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Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones

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  Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Slimer <.m@nsn.s> - 2016-01-19 15:35 -0500
    Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2016-01-19 21:21 +0000
      Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Slimer <.m@nsn.s> - 2016-01-19 16:59 -0500
        Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2016-01-20 00:10 +0000
          Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Takuya Saitoh <taka0038@gmail.com> - 2016-01-19 16:53 -0800
          Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Slimer <.m@nsn.s> - 2016-01-19 20:02 -0500
            Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2016-01-20 01:37 +0000
              Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Slimer <.m@nsn.s> - 2016-01-19 20:56 -0500
              Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-01-19 23:49 -0500
                Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2016-01-20 14:54 +0000
                  Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-01-20 16:24 -0500
                    Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2016-01-20 22:08 +0000
              Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-01-19 23:49 -0500
                Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Slimer <.m@nsn.s> - 2016-01-20 09:33 -0500
                  Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-01-20 16:40 -0500
                    Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2016-01-20 22:45 +0100
                      Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-01-21 18:27 -0500
                        Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2016-01-22 00:58 +0100
                          Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Slimer <.m@nsn.s> - 2016-01-21 19:56 -0500
                          Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2016-01-22 06:46 -0600
                            Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-01-22 08:42 -0500
                            Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-01-22 15:36 -0700
                Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2016-01-20 14:55 +0000
                Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones "Ezekiel" <zeke@nosuchemail.com> - 2016-01-20 15:04 -0500
                  Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-01-21 18:28 -0500
      Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> - 2016-01-20 09:43 +0000
        Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2016-01-20 15:01 +0000
          Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Slimer <.m@nsn.s> - 2016-01-20 10:32 -0500
            Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2016-01-20 15:48 +0000
              Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Slimer <.m@nsn.s> - 2016-01-20 13:05 -0500
                Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2016-01-20 19:10 +0000
                  Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Slimer <.m@nsn.s> - 2016-01-20 15:56 -0500
                    Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2016-01-20 21:20 +0000
                      Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Slimer <.m@nsn.s> - 2016-01-20 17:45 -0500
                        Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2016-01-21 08:51 +0000
                          Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones Slimer <.m@nsn.s> - 2016-01-21 09:42 -0500
              Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-01-20 16:24 -0500
                Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2016-01-20 22:00 +0000
                  Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-01-21 00:46 -0500
                    Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2016-01-21 00:57 +0000
                      Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-01-21 12:16 -0500
                        Re: Linux bug imperils tens of millions of PCs, servers, and Android phones owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2016-01-21 18:56 +0000

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#341352

On 1/22/2016 7:46 AM, shitv wrote:

> "Hey, we don't call it Apelanta for nothing.  If you're coming here, I
> apologize in advance if any screeching jigs make your visit
> unpleasant."  -  "DFS"


Dey've been on a tear recently (well, for decades), murdering in large 
numbers, lots of carjackings, armed robbery, car theft, etc.

6th most dangerous city in the US, according to Forbes.

So come on down to Apelanta for a visit, turd.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341403

On 01/22/16 05:46, chrisv wrote:
> Melzzzzz wrote:
>
>> (friendly chit-chat with shitty bastard "DFS", snipped)
>
Too fucking bad, eh Turdv?

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341140

DFS <nospam@dfs.com> wrote:
> On 1/19/2016 8:37 PM, owl wrote:
> 
>> I don't have the passion I used to have for computers.
> 
> 
> I'm in the middle of doing some hardware upgrades.  I've resisted buying 
> anything new for so long that I'm a little stoked.
> 
> 
> new 256GB SSD  (Christmas gift)
> new GTX 750 Ti video card  ($105)
> 4GB more RAM  ($20)
> new heat sink/fan for CPU  ($20)
> 
> 
> Maybe you need some new gear to get that inner geek excited... or a 
> dozen crullers.
> 

Maybe.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341176

"DFS" <nospam@dfs.com> wrote in message news:n7n3g5$rk3$5@dont-email.me...
> On 1/19/2016 8:37 PM, owl wrote:
>
>> I don't have the passion I used to have for computers.
>

In the general sense I don't have the same passion either. Long time ago it 
was all new and exciting but after doing it as /work/ for all these years a 
lot of the newness and excitement has worn off.

There are some (work) projects that are still fun and exciting to work on. 
Home projects are mostly fun/interesting since I get to pick and choose 
exactly what I'm going to do. But a lot of things aren't as exciting as they 
once were.

>
> I'm in the middle of doing some hardware upgrades.  I've resisted buying 
> anything new for so long that I'm a little stoked.
>
>
> new 256GB SSD  (Christmas gift)
> new GTX 750 Ti video card  ($105)
> 4GB more RAM  ($20)
> new heat sink/fan for CPU  ($20)
>
>
> Maybe you need some new gear to get that inner geek excited... or a dozen 
> crullers.
>

New hardware is fun, for a short time. Last year I got a new SSD and a huge 
monitor. It was a fun in the sense that it was different from what I had 
before. But it didn't take long to get used to the new hardware and 
excitement-wise, I'm pretty much back to where I was before.

-- 
We know Photoshop is sold for around $700.00. By cost comparison Photoshop 
should be 70,000 times better than GIMP, which it clearly is not. As anyone 
can see GIMP is the clear winner.

Business classes for me you say! I don't need them, my wife has been 
operating a private business for about 20 years now. I do all the financial 
side of it and up to par on those type of things.

An attempt at a "cost analysis" from sbd.
<lvnu8i$qvj$1@dont-email.me>

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341290

On 1/20/2016 3:04 PM, Ezekiel wrote:

> New hardware is fun, for a short time. Last year I got a new SSD and a huge
> monitor. It was a fun in the sense that it was different from what I had
> before. But it didn't take long to get used to the new hardware and
> excitement-wise, I'm pretty much back to where I was before.


Yeah, it's easy to get used to the new speeds and capabilities.  Speed 
especially.

What's nice is computer stuff is so inexpensive.  You can even get a 
decent ViewSonic 28" monitor for as low as $180.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341125

On 19/01/2016 21:21, owl wrote:
> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>> ROFL! It's in the kernel too. "The flaw, which was introduced into the
>> Linux kernel in version 3.8 released in early 2013, resides in the OS
>> keyring." Looks like your toiletware is ONCE MORE the source of security
>> problems.
>>
>> <http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/01/linux-bug-imperils-tens-of-millions-of-pcs-servers-and-android-phones/>
>>
>
> Shit happens.  Good thing I don't have to wait until "Patch Tuesday" and
> then fight a hostile upgrade attempt just to patch a security vuln.

And in the real world of managed IT services, patches are pre-vetted and 
rolled out to different customers on different days.

Non-problem.

Meanwhile, many, many many, Android phones are being used unpatched and 
insecure.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341141

Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
> On 19/01/2016 21:21, owl wrote:
>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>> ROFL! It's in the kernel too. "The flaw, which was introduced into the
>>> Linux kernel in version 3.8 released in early 2013, resides in the OS
>>> keyring." Looks like your toiletware is ONCE MORE the source of security
>>> problems.
>>>
>>> <http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/01/linux-bug-imperils-tens-of-millions-of-pcs-servers-and-android-phones/>
>>>
>>
>> Shit happens.  Good thing I don't have to wait until "Patch Tuesday" and
>> then fight a hostile upgrade attempt just to patch a security vuln.
> 
> And in the real world of managed IT services, patches are pre-vetted and 
> rolled out to different customers on different days.
> 
> Non-problem.
> 

I would guess that the vast majority of Microsoft's customers -- consumer
and small business -- don't make use of managed IT services and are left
to fend for themselves.  Also didn't I read that MS is going to start
pushing W10 upgrades onto the corporate scene also?  I have to laugh
these days (since W8 introduction) at the idea of Windows in the business
world.  What business wants a cell phone interface on their desktop
computers?  What exactly is the purpose of that?

> Meanwhile, many, many many, Android phones are being used unpatched and 
> insecure.

I don't care.  I don't use a smart phone.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341148

On 2016-01-20 10:01 AM, owl wrote:
> Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>> On 19/01/2016 21:21, owl wrote:
>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>> ROFL! It's in the kernel too. "The flaw, which was introduced into the
>>>> Linux kernel in version 3.8 released in early 2013, resides in the OS
>>>> keyring." Looks like your toiletware is ONCE MORE the source of security
>>>> problems.
>>>>
>>>> <http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/01/linux-bug-imperils-tens-of-millions-of-pcs-servers-and-android-phones/>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Shit happens.  Good thing I don't have to wait until "Patch Tuesday" and
>>> then fight a hostile upgrade attempt just to patch a security vuln.
>>
>> And in the real world of managed IT services, patches are pre-vetted and 
>> rolled out to different customers on different days.
>>
>> Non-problem.
>>
> 
> I would guess that the vast majority of Microsoft's customers -- consumer
> and small business -- don't make use of managed IT services and are left
> to fend for themselves.  Also didn't I read that MS is going to start
> pushing W10 upgrades onto the corporate scene also?  I have to laugh
> these days (since W8 introduction) at the idea of Windows in the business
> world.  What business wants a cell phone interface on their desktop
> computers?  What exactly is the purpose of that?

I wonder how Windows 10's interface resembles that of a cell phone.
Windows 8 sure, but 8.1 and 10 no longer have such a thing.

>> Meanwhile, many, many many, Android phones are being used unpatched and 
>> insecure.
> 
> I don't care.  I don't use a smart phone.

Smart guy.

-- 
Slimer
EFF & OpenMedia member / IFAW, Mozilla & PETA supporter
"Everything seems to work fine, except that occasionally everything
freezes." - Another one of GNU/Linux's many victims
"Sound wasn't even a gauranteed thing on a PC in the 90s." - Linux
apologist JEDIDIAH explaining why sound never worked/works right in Linux

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341151

Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
> On 2016-01-20 10:01 AM, owl wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>> On 19/01/2016 21:21, owl wrote:
>>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>>> ROFL! It's in the kernel too. "The flaw, which was introduced into the
>>>>> Linux kernel in version 3.8 released in early 2013, resides in the OS
>>>>> keyring." Looks like your toiletware is ONCE MORE the source of security
>>>>> problems.
>>>>>
>>>>> <http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/01/linux-bug-imperils-tens-of-millions-of-pcs-servers-and-android-phones/>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Shit happens.  Good thing I don't have to wait until "Patch Tuesday" and
>>>> then fight a hostile upgrade attempt just to patch a security vuln.
>>>
>>> And in the real world of managed IT services, patches are pre-vetted and 
>>> rolled out to different customers on different days.
>>>
>>> Non-problem.
>>>
>> 
>> I would guess that the vast majority of Microsoft's customers -- consumer
>> and small business -- don't make use of managed IT services and are left
>> to fend for themselves.  Also didn't I read that MS is going to start
>> pushing W10 upgrades onto the corporate scene also?  I have to laugh
>> these days (since W8 introduction) at the idea of Windows in the business
>> world.  What business wants a cell phone interface on their desktop
>> computers?  What exactly is the purpose of that?
> 
> I wonder how Windows 10's interface resembles that of a cell phone.
> Windows 8 sure, but 8.1 and 10 no longer have such a thing.
> 

The live tiles are in the menu now.  And that ridiculous alphbetically
sorted menu list is nearly useless.

>>> Meanwhile, many, many many, Android phones are being used unpatched and 
>>> insecure.
>> 
>> I don't care.  I don't use a smart phone.
> 
> Smart guy.
> 

Yeah.  My holster is for a gun. 
 

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341163

On 2016-01-20 10:48 AM, owl wrote:
> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>> On 2016-01-20 10:01 AM, owl wrote:
>>> Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>> On 19/01/2016 21:21, owl wrote:
>>>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>>>> ROFL! It's in the kernel too. "The flaw, which was introduced into the
>>>>>> Linux kernel in version 3.8 released in early 2013, resides in the OS
>>>>>> keyring." Looks like your toiletware is ONCE MORE the source of security
>>>>>> problems.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/01/linux-bug-imperils-tens-of-millions-of-pcs-servers-and-android-phones/>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Shit happens.  Good thing I don't have to wait until "Patch Tuesday" and
>>>>> then fight a hostile upgrade attempt just to patch a security vuln.
>>>>
>>>> And in the real world of managed IT services, patches are pre-vetted and 
>>>> rolled out to different customers on different days.
>>>>
>>>> Non-problem.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I would guess that the vast majority of Microsoft's customers -- consumer
>>> and small business -- don't make use of managed IT services and are left
>>> to fend for themselves.  Also didn't I read that MS is going to start
>>> pushing W10 upgrades onto the corporate scene also?  I have to laugh
>>> these days (since W8 introduction) at the idea of Windows in the business
>>> world.  What business wants a cell phone interface on their desktop
>>> computers?  What exactly is the purpose of that?
>>
>> I wonder how Windows 10's interface resembles that of a cell phone.
>> Windows 8 sure, but 8.1 and 10 no longer have such a thing.
>>
> 
> The live tiles are in the menu now.  And that ridiculous alphbetically
> sorted menu list is nearly useless.

In the Start Menu, they're essentially out of the way and they are
easily removed even from there. A person looking to have a
traditional-looking Start Menu can have one with very little effort.

>>>> Meanwhile, many, many many, Android phones are being used unpatched and 
>>>> insecure.
>>>
>>> I don't care.  I don't use a smart phone.
>>
>> Smart guy.
>>
> 
> Yeah.  My holster is for a gun. 

And the bullet a welcome gift to one of the many "refugees."

-- 
Slimer
EFF & OpenMedia member / IFAW, Mozilla & PETA supporter
"Everything seems to work fine, except that occasionally everything
freezes." - Another one of GNU/Linux's many victims
"Sound wasn't even a gauranteed thing on a PC in the 90s." - Linux
apologist JEDIDIAH explaining why sound never worked/works right in Linux

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341173

Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
> On 2016-01-20 10:48 AM, owl wrote:
>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>> On 2016-01-20 10:01 AM, owl wrote:
>>>> Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 19/01/2016 21:21, owl wrote:
>>>>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>>>>> ROFL! It's in the kernel too. "The flaw, which was introduced into the
>>>>>>> Linux kernel in version 3.8 released in early 2013, resides in the OS
>>>>>>> keyring." Looks like your toiletware is ONCE MORE the source of security
>>>>>>> problems.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/01/linux-bug-imperils-tens-of-millions-of-pcs-servers-and-android-phones/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Shit happens.  Good thing I don't have to wait until "Patch Tuesday" and
>>>>>> then fight a hostile upgrade attempt just to patch a security vuln.
>>>>>
>>>>> And in the real world of managed IT services, patches are pre-vetted and 
>>>>> rolled out to different customers on different days.
>>>>>
>>>>> Non-problem.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I would guess that the vast majority of Microsoft's customers -- consumer
>>>> and small business -- don't make use of managed IT services and are left
>>>> to fend for themselves.  Also didn't I read that MS is going to start
>>>> pushing W10 upgrades onto the corporate scene also?  I have to laugh
>>>> these days (since W8 introduction) at the idea of Windows in the business
>>>> world.  What business wants a cell phone interface on their desktop
>>>> computers?  What exactly is the purpose of that?
>>>
>>> I wonder how Windows 10's interface resembles that of a cell phone.
>>> Windows 8 sure, but 8.1 and 10 no longer have such a thing.
>>>
>> 
>> The live tiles are in the menu now.  And that ridiculous alphbetically
>> sorted menu list is nearly useless.
> 
> In the Start Menu, they're essentially out of the way and they are
> easily removed even from there. A person looking to have a
> traditional-looking Start Menu can have one with very little effort.
> 

With that then, what is the advantage of 10 vs 7 other than MS data mining
your private information.  I've never been much of a Microsoft basher.
Hell, I'm even an MCSE.  But they have really lost their bearings in the
last few years.  First they destroyed Technet.  Then there's the misguided
goal of merging the Desktop/Cell phone experience.  Now they're doing their
best to trick people into upgrading to an OS that they obviously don't want
or else they would not have to be tricked or forced to install it.  They've
said that Windows 10 is the "last Windows."  Let's hope so. 
 

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341184

On 2016-01-20 2:10 PM, owl wrote:
> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>> On 2016-01-20 10:48 AM, owl wrote:
>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>> On 2016-01-20 10:01 AM, owl wrote:
>>>>> Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 19/01/2016 21:21, owl wrote:
>>>>>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>>>>>> ROFL! It's in the kernel too. "The flaw, which was introduced into the
>>>>>>>> Linux kernel in version 3.8 released in early 2013, resides in the OS
>>>>>>>> keyring." Looks like your toiletware is ONCE MORE the source of security
>>>>>>>> problems.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> <http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/01/linux-bug-imperils-tens-of-millions-of-pcs-servers-and-android-phones/>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Shit happens.  Good thing I don't have to wait until "Patch Tuesday" and
>>>>>>> then fight a hostile upgrade attempt just to patch a security vuln.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And in the real world of managed IT services, patches are pre-vetted and 
>>>>>> rolled out to different customers on different days.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Non-problem.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I would guess that the vast majority of Microsoft's customers -- consumer
>>>>> and small business -- don't make use of managed IT services and are left
>>>>> to fend for themselves.  Also didn't I read that MS is going to start
>>>>> pushing W10 upgrades onto the corporate scene also?  I have to laugh
>>>>> these days (since W8 introduction) at the idea of Windows in the business
>>>>> world.  What business wants a cell phone interface on their desktop
>>>>> computers?  What exactly is the purpose of that?
>>>>
>>>> I wonder how Windows 10's interface resembles that of a cell phone.
>>>> Windows 8 sure, but 8.1 and 10 no longer have such a thing.
>>>>
>>>
>>> The live tiles are in the menu now.  And that ridiculous alphbetically
>>> sorted menu list is nearly useless.
>>
>> In the Start Menu, they're essentially out of the way and they are
>> easily removed even from there. A person looking to have a
>> traditional-looking Start Menu can have one with very little effort.
>>
> 
> With that then, what is the advantage of 10 vs 7 other than MS data mining
> your private information.

Access to the unified applications if and when they are released.

> I've never been much of a Microsoft basher.
> Hell, I'm even an MCSE.  But they have really lost their bearings in the
> last few years.

For products, they seem to be a lot more focused than they've ever been.

> First they destroyed Technet.  Then there's the misguided
> goal of merging the Desktop/Cell phone experience.  Now they're doing their
> best to trick people into upgrading to an OS that they obviously don't want
> or else they would not have to be tricked or forced to install it.  They've
> said that Windows 10 is the "last Windows."  Let's hope so. 

The desktop/cell phone experience merging is an idea I am strongly in
favour of personally. If they do it correctly, it will only strengthen
its mobile offering.

-- 
Slimer
EFF & OpenMedia member / IFAW, Mozilla & PETA supporter
"Everything seems to work fine, except that occasionally everything
freezes." - Another one of GNU/Linux's many victims
"Sound wasn't even a gauranteed thing on a PC in the 90s." - Linux
apologist JEDIDIAH explaining why sound never worked/works right in Linux

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341187

Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
> On 2016-01-20 2:10 PM, owl wrote:
>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>> On 2016-01-20 10:48 AM, owl wrote:
>>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>>> On 2016-01-20 10:01 AM, owl wrote:
>>>>>> Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 19/01/2016 21:21, owl wrote:
>>>>>>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> ROFL! It's in the kernel too. "The flaw, which was introduced into the
>>>>>>>>> Linux kernel in version 3.8 released in early 2013, resides in the OS
>>>>>>>>> keyring." Looks like your toiletware is ONCE MORE the source of security
>>>>>>>>> problems.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> <http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/01/linux-bug-imperils-tens-of-millions-of-pcs-servers-and-android-phones/>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Shit happens.  Good thing I don't have to wait until "Patch Tuesday" and
>>>>>>>> then fight a hostile upgrade attempt just to patch a security vuln.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And in the real world of managed IT services, patches are pre-vetted and 
>>>>>>> rolled out to different customers on different days.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Non-problem.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I would guess that the vast majority of Microsoft's customers -- consumer
>>>>>> and small business -- don't make use of managed IT services and are left
>>>>>> to fend for themselves.  Also didn't I read that MS is going to start
>>>>>> pushing W10 upgrades onto the corporate scene also?  I have to laugh
>>>>>> these days (since W8 introduction) at the idea of Windows in the business
>>>>>> world.  What business wants a cell phone interface on their desktop
>>>>>> computers?  What exactly is the purpose of that?
>>>>>
>>>>> I wonder how Windows 10's interface resembles that of a cell phone.
>>>>> Windows 8 sure, but 8.1 and 10 no longer have such a thing.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The live tiles are in the menu now.  And that ridiculous alphbetically
>>>> sorted menu list is nearly useless.
>>>
>>> In the Start Menu, they're essentially out of the way and they are
>>> easily removed even from there. A person looking to have a
>>> traditional-looking Start Menu can have one with very little effort.
>>>
>> 
>> With that then, what is the advantage of 10 vs 7 other than MS data mining
>> your private information.
> 
> Access to the unified applications if and when they are released.
> 

This is of dubious value.  I can't remember ever wishing I had MS Word
on my phone, or candy crush on my Laptop.

>> I've never been much of a Microsoft basher.
>> Hell, I'm even an MCSE.  But they have really lost their bearings in the
>> last few years.
> 
> For products, they seem to be a lot more focused than they've ever been.
>

Oh, they're definitely focused on this.  No doubt.  But I think they
are headed down the wrong path.
 
>> First they destroyed Technet.  Then there's the misguided
>> goal of merging the Desktop/Cell phone experience.  Now they're doing their
>> best to trick people into upgrading to an OS that they obviously don't want
>> or else they would not have to be tricked or forced to install it.  They've
>> said that Windows 10 is the "last Windows."  Let's hope so. 
> 
> The desktop/cell phone experience merging is an idea I am strongly in
> favour of personally. If they do it correctly, it will only strengthen
> its mobile offering.
> 

I think they would have better success just trying to build the best
phone OS experience out there and not worry so much about merging with
the desktop.  They are pursuing a solution to a non-existent problem. 

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341198

On 2016-01-20 4:20 PM, owl wrote:
> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>> On 2016-01-20 2:10 PM, owl wrote:
>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>> On 2016-01-20 10:48 AM, owl wrote:
>>>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>>>> On 2016-01-20 10:01 AM, owl wrote:
>>>>>>> Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 19/01/2016 21:21, owl wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> ROFL! It's in the kernel too. "The flaw, which was introduced into the
>>>>>>>>>> Linux kernel in version 3.8 released in early 2013, resides in the OS
>>>>>>>>>> keyring." Looks like your toiletware is ONCE MORE the source of security
>>>>>>>>>> problems.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> <http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/01/linux-bug-imperils-tens-of-millions-of-pcs-servers-and-android-phones/>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Shit happens.  Good thing I don't have to wait until "Patch Tuesday" and
>>>>>>>>> then fight a hostile upgrade attempt just to patch a security vuln.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And in the real world of managed IT services, patches are pre-vetted and 
>>>>>>>> rolled out to different customers on different days.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Non-problem.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I would guess that the vast majority of Microsoft's customers -- consumer
>>>>>>> and small business -- don't make use of managed IT services and are left
>>>>>>> to fend for themselves.  Also didn't I read that MS is going to start
>>>>>>> pushing W10 upgrades onto the corporate scene also?  I have to laugh
>>>>>>> these days (since W8 introduction) at the idea of Windows in the business
>>>>>>> world.  What business wants a cell phone interface on their desktop
>>>>>>> computers?  What exactly is the purpose of that?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I wonder how Windows 10's interface resembles that of a cell phone.
>>>>>> Windows 8 sure, but 8.1 and 10 no longer have such a thing.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> The live tiles are in the menu now.  And that ridiculous alphbetically
>>>>> sorted menu list is nearly useless.
>>>>
>>>> In the Start Menu, they're essentially out of the way and they are
>>>> easily removed even from there. A person looking to have a
>>>> traditional-looking Start Menu can have one with very little effort.
>>>>
>>>
>>> With that then, what is the advantage of 10 vs 7 other than MS data mining
>>> your private information.
>>
>> Access to the unified applications if and when they are released.
>>
> 
> This is of dubious value.  I can't remember ever wishing I had MS Word
> on my phone, or candy crush on my Laptop.

Meanwhile Office was released on Android and iOS because people wanted
it and my wife plays Candy Crush on her laptop.

>>> I've never been much of a Microsoft basher.
>>> Hell, I'm even an MCSE.  But they have really lost their bearings in the
>>> last few years.
>>
>> For products, they seem to be a lot more focused than they've ever been.
>>
> 
> Oh, they're definitely focused on this.  No doubt.  But I think they
> are headed down the wrong path.

The "right" path doesn't always lead to the highest profits.

>>> First they destroyed Technet.  Then there's the misguided
>>> goal of merging the Desktop/Cell phone experience.  Now they're doing their
>>> best to trick people into upgrading to an OS that they obviously don't want
>>> or else they would not have to be tricked or forced to install it.  They've
>>> said that Windows 10 is the "last Windows."  Let's hope so. 
>>
>> The desktop/cell phone experience merging is an idea I am strongly in
>> favour of personally. If they do it correctly, it will only strengthen
>> its mobile offering.
>>
> 
> I think they would have better success just trying to build the best
> phone OS experience out there and not worry so much about merging with
> the desktop.  They are pursuing a solution to a non-existent problem. 

If their goal is to have everyone at the company be on the same path,
making sure that they promote a single platform makes sense. I can't
imagine things being easy to manage when you have one division working
on one OS, another working to support the old ones, the other developing
applications only for the mobile space while the last develops
exclusively for desktops. I truly believe that one application which
adapts to whatever setup it is being used on makes the most sense in
this day and age. However, Microsoft has screwed up great ideas before
so it remains to be seen what happens here.

-- 
Slimer
EFF & OpenMedia member / IFAW, Mozilla & PETA supporter
"Everything seems to work fine, except that occasionally everything
freezes." - Another one of GNU/Linux's many victims
"Sound wasn't even a gauranteed thing on a PC in the 90s." - Linux
apologist JEDIDIAH explaining why sound never worked/works right in Linux

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341216

Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
> On 2016-01-20 4:20 PM, owl wrote:
>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>> On 2016-01-20 2:10 PM, owl wrote:
>>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>>> On 2016-01-20 10:48 AM, owl wrote:
>>>>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2016-01-20 10:01 AM, owl wrote:
>>>>>>>> Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 19/01/2016 21:21, owl wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> ROFL! It's in the kernel too. "The flaw, which was introduced into the
>>>>>>>>>>> Linux kernel in version 3.8 released in early 2013, resides in the OS
>>>>>>>>>>> keyring." Looks like your toiletware is ONCE MORE the source of security
>>>>>>>>>>> problems.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> <http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/01/linux-bug-imperils-tens-of-millions-of-pcs-servers-and-android-phones/>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Shit happens.  Good thing I don't have to wait until "Patch Tuesday" and
>>>>>>>>>> then fight a hostile upgrade attempt just to patch a security vuln.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And in the real world of managed IT services, patches are pre-vetted and 
>>>>>>>>> rolled out to different customers on different days.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Non-problem.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I would guess that the vast majority of Microsoft's customers -- consumer
>>>>>>>> and small business -- don't make use of managed IT services and are left
>>>>>>>> to fend for themselves.  Also didn't I read that MS is going to start
>>>>>>>> pushing W10 upgrades onto the corporate scene also?  I have to laugh
>>>>>>>> these days (since W8 introduction) at the idea of Windows in the business
>>>>>>>> world.  What business wants a cell phone interface on their desktop
>>>>>>>> computers?  What exactly is the purpose of that?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I wonder how Windows 10's interface resembles that of a cell phone.
>>>>>>> Windows 8 sure, but 8.1 and 10 no longer have such a thing.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The live tiles are in the menu now.  And that ridiculous alphbetically
>>>>>> sorted menu list is nearly useless.
>>>>>
>>>>> In the Start Menu, they're essentially out of the way and they are
>>>>> easily removed even from there. A person looking to have a
>>>>> traditional-looking Start Menu can have one with very little effort.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> With that then, what is the advantage of 10 vs 7 other than MS data mining
>>>> your private information.
>>>
>>> Access to the unified applications if and when they are released.
>>>
>> 
>> This is of dubious value.  I can't remember ever wishing I had MS Word
>> on my phone, or candy crush on my Laptop.
> 
> Meanwhile Office was released on Android

Took a look at it.  It seems to be a very stripped-down version.  I suppose
a shitload of people will install it, but I doubt anybody will actually
use it. 

> and iOS because people wanted
> it and my wife plays Candy Crush on her laptop.
>

Oh well.
 
>>>> I've never been much of a Microsoft basher.
>>>> Hell, I'm even an MCSE.  But they have really lost their bearings in the
>>>> last few years.
>>>
>>> For products, they seem to be a lot more focused than they've ever been.
>>>
>> 
>> Oh, they're definitely focused on this.  No doubt.  But I think they
>> are headed down the wrong path.
> 
> The "right" path doesn't always lead to the highest profits.
>

The chosen path chosen for profits doesn't always lead to profits either.

 
>>>> First they destroyed Technet.  Then there's the misguided
>>>> goal of merging the Desktop/Cell phone experience.  Now they're doing their
>>>> best to trick people into upgrading to an OS that they obviously don't want
>>>> or else they would not have to be tricked or forced to install it.  They've
>>>> said that Windows 10 is the "last Windows."  Let's hope so. 
>>>
>>> The desktop/cell phone experience merging is an idea I am strongly in
>>> favour of personally. If they do it correctly, it will only strengthen
>>> its mobile offering.
>>>
>> 
>> I think they would have better success just trying to build the best
>> phone OS experience out there and not worry so much about merging with
>> the desktop.  They are pursuing a solution to a non-existent problem. 
> 
> If their goal is to have everyone at the company be on the same path,
> making sure that they promote a single platform makes sense. I can't
> imagine things being easy to manage when you have one division working
> on one OS, another working to support the old ones, the other developing
> applications only for the mobile space while the last develops
> exclusively for desktops. I truly believe that one application which
> adapts to whatever setup it is being used on makes the most sense in
> this day and age. However, Microsoft has screwed up great ideas before
> so it remains to be seen what happens here.
> 

I really just disagree here.  I can't see how what would be the perfect
system for a phone would also be the perfect system on the desktop.
If you're going to compromise in the name of uniformity, well ok. 
But neither is going to end up with the best.
 

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341241

On 2016-01-21 3:51 AM, owl wrote:
> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>> On 2016-01-20 4:20 PM, owl wrote:
>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>> On 2016-01-20 2:10 PM, owl wrote:
>>>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>>>> On 2016-01-20 10:48 AM, owl wrote:
>>>>>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2016-01-20 10:01 AM, owl wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 19/01/2016 21:21, owl wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Slimer <.m@nsn.s> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> ROFL! It's in the kernel too. "The flaw, which was introduced into the
>>>>>>>>>>>> Linux kernel in version 3.8 released in early 2013, resides in the OS
>>>>>>>>>>>> keyring." Looks like your toiletware is ONCE MORE the source of security
>>>>>>>>>>>> problems.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/01/linux-bug-imperils-tens-of-millions-of-pcs-servers-and-android-phones/>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Shit happens.  Good thing I don't have to wait until "Patch Tuesday" and
>>>>>>>>>>> then fight a hostile upgrade attempt just to patch a security vuln.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> And in the real world of managed IT services, patches are pre-vetted and 
>>>>>>>>>> rolled out to different customers on different days.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Non-problem.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I would guess that the vast majority of Microsoft's customers -- consumer
>>>>>>>>> and small business -- don't make use of managed IT services and are left
>>>>>>>>> to fend for themselves.  Also didn't I read that MS is going to start
>>>>>>>>> pushing W10 upgrades onto the corporate scene also?  I have to laugh
>>>>>>>>> these days (since W8 introduction) at the idea of Windows in the business
>>>>>>>>> world.  What business wants a cell phone interface on their desktop
>>>>>>>>> computers?  What exactly is the purpose of that?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I wonder how Windows 10's interface resembles that of a cell phone.
>>>>>>>> Windows 8 sure, but 8.1 and 10 no longer have such a thing.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The live tiles are in the menu now.  And that ridiculous alphbetically
>>>>>>> sorted menu list is nearly useless.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In the Start Menu, they're essentially out of the way and they are
>>>>>> easily removed even from there. A person looking to have a
>>>>>> traditional-looking Start Menu can have one with very little effort.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> With that then, what is the advantage of 10 vs 7 other than MS data mining
>>>>> your private information.
>>>>
>>>> Access to the unified applications if and when they are released.
>>>>
>>>
>>> This is of dubious value.  I can't remember ever wishing I had MS Word
>>> on my phone, or candy crush on my Laptop.
>>
>> Meanwhile Office was released on Android
> 
> Took a look at it.  It seems to be a very stripped-down version.  I suppose
> a shitload of people will install it, but I doubt anybody will actually
> use it. 

To create new documents? Probably not. However, if people are on the
train and suddenly realize that they need to make an important change to
a document they've saved to the cloud, such software could be useful.
Once again, my wife has need for such a thing in her role as a Team Lead
at a financial institution.

>> and iOS because people wanted
>> it and my wife plays Candy Crush on her laptop.
>>
> 
> Oh well.

We're obviously not all the same. Mind you, her laptop is practically
made for a game like Candy Crush; it works as well as a laptop as a
tablet. In tablet mode, Candy Crush is fairly awesome.

>> The "right" path doesn't always lead to the highest profits.
>>
> 
> The chosen path chosen for profits doesn't always lead to profits either.

I'm sure that Microsoft knows what it's doing. If anything, they hired
my high school's biggest nerd, an overachiever who was on my
university's honour roll for every year that he was there. If things go
wrong, they can ask his seemingly brilliant advice. If anything, I
wouldn't be shocked to see him become Microsoft's eventual CEO.

>>> I think they would have better success just trying to build the best
>>> phone OS experience out there and not worry so much about merging with
>>> the desktop.  They are pursuing a solution to a non-existent problem. 
>>
>> If their goal is to have everyone at the company be on the same path,
>> making sure that they promote a single platform makes sense. I can't
>> imagine things being easy to manage when you have one division working
>> on one OS, another working to support the old ones, the other developing
>> applications only for the mobile space while the last develops
>> exclusively for desktops. I truly believe that one application which
>> adapts to whatever setup it is being used on makes the most sense in
>> this day and age. However, Microsoft has screwed up great ideas before
>> so it remains to be seen what happens here.
>>
> 
> I really just disagree here.  I can't see how what would be the perfect
> system for a phone would also be the perfect system on the desktop.
> If you're going to compromise in the name of uniformity, well ok. 
> But neither is going to end up with the best.

We'll see how it pans out. It could end up being brilliant on power but
poorly brought to market like the Zune was.

-- 
Slimer
EFF & OpenMedia member / IFAW, Mozilla & PETA supporter
"Everything seems to work fine, except that occasionally everything
freezes." - Another one of GNU/Linux's many victims
"Sound wasn't even a gauranteed thing on a PC in the 90s." - Linux
apologist JEDIDIAH explaining why sound never worked/works right in Linux

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341189

On 1/20/2016 10:48 AM, owl wrote:


> My holster is for a gun.


I know someone who carries concealed into his office (CPA firm)
everyday.  None of his bosses or coworkers know it - if the gun isn't on
his person it's in his briefcase.

cuckoo!

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341196

DFS <nospam@dfs.com> wrote:
> On 1/20/2016 10:48 AM, owl wrote:
> 
> 
>> My holster is for a gun.
> 
> 
> I know someone who carries concealed into his office (CPA firm)
> everyday.  None of his bosses or coworkers know it - if the gun isn't on
> his person it's in his briefcase.
> 
> cuckoo!
> 

What's "cuckoo" about that?  If some disgruntled ex-employee comes
in one day to get revenge, that guy will will probably survive.
And if SHTF comes down while he's at work, he'll have a better chance
making it back home unmolested.

I carry everywhere it's legal to carry.  And it's legal just
about everywhere around these parts.  I usually carry concealed,
but mainly so nobody is tempted to kill me just to get my gun.
When I do open-carry, I also carry a concealed backup.  And I 
keep an AR in the trunk along with a bugout bag. 

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341203

On 1/20/2016 5:00 PM, owl wrote:
> DFS <nospam@dfs.com> wrote:
>> On 1/20/2016 10:48 AM, owl wrote:
>>
>>
>>> My holster is for a gun.
>>
>>
>> I know someone who carries concealed into his office (CPA firm)
>> everyday.  None of his bosses or coworkers know it - if the gun isn't on
>> his person it's in his briefcase.
>>
>> cuckoo!
>>
>
> What's "cuckoo" about that?

It's extremely paranoid.  And it might get him fired.



> If some disgruntled ex-employee comes
> in one day to get revenge, that guy will will probably survive.
> And if SHTF comes down while he's at work, he'll have a better chance
> making it back home unmolested.


if, probably, if, chance...



> I carry everywhere it's legal to carry.  And it's legal just
> about everywhere around these parts.  I usually carry concealed,
> but mainly so nobody is tempted to kill me just to get my gun.
> When I do open-carry, I also carry a concealed backup.  And I
> keep an AR in the trunk along with a bugout bag.


It must suck to be so worried all the time.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#341204

DFS <nospam@dfs.com> wrote:
> On 1/20/2016 5:00 PM, owl wrote:
>> DFS <nospam@dfs.com> wrote:
>>> On 1/20/2016 10:48 AM, owl wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> My holster is for a gun.
>>>
>>>
>>> I know someone who carries concealed into his office (CPA firm)
>>> everyday.  None of his bosses or coworkers know it - if the gun isn't on
>>> his person it's in his briefcase.
>>>
>>> cuckoo!
>>>
>>
>> What's "cuckoo" about that?
> 
> It's extremely paranoid.  And it might get him fired.
> 

Some would say the risk is worth it.  You know of this one guy
who carries.  There are surely others you don't know about.
Most people who carry in violation of either law or company
policy don't advertise the fact.
 
> 
>> If some disgruntled ex-employee comes
>> in one day to get revenge, that guy will will probably survive.
>> And if SHTF comes down while he's at work, he'll have a better chance
>> making it back home unmolested.
> 
> 
> if, probably, if, chance...
> 

Life is about probabilities and mitigation.
 
> 
>> I carry everywhere it's legal to carry.  And it's legal just
>> about everywhere around these parts.  I usually carry concealed,
>> but mainly so nobody is tempted to kill me just to get my gun.
>> When I do open-carry, I also carry a concealed backup.  And I
>> keep an AR in the trunk along with a bugout bag.
> 
> 
> It must suck to be so worried all the time.
> 

It must be nice to have a gun and know in advance exactly when
you're going to need it and when you're not.  Did you come by
those psychic powers naturally or did you have to attend some
paranormal training academy?
 

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