Groups | Search | Server Info | Keyboard shortcuts | Login | Register [http] [https] [nntp] [nntps]

Groups > comp.lang.javascript > #16746

Re: Programming style question

Show all headers | View raw

Gene Wirchenko wrote on 19 okt 2012 in comp.lang.javascript:

> On Fri, 19 Oct 2012 00:49:58 +0200, "Evertjan."
> <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> wrote:
> 
>>Gene Wirchenko wrote on 18 okt 2012 in comp.lang.javascript:
>>
>>>>The "trend" perhaps, but in older compiling languages, a typed
>>>>variable got it's own permanent number of bytes. Even a string had
>>>>to be definet 
>>> 
>>>      That would depend on the language.  For example, PL/I (started
>>>      by 
>>> IBM in the '60s; old enough?) has variable length strings
>>>           declare howeverlong char(50) varying;
>>> Whether this is permanently set aside is an implementation issue,
>>> but not a requirement.
>>> 
>>>      Compiled BASICs had and have dynamically-allocated strings.
>>>      Older 
>>> languages could, too; 
>>
>>No, Gene, ofcourse there are exceptions, 
>>but those do not reduce my point.
> 
>      You made a general statement.

Indeed, I was using historical string memmoy allocation as argument.

Ecxceptions do not reduce my point, 
as general statements surely alllow for exceptions.

>>Remember that compiled basics are latecomers, and that basic used to
>>be a script-language for many many years before that. 
> 
>      What would you consider a latecomer?  I used a BASIC compiler
> first about thirty years ago.

Wow, I used basic 40 years ago, when it was sort of a superion batch 
language [comand line interpreter], what we later called a script language 
[interpreter as opposed to compiler], no compiling in sight for many years 
to come, original Dartmouth BASIC being from 1964.

I used and retro-disassembled/recompiled Central Data Basic for Signetics 
2650 microprocessor [yes, the one with the many microchip registers] 
written [around 1977?] by someone named William Gates, then of Altair 
fame, I believe. [Central Date Corp., Champain, IL: Basic on tape or 
floppy 12kB]

Before that I had some collisions with Algol-60.

So yes, latecomer. 
 
>>Remember that in basic a variable name could only be a letter plus a 
>>number, not a meaningful word, making remarks necessary for nearly
>>every 
> 
>      That has not been true for over three decades.

It hasn't rained for two hole days here!

>>line of code, that a subroutines existed but user functions not, and 
> 
>      User functions have existed possibly from the beginning.  They
> were very limited (only one line).  I used DEC's BASIC-Plus in the
> mid-'70s and you could define multiline functions.

As a latecomer perhaps you don't remember the difference between 
subroutines and functions. I believe it had only subroutines, no user-
functions.

>>reentant subroutines were impossible, because they only could exist
>>with dynamic memory, local variables [as in closures] and return
>>values. 
> 
>      They were not impossible.  I did it.

You did what and when?

>>The primary idea of basic dim-ing [and pascal and even js var-ing] was
>>to allocate memory, not as a "option explicit" error-finding mission.
> 
>      How is this even relevant?  I use many features for multiple
> reasons.

Relevant to what?

What you use for what reasons has no incling on primary ideas of basic 
dim-ing, methinks.

What are you trying to say?

>>> it is not a new concept.
>>
>>You young boys and girls perhaps do not remember programming in
>>Assembler or Forth, [or Algol], [and think pascal is a small form of
>>hectopascal] so have a limited definition of "new" in this field.
> 
>      I will be turning 52 next month. 

Congratulations in advance, I could be the father of your elder siblings, 
biologically speaking.

> I have used all of the
> languages in your paragraph.  And more.

I wrote a Forth Kernel in 1982, <http://www.forth.org/fd/FD-V04N3.pdf>
but that is not relavant, as I certainly do not stipulate you are both 
young boys and girls, I was speaking to the group.
 
>>>>with it's maximum length. This is still an important issue with
>>>>databases, as you may well know.
>>> 
>>>      Well, not really.  varchar(max) in SQL Server is limited to
>>> 2^31-1 bytes.  That much memory is not allocated for each such
>>> string. 
>>
>>Access up to this day requires simple strings to have a maximum size,
>>and has a seperate type for strings upto 2 meg, I believe. 
> 
>      I use long strings in tables.  I rarely need anything that long.
> I would question the design.
> 
>      Access is but one DBMS and a low-end one.  It is hardly a good
> sample of the entire field.

You still do not seem to gasp what I am talking about, like my rainy 
example above.

I was not criticising the field, but giving relevant examples of non 
dynamic string memory allotment. 

If MS-Access is not a relevant example, perhaps we should exclude computer 
programminf in general as examples?

>>Javascript in most or all aplications still has the nasty habit that
>>string-size is inmutable and that any change in size needs a new 
>>stringallocation in memory. That is not important anymore in
>>memorywize, as we have plenty of that, but makes string-concatenation
>>very, very slow. 
> 
>      That is an implementation issue and hardly makes it impossible.

Sorry, your point escapes me.

I thought we were, at least I was, discussing historical string memory 
implementation. Not impossibilities of implementation.

>>This does not have to be, it is just a memory of the past, but more 
>>intelligent concatenation is not implemented [yet].
> 
>      It would be nice.  It was a change in Visual FoxPro that some
> really liked.

It is possible in Javascript. 

Split() the string into an array of individual characters,
then use array functions like push() and pop(), (un)shift(), slice(), 
splice().
Then join the array for the result.

The speed gained could be disolved in the sweat of programming 
perspiration.


-- 
Evertjan.
The Netherlands.
(Please change the x'es to dots in my emailaddress)

Back to comp.lang.javascript | Previous | Next — Previous in thread | Next in thread | Find similar | Unroll thread

Thread

Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-18 08:32 +0100
  Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-18 10:23 +0200
    Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-18 13:42 +0100
      Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-18 17:59 +0200
        Re: Programming style question Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-10-18 09:56 -0700
          Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-19 00:49 +0200
            Re: Programming style question Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-10-19 11:04 -0700
              Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-20 11:52 +0200
            Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-19 12:06 -0700
              Re: Programming style question Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-10-19 23:12 +0100
                Re: Programming style question "Mel Smith" <med_cutout_syntel@aol.com> - 2012-10-19 21:56 -0600
              Re: Programming style question Bart Van der Donck <bart@nijlen.com> - 2012-10-20 02:21 -0700
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-20 12:03 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-20 06:31 -0700
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-20 18:30 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-20 10:32 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-10-20 22:34 +0100
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-21 10:12 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-10-21 09:34 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Dr J R Stockton <reply1242@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-10-21 17:59 +0100
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-22 09:55 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-10-22 09:50 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-22 04:49 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-10-22 14:04 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Hans-Georg Michna <hans-georgNoEmailPlease@michna.com> - 2012-10-22 16:07 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Dr J R Stockton <reply1243@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-10-23 18:22 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Hans-Georg Michna <hans-georgNoEmailPlease@michna.com> - 2012-10-22 16:01 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Jim T. <x@y.z> - 2012-10-22 12:16 -0400
                Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-22 11:40 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-10-22 14:01 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Hans-Georg Michna <hans-georgNoEmailPlease@michna.com> - 2012-10-23 10:07 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-10-23 09:43 -0700
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-23 11:49 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Jim T. <x@y.z> - 2012-10-23 15:52 -0400
                Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-23 13:07 -0700
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-23 22:45 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-10-23 14:14 -0700
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-24 09:35 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-10-24 10:17 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Dr J R Stockton <reply1243@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-10-25 18:41 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-25 17:03 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-10-25 20:14 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-25 20:46 -0700
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-26 09:55 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-26 06:18 -0700
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-26 17:43 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-10-26 09:57 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-26 10:24 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-10-26 14:18 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-27 10:45 +0200
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-27 12:58 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-27 16:18 +0200
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-27 18:08 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-27 18:26 +0200
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-27 19:43 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-27 21:09 +0200
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-27 22:53 +0200
                Re: Programming style question John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-10-28 11:37 +0000
                Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-28 12:50 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Martin Leese <please@see.Web.for.e-mail.INVALID> - 2012-10-28 13:43 -0600
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-28 23:58 +0100
                Re: Programming style question John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-10-29 11:18 +0000
                Re: Programming style question Eric Bednarz <bednarz@fahr-zur-hoelle.org> - 2012-10-27 23:58 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-28 12:43 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Dr J R Stockton <reply1243@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-10-27 19:44 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-24 12:06 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-24 21:27 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-10-24 15:12 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-10-25 01:29 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-10-24 21:25 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-24 21:57 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-10-25 01:11 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> - 2012-10-25 02:00 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-10-24 20:27 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-25 08:44 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Adam Silver <adambsilver@gmail.com> - 2012-10-25 04:28 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-25 23:18 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-10-26 08:24 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-11-07 22:13 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-11-07 21:51 +0000
                Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-11-07 23:47 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-11-08 01:14 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-11-07 16:51 -0800
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-11-08 16:45 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-11-08 08:02 -0800
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-11-08 17:39 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-11-08 11:25 -0800
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-11-08 22:25 +0100
                Re: Programming style question John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-11-09 10:19 +0000
                Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-11-09 17:41 +0100
                Re: Programming style question Dr J R Stockton <reply1245@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-11-10 22:38 +0000
                Re: Programming style question Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-10-22 12:32 -0700
                Re: Programming style question Hans-Georg Michna <hans-georgNoEmailPlease@michna.com> - 2012-10-23 10:05 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> - 2012-10-22 22:11 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-10-23 02:42 +0200
                Re: Programming style question Hans-Georg Michna <hans-georgNoEmailPlease@michna.com> - 2012-10-23 10:08 +0200
              Re: Programming style question "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-10-20 18:34 +0200
  Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-18 11:57 +0200
    Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-18 13:06 +0100
      Re: Programming style question "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-10-18 15:32 +0300
        Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-18 13:37 +0100
          Re: Programming style question "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-10-18 15:55 +0300
          Re: Programming style question John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-10-19 10:12 +0100
            Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-19 07:24 -0700
              Re: Programming style question John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-10-20 17:47 +0100
          Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-24 01:15 +0100
            Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-24 01:31 +0100
            Re: Programming style question "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-10-24 07:34 +0300
              Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-24 19:57 +0200
                Re: Programming style question "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-10-24 21:02 +0300
        Re: Programming style question Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-10-18 20:15 -0700
      Re: Programming style question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-10-24 01:21 +0100
  Re: Programming style question Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-10-21 17:57 -0700

csiph-web