exactly as iPhoto did, under Snow Leopard.

Had you performed the System Migration, your iBooks should be available 
to you, in the stand-alone iBooks application, which was introduced in 
OS X 10.10.  The same is true of iTunes, which you mentioned once and 
dropped.

>> Most recently you've stated that both computers are connected, in 
>> some unspecified way, to the same AirPort Time Capsule, which 
>> hopefully you are using to back up both machines.  That this is now 
>> known is a step forward.  That both machines have current backups 
>> is exceedingly important, at all times.

> I have a home network. Time Capsule and printer are connected to 
> both old and new laptops wirelessly. Only the power supply has a 
> wired connection. I have a data file on the Time Capsule with foto 
> and data files I don't want altered. Digging things out of backups 
> is too irritating for anything small.

>> Later, you may want to consider file sharing between your two Macs, 
>> over your local network. 

Are you aware that you can connect the new (still unspecified) laptop, 
to the old (still unspecified) laptop, without having anything to do 
with your AirPort Time Capsule Time Machine backups.

> They are connected and have been all along via Time Capsule's data file.

In other words, they're not configured to share files, over you local 
network.  Do note, the machines have the ability to share files and 
data, over your LAN.  All you need to do is configure them to do so.

> Transferring is not the problem. Finding substitutions for software 
> that can't be used with Yosemite, which I don't believe I will ever 
> actually LIKE, is the main problem.

MT-NewsWatcher didn't make it this far; it failed to operate on later 
OS X release, after Apple discontinued the Rosetta compatibility 
library, which allowed PowerPC applications to run on Intel boxes.  
While it's a better than average news client application, its closest 
'living' relative, Brian Clark's Thoth, is apparently no longer 
supported by its author, as of 2013.  This means while you may be able 
to download it, you may not be able to register it or get a 
registration key.  (Thoth is a direct descendent of Brian's Yet 
Another NewsWatcher.)

Others have suggested Unison (paid), HogWasher (paid), MacSoup (paid) 
and Thunderbird (free), none of which even vaguely resemble 
NewsWatcher derived applications.  Still, these GUI agents work well 
for many users.

> I prefer a calculous approach(fine control of detail) to basic 
> arithmetic (set packets rather than fine detail control)  
> ClarisWorks 4 vs Pages

You're quite right, however ClarisWorks never made it to OS X and 
AppleWorks was declared EOL, by Apple, in August 2007, about eight 
years ago.

There are work processors, other than Pages, including the NeoOffice 
suite, available as freeware at 
<https://www.neooffice.org/neojava/en/index.php>, or via the App 
Store, for 29.95.  You'll never know whether you like it, if you don't 
try it.  It may have some advantage, as NeoOffice versions which run 
under OS X 10.6.x, are available from NeoOffice.

Plugging 'word processor' into the App Store produces plenty of 
choices.

> I am not as computer illiterate as many claim, but I'm very stubborn 
> 8-)

Do you mean you are inflexible, unwilling to adopt new technology and 
resistant to change?  There's a difference.

Remember, Apple didn't drop any of your applications, that I'm aware 
of, in their Yosemite release.  They were dropped by their developers, 
who appear to be disinterested in putting in the work required to make 
them run under current releases of OS X, prior to the release of 
OS X 10.9.x Mavericks.

Also recall, OS X 10.6.x became unsupported, 26 February 2014, and 
last received a security update in September, 2013.  All the wishing 
in the world isn't going to revive it.

-- 
David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com>
 Time waits for no (wo)man.

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#76957 — Re: And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo)

In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1506221433570.67381@mako.ath.cx>, David
Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

>MT-NewsWatcher didn't make it this far; it failed to operate on later 
>OS X release, after Apple discontinued the Rosetta compatibility 
>library, which allowed PowerPC applications to run on Intel boxes.  

Not to do with Rosetta. It was to do with a library/framework/API which
is no longer provided, can't remember which.

-- 
"People don't buy Microsoft for quality, they buy it for compatibility
with what Bob in accounting bought last year. Trace it back - they buy
Microsoft because the IBM Selectric didn't suck much" - P Seebach, afc

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#76958 — Re: And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo)

In article <230620150935493642%timstreater@greenbee.net>, Tim Streater
<timstreater@greenbee.net> wrote:

> >MT-NewsWatcher didn't make it this far; it failed to operate on later 
> >OS X release, after Apple discontinued the Rosetta compatibility 
> >library, which allowed PowerPC applications to run on Intel boxes.  
> 
> Not to do with Rosetta. It was to do with a library/framework/API which
> is no longer provided, can't remember which.

open transport.

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#76974 — Re: And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo)

In article <230620151102088135%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
 nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <230620150935493642%timstreater@greenbee.net>, Tim Streater
> <timstreater@greenbee.net> wrote:
> 
> > >MT-NewsWatcher didn't make it this far; it failed to operate on later 
> > >OS X release, after Apple discontinued the Rosetta compatibility 
> > >library, which allowed PowerPC applications to run on Intel boxes.  
> > 
> > Not to do with Rosetta. It was to do with a library/framework/API which
> > is no longer provided, can't remember which.
> 
> open transport.

That's the message I got for something. It was probably when I tried to 
open it in Yosemite 8-)

-- 
Erilar, biblioholic medievalist

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#76973 — Re: And Now For Something Completely Different (Re: iPhoto vs Photo)

In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1506221433570.67381@mako.ath.cx>,
 David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> NotDashEscaped: You need GnuPG to verify this message
> 
> On Monday, 22 June 2015 10:46 -0500, 
>  in article <drache-054906.10461622062015@88-209-239-213.giganet.hu>, 
>  erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> wrote:
> 
> > In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1506181634220.67381@mako.ath.cx>,
> >  David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:
> 
> >> On Thursday, 18 June 2015 09:44 -0500, 
> >>  in article <drache-597772.09441618062015@88-209-239-213.giganet.hu>, 
> >>  erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> wrote:
> 
> >>> I'm not totally resistant to change, but am a stubborn adherent of 
> >>> the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" school. I've had far more 
> >>> bad than good experiences with "up"grades in the past.  Whatever 
> >>> "improvements" are added, fine detail control is removed in favor 
> >>> of some new "foolproof" version full of preset categories which 
> >>> replace detailed control.
> 
> >> Perhaps you, and hence others, have approached the problems you're 
> >> encountering from the wrong perspective.  Prior to your most recent 
> >> trip, when you'd just started using your new computer and couldn't 
> >> understand why things weren't somehow placed where you expected 
> >> them to be, it was asked whether you migrated your files, 
> >> libraries, application (which operate on the current OS) and the 
> >> like, from you older computer; an automated system migration.  At 
> >> that time, you chose not to do the migration; a migration which 
> >> might have saved you much angst and anxiety.
> 
> > Everything WAS migrated from the old machine to the new one.
> 
> Well, that's the first time you've made this claim.  It seems false, 
> on its face.  Had a _proper_ migration been done, the fist time you 
> booted the new laptop, you wouldn't still be manually copying items, 
> such as you iPhotos, iBooks and iTunes libraries, from a backup of 
> your old laptop.  These specific items, as well as items from /Library 
> and ~/Library, such as Application Support and Preferences, would have 
> been in place, the very first time you began using the new machine.
> 
> That they were not in place, when you first began using the new 
> machine, is an indication that no such system migration ever took 
> place.  Whatever you're calling a migration isn't the type of 
> migration that the operating system provides, prior to your very first 
> login, prior to any system configuration, other than selecting a 
> language and location.  A system migration take place prior to 
> establishing your user account.  Your user account is established, as 
> part of the migration(!).

Being in place, which they were , is not = usable.
> 
> There's still time to perform a migration, before things get even more 
> bollixed up, than they already are.
> 
> Many, if not most of the problems you're encountering can be traced 
> directly to the failure to perform this system migration.

It was done. There is no point in doing it over.
> 
> > Some software doesn't exist at all in Yosemite.
> 
> MT-NewsWatcher, which hasn't seen an update since roughly 2008, 
> didn't run under OS X 10.9.x, either.  The same it true of Color It!, 
> except OS 10.6.8 was the last version of OS X, under which it would 
> run.
 I know that, which is why I'm still using them on the old laptop.
 
> Changes were made to the operation system, to allow machines using 
> newer chipsets to perform more efficiently, than they could otherwise.  
> It's not as though Apple dropped support for these application; rather 
> it is the developers who did not support their software, for a newer 
> generation of chipsets and operating systems.
> 
> > Some is grabbed and opened by a Yosemite version, after which I'm 
> > stuck with it, whether I like it or not.
> 
> Let me see.  You're still whining that Photos converted your iPhoto 
> Library, the first time you opened Rosetta.app.  It's been repeatedly 
> pointed out to you, that you can continue using iPhotos, as you have 
> in the past, by simply selecting 
> 
>      ~/Pictures/Photos\ Library.photoslibrary
> 
> as the location of your iPhoto Library, assuming you've updated 
> iPhotos via the App Store.  Do realize, Apple could drop support for 
> iPhotos, when moving beyond OS X 10.10.3.  You may not know, unless 
> you keep abreast of changes to upcoming versions of OS X.  It may be a 
> few years off, but it's sure to happen.  It's best were you to try to 
> get a handle on its replacement, Photos, without expecting it to 
> behave exactly as iPhoto did, under Snow Leopard.
> 
> Had you performed the System Migration, your iBooks should be available 
> to you, in the stand-alone iBooks application, which was introduced in 
> OS X 10.10.  The same is true of iTunes, which you mentioned once and 
> dropped.

I finally opened it and let it do its worst. It totally destroyed my 
categories, added all the things I had turned off so that I can't even 
separate read from unread books, and when I began trying to sort them 
with clues wiped out, I realized I have to do it book by book with the 
iPad propped up next to it to reestablish my categories including one 
labelled "Off" because there seems to be no other place I can now put 
them. I have more important things to do at the moment.

> 
> > I have a home network. Time Capsule and printer are connected to 
> > both old and new laptops wirelessly. Only the power supply has a 
> > wired connection. I have a data file on the Time Capsule with foto 
> > and data files I don't want altered. Digging things out of backups 
> > is too irritating for anything small.
> 
> >> Later, you may want to consider file sharing between your two Macs, 
> >> over your local network. 
> 
> Are you aware that you can connect the new (still unspecified) laptop, 
> to the old (still unspecified) laptop, without having anything to do 
> with your AirPort Time Capsule Time Machine backups.
> 
> > They are connected and have been all along via Time Capsule's data file.
> 
> In other words, they're not configured to share files, over you local 
> network.  Do note, the machines have the ability to share files and 
> data, over your LAN.  All you need to do is configure them to do so.

The files that were on the old laptop are on the new one. Many are 
twisted  by Yosemite, others ignored.
I repeat:
> > Transferring is not the problem. Finding substitutions for software 
> > that can't be used with Yosemite, which I don't believe I will ever 
> > actually LIKE, is the main problem.
> 
> MT-NewsWatcher didn't make it this far; it failed to operate on later 
> OS X release,

I know that. Since I'm still using the old laptop for a couple other 
software programs, I am leaving that for later. 
> 
> Others have suggested Unison (paid), HogWasher (paid), MacSoup (paid) 
> and Thunderbird (free), none of which even vaguely resemble 
> NewsWatcher derived applications.  Still, these GUI agents work well 
> for many users.

Later

> > I prefer a calculous approach(fine control of detail) to basic 
> > arithmetic (set packets rather than fine detail control)  
> > ClarisWorks 4 vs Pages
> 
> You're quite right, however ClarisWorks never made it to OS X and 
> AppleWorks was declared EOL, by Apple, in August 2007, about eight 
> years ago.

I know that. I was offering the comparison between ClarisWorks 4 and 
Pages as an illustration of calculus vs. simple grade-school arithmetic.

> There are work processors, other than Pages,

I'm using Pages for iPad, so I keep using it on the laptops.  Using, not 
particularly liking.
> 
> > I am not as computer illiterate as many claim, but I'm very stubborn 
> > 8-)
> 
> Do you mean you are inflexible, unwilling to adopt new technology and 
> resistant to change?  There's a difference.

And some people adopt new software before it's even debugged. There's a 
difference there, too.
> 
> Remember, Apple didn't drop any of your applications, that I'm aware 
> of, in their Yosemite release.  They were dropped by their developers, 
> who appear to be disinterested in putting in the work required to make 
> them run under current releases of OS X, prior to the release of 
> OS X 10.9.x Mavericks.
> 
> Also recall, OS X 10.6.x became unsupported, 26 February 2014, and 
> last received a security update in September, 2013.  All the wishing 
> in the world isn't going to revive it.

But it is possible to use it without updates past that date. 8-)

-- 
Erilar, biblioholic medievalist

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#77001 — Re: And Now For Something Completely Different

Sometimes I discover how to do something people have been telling me to 
try that I haven't gotten around to while trying to do something else 
altogether.

I was looking for something on this old laptop and the whole folder was 
missing.  Over to new one whence everything (whether it was going to 
work or not) had been migrated back when I bought it.  With everything 
running at once, I did more poking around than I had before, got the 
laptops connected directly before I even realized I was doing it, and 
copied the folder back over here, where it originated.  Yes, I know I'd 
been told I should be able to, but it wasn't that high up in my 
priorities.

If I ever get caught up on enough of my non-computer projects, I may yet 
get back to the many posts I have saved telling me how to sort out the 
rest of the "up"grade hassles.  I do appreciate all the advice everyone 
has been offering me even if I do get grumpy. I need more rest than I 
did when I was a young whipper-snapper in my early 70's.

-- 
Erilar, biblioholic medievalist

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#77002 — Re: And Now For Something Completely Different

In article <drache-9A19B5.15251624062015@88-209-239-213.giganet.hu>,
erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> wrote:

>I do appreciate all the advice everyone 
>has been offering me even if I do get grumpy. I need more rest than I 
>did when I was a young whipper-snapper in my early 70's.

Hah! Good news. Yes, I know what you mean :-)

-- 
"The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English
is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words; on occasion,
English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious 
and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary."            -- James Nicoll, rasfw

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