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Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc

From Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com>
Newsgroups comp.lang.forth
Subject Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc
Date 2016-08-06 22:54 -0500
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <no6bd8$jdf$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References (9 earlier) <6d4e631e-cd0f-4628-8dca-f04ec462723a@googlegroups.com> <no3rqm$b04$1@dont-email.me> <b2dc5b08-64c0-4cb9-af70-b9f8dd9dc17c@googlegroups.com> <no66cs$88a$1@dont-email.me> <fd04bbfb-b034-44e3-8c1c-83a5e0a468f0@googlegroups.com>

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On 8/6/2016 9:46 PM, hughaguilar96@gmail.com wrote:
> On Saturday, August 6, 2016 at 7:28:45 PM UTC-7, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
>> On 8/6/2016 6:58 PM, hughaguilar96@gmail.com wrote:
>>> On Friday, August 5, 2016 at 10:16:08 PM UTC-7, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
>>>> A long time ago I started using Borland Delphi for writing work related
>>>> and personal software but I could not afford the horribly expensive
>>>> database capable version at the time. I ended writing my own Self
>>>> Balancing B-Tree multi key database library, it was complex to figure it
>>>> out, and it took me a while to get it right, but once it was working I
>>>> would use it all over the place. It was very fast, it took little space,
>>>> and was very flexible so for years I used it for all sorts of tools and
>>>> applications.
>>>> ...
>> I been looking at the printed listing and I'm not sure it will be
>> practical to translate it to Forth, it makes heavy use of structures,
>> pointers to structures. With many people demanding that Forth continue
>> to stay in the 1970s, no libraries, no structures, no decently built
>> object system, it will be hard to duplicate the Pascal code.
>
> I don't see any problem with porting Pascal code into ANS-Forth --- just ignore the committee and their demand that we don't use structs --- I do fine in my novice-package ignoring them, and if you going to get your code into the novice-package you will have to ignore them too.
>
> I have a book on Pascal-S that supported nested functions. I know that Borland's Turbo-Pascal did not support nested functions though --- it was a trimmed-down non-standard Pascal --- I would assume that Borland's Delphi also did not support nested functions, but I never delved into Delphi very deeply.
>
> If Delphi Pascal is pretty comparable to Turbo Pascal, there should be no difficulty in porting to Forth. I hope that you do provide B-Trees to the novice-package --- I don't know enough about B-Trees to do this myself (without quite a lot of research) --- if you do it though, that would be pretty cool.
>
Delphi generated fairly good code, and it does allow defining a function 
inside a function with access to the parents variables, those routines 
were very fast with old PCs it could store and sort about 10 thousand 
records per second, reading was even faster. I'm not sure that MySQL 
could be that fast but I never tested it to see how efficient it was.

Fully functional quotations would really be useful in implementing the 
conversion. I used to have some programs that would translate C or Turbo 
Pascal code to Forth, and it was very thorough, most of the time the 
generated code needed no changes, but I lost it a long time ago.

One wonders why so many are so against structures, and libraries, it's 
hard to understand, maybe they have never used a good implementation of 
these things to see how helpful they are in implementing and managing 
software, in any case I live in the 21th Century not the 7th Century so 
in the end I will do what I want.


>> Most likely
>> I will work eventually in an interface to MySQL and leave it at that, no
>> hurry there. I need MySQL capability eventually as I have several web
>> sites I maintain and they run on MySQL, I would like to build some
>> conversion programs to manipulate and modify MySQL databases used in
>> those sites.
>>
>> First I need to decide on what Forth system I will use for my desktops
>> computers, that is why I been playing with different Forth and Forth
>> like systems. I will be using two different Forths, one for desktops,
>> with decent library system and tools. The other a stripped down Forth
>> for embedded systems, I been using eForth for that purpose lately and
>> it's not bad for that purpose,  there are plenty of versions available
>> for various CPUs, but I have sources to one version that is easily
>> migrated, I been using it with FPGA Forth CPUs and it's working well.
>
> Eventually I will bring out Straight Forth. I'm taking my time with that --- I have a lot to learn --- I want to avoid standardizing my ignorance, so I'm holding off on releasing it.
>
> In the meantime, just use VFX. My rquotations work on VFX and SwiftForth --- I could get them to work on any Forth system, most likely, but don't know until I try --- VFX generates pretty fast code, so it could be used for commercial programming.
>

I have VFX Standard and it works well, it's faster than SwiftForth which 
I also own a copy with source.  I don't have the source to VFX Standard 
but I can't afford to buy the source, I have a copy as an item needed to 
compile the ARM Pro Compiler for which I have the source. It's not the 
evaluation copy so I can save copies of the modified system so 
theoretically that could be my Desktop version but I wish I had the 
source, one day Stephen Pelc will retire or an accident can happen, and 
I will be in a pickle if there are problems, Windows is a moving target 
and eventually it could cause problems. I hate to invest a lot of my 
time to build the libraries to have the items I need and have no 
guarantee that I will not have wasted my efforts.

A thought that often passes my mind is why not take eForth and flesh it 
out a little more, then use it to create the libraries I want and have 
full source to the darn thing. The version I have has a cross compiler 
so one could generate a stand alone target system, for whatever CPU one 
cares to modify it for but that is a lot of work, so I keep looking, but 
having source is a item high on the list. eForth is my fallback system 
if I can't find something with source that is workable.

-- 
Cecil - k5nwa

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The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series  - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2016-08-02 09:33 -0700
  Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series  - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2016-08-02 10:35 -0700
    Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series  - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2016-08-02 11:46 -0700
      Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series  - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-03 00:04 -0700
        Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series  - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-04 00:41 -0700
          Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2016-08-04 09:35 -0400
            Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-04 10:08 -0500
  Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series  - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Brad Eckert <hwfwguy@gmail.com> - 2016-08-02 15:45 -0700
    Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-02 19:56 -0500
      Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2016-08-02 22:43 -0700
      Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-03 00:12 -0700
        Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-03 02:42 -0500
          Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-03 10:41 -0700
            Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-03 12:56 -0500
            Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-03 13:09 -0500
              Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2016-08-03 14:15 -0400
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-03 18:00 -0500
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-05 20:35 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-06 00:16 -0500
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-06 16:58 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-06 18:01 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-06 21:28 -0500
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-06 19:46 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-06 22:54 -0500
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Julian Fondren <julian.fondren@gmail.com> - 2016-08-06 21:39 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2016-08-06 22:28 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-06 23:49 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-07 02:32 -0500
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2016-08-07 01:06 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-07 07:05 -0500
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-07 13:01 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-07 16:02 -0500
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-07 14:20 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc franck.bensusan@gmail.com - 2016-08-08 03:13 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-08 11:25 -0500
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2016-08-07 13:55 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-07 16:22 -0500
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-07 15:03 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Håkan Thörngren <hth313@gmail.com> - 2016-08-07 23:02 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2016-08-07 21:10 -1000
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-09 00:36 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-08-08 09:06 +0000
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-07 09:33 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Håkan Thörngren <hth313@gmail.com> - 2016-08-07 11:31 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-07 12:35 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-07 16:11 -0500
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Håkan Thörngren <hth313@gmail.com> - 2016-08-07 22:43 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Håkan Thörngren <hth313@gmail.com> - 2016-08-07 22:48 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-08-08 08:34 +0000
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-08 23:59 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-08-09 13:53 +0000
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-10 19:56 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Julian Fondren <julian.fondren@gmail.com> - 2016-08-11 00:33 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-08-11 11:58 +0000
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-11 13:16 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc stephen@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2016-08-11 23:36 +0000
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-11 20:49 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-28 11:20 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-28 17:33 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-28 21:10 -0500
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-28 22:49 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-12 23:10 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Julian Fondren <julian.fondren@gmail.com> - 2016-08-06 20:20 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-07 09:58 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Julian Fondren <julian.fondren@gmail.com> - 2016-08-07 11:08 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-08-08 09:10 +0000
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-08-08 10:47 +0000
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc JennyB <jennybrien@googlemail.com> - 2016-08-08 13:44 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc mhx@iae.nl - 2016-08-08 11:32 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-08-09 06:13 +0000
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-08-09 06:19 +0000
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc mhx@iae.nl - 2016-08-09 02:54 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-08-09 10:22 +0000
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc lawrencedo99@gmail.com - 2016-08-15 20:33 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-16 10:40 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc lawrencedo99@gmail.com - 2016-08-17 02:21 -0700
                Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-17 11:14 -0700
        Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Roberto Waltman <usenet@rwaltman.com> - 2016-08-03 18:21 -0400
    Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2016-08-03 02:46 -0400
  Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series  - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc endlessboomcapitalism@gmail.com - 2016-08-13 09:51 -0700
    Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series  - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2016-08-13 12:18 -0700
      Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series  - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc endlessboomcapitalism@gmail.com - 2016-08-14 19:13 -0700
        Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series  - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2016-08-15 07:43 -0700
          Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2016-08-15 12:34 -0500
            Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc Brad Eckert <hwfwguy@gmail.com> - 2016-08-17 22:08 -0700
              Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-18 15:26 -0700
      Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series  - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc endlessboomcapitalism@gmail.com - 2016-08-14 19:18 -0700
      Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series  - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-08-15 08:24 -0700
        Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series  - Programming Forth - Stephen Pelc JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2016-08-15 08:31 -0700
          Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth- Stephen Pelc "WJ" <w_a_x_man@yahoo.com> - 2016-08-19 23:54 +0000
            Re: The Fourth Forth eBook in our little series - Programming Forth- Stephen Pelc JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2016-08-20 01:43 -0700

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