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Groups > comp.lang.c > #23207 > unrolled thread
| Started by | jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2012-07-08 21:53 +0200 |
| Last post | 2012-08-04 22:53 -0600 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 122 — 26 participants |
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The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-08 21:53 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library aftnix <aftnix@gmail.com> - 2012-07-26 13:13 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-26 22:31 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library lawrence.jones@siemens.com - 2012-07-28 17:46 -0400
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-29 02:05 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library lawrence.jones@siemens.com - 2012-07-30 14:48 -0400
Re: The C Containers Library Phil Bradby <nospam@nospam.com> - 2012-08-01 21:00 +0000
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-08-01 23:18 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2012-08-02 00:48 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-08-02 07:00 -0400
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-08-02 13:27 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library Quentin Pope <qp19433@hotmail.NOSPAM.com> - 2012-08-02 20:27 +0000
Re: The C Containers Library Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2012-08-02 05:13 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2012-08-02 14:26 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library Kenneth Brody <kenbrody@spamcop.net> - 2012-08-03 10:47 -0400
Re: The C Containers Library Noob <root@localhost> - 2012-07-29 09:58 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-07-30 00:31 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library Noob <root@localhost> - 2012-07-30 09:45 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2012-07-30 02:10 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library lawrence.jones@siemens.com - 2012-07-30 14:54 -0400
Re: The C Containers Library James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-07-26 16:52 -0400
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-26 22:56 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library pacman@kosh.dhis.org (Alan Curry) - 2012-07-26 22:29 +0000
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-27 01:50 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library pacman@kosh.dhis.org (Alan Curry) - 2012-07-27 22:28 +0000
Re: The C Containers Library Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2012-07-29 06:31 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-07-30 00:26 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2012-07-30 02:21 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-08-02 02:27 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-08-02 16:43 +0100
Re: The C Containers Library Ansel <lateknightdev@gmail.com> - 2012-08-02 17:07 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-08-03 22:21 +0100
Re: The C Containers Library Ansel <lateknightdev@gmail.com> - 2012-08-03 15:43 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library Anders Wegge Keller <wegge@wegge.dk> - 2012-08-04 06:32 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2012-08-04 01:52 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-08-04 22:36 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library Anders Wegge Keller <wegge@wegge.dk> - 2012-08-05 08:36 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-08-05 01:28 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library Anders Wegge Keller <wegge@wegge.dk> - 2012-08-05 11:31 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-08-05 03:48 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2012-08-04 03:41 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-27 01:55 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library wkaras@yahoo.com - 2012-07-26 13:45 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-26 22:53 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library wkaras@yahoo.com - 2012-07-26 18:46 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-27 10:59 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library gwowen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2012-07-27 03:39 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library wkaras@yahoo.com - 2012-07-27 11:34 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-27 11:04 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library W Karas <wkaras@yahoo.com> - 2012-07-27 13:10 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library wkaras@yahoo.com - 2012-07-26 18:54 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-07-27 10:25 -0400
Re: The C Containers Library wkaras@yahoo.com - 2012-07-27 11:28 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-07-27 15:17 -0400
Re: The C Containers Library wkaras@yahoo.com - 2012-07-27 13:00 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-29 02:02 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-07-28 22:08 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-29 08:46 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library pacman@kosh.dhis.org (Alan Curry) - 2012-07-29 07:43 +0000
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-29 09:59 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2012-07-29 06:43 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library pacman@kosh.dhis.org (Alan Curry) - 2012-07-29 17:27 +0000
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-29 20:56 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library pacman@kosh.dhis.org (Alan Curry) - 2012-07-30 00:07 +0000
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-07-30 00:07 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-07-29 11:58 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-29 22:06 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-29 22:23 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.invalid> - 2012-07-30 00:13 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-07-30 00:13 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-07-30 01:10 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-07-30 02:57 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2012-07-30 15:47 +0000
Re: The C Containers Library Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-07-30 13:01 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2012-07-30 04:53 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-07-30 13:04 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-08-02 02:11 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-08-02 06:52 -0400
Re: The C Containers Library James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-08-02 06:46 -0400
Re: The C Containers Library Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-07-30 00:41 +0100
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-30 09:45 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-07-29 23:05 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-07-29 22:52 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2012-07-30 04:56 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-08-02 02:07 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-30 17:49 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-07-28 09:17 +0100
Re: The C Containers Library W Karas <wkaras@yahoo.com> - 2012-07-28 15:17 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-07-29 11:10 +0100
Re: The C Containers Library Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2012-07-28 06:51 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-07-28 17:23 +0100
Re: The C Containers Library Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2012-07-30 13:40 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.invalid> - 2012-07-31 00:24 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.invalid> - 2012-07-31 00:05 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-07-31 00:53 +0100
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-07-31 09:24 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2012-08-02 14:45 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-08-03 22:31 +0100
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-08-04 00:01 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-08-03 23:45 +0100
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-08-04 22:47 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-08-04 22:41 -0600
Re: The C Containers Library Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-08-07 10:24 +0100
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-08-07 15:30 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-08-07 15:35 +0100
Re: The C Containers Library Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2012-09-07 12:40 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-09-08 00:07 +0100
Re: The C Containers Library Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2012-09-07 17:31 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-09-08 03:14 +0100
Re: The C Containers Library Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2012-09-08 05:22 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2012-09-07 12:36 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2012-08-08 02:26 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-08-08 17:25 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library 88888 Dihedral <dihedral88888@googlemail.com> - 2012-08-03 16:04 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library SG <s.gesemann@gmail.com> - 2012-08-04 04:52 -0700
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-08-04 18:42 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library Ike Naar <ike@faeroes.freeshell.org> - 2012-08-04 19:17 +0000
Re: The C Containers Library Ike Naar <ike@faeroes.freeshell.org> - 2012-08-04 19:22 +0000
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-08-04 22:14 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-08-05 00:15 +0200
Re: The C Containers Library Ike Naar <ike@faeroes.freeshell.org> - 2012-08-04 23:13 +0000
Re: The C Containers Library "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> - 2012-08-04 22:53 -0600
Page 4 of 7 — ← Prev page 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 Next page →
| From | Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-29 06:43 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <4497b649-dbf7-4525-9ba6-bee3292d7c00@5g2000vbf.googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #23880 |
On Jul 29, 8:59 am, jacob navia <ja...@spamsink.net> wrote:
> Le 29/07/12 09:43, Alan Curry a écrit :
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > In article <jv2m8d$ir...@speranza.aioe.org>,
> > jacob navia <ja...@jspamsink.org> wrote:
> >> Le 29/07/12 06:08, Ansel a écrit :
>
> >>> I don't think you can go to the conference and *not* compare against STL
> >>> even though you have a C-based product. Else you're going to get responses
> >>> like James gave you about it being kludgy -- you have to address that
> >>> ("that" being that C gives one less clay to mold a container library with)
> >>> and try to alleviate those concerns so that no one even thinks to say that.
> >>> Your story needs to be not only convincing, but *compelling*.
>
> > [...]
>
> >> No, I will not do that. The library is not a direct competition for the
> >> STL, C++ is the best thing since sliced bread, and people that like
> >> that machinery because they have been building it since years would fall
> >> on me and my small project like hawks...
>
> > Could you do a side-by-side with GLib? It has linked lists, trees,
> > hashes... it's not exactly the same thing, but there is significant
> > overlap. It's a C library, so it's closer to being your real
> > competition.
>
> > In fact if someone showed up at the C committee meeting and said "hey,
> > how about we standardize GLib?" they'd probably have a better chance of
> > success than you right now. GLib is ugly as hell, but it has actual
> > field testing.
>
> We have discussed the glib several times in this group. Specifically,
> the behavior of "xmalloc" of the glib was questioned that aborts the
> program instead of returning NULL.
>
> The basic problem is that the glib is GNU, and that means that it can't
> be used outside the restrictions of the GPL.
actually it uses LGPL which is less restrictive
> The sample implementation is not a full implementation of the library.
> Multi-threading stuff is missing, for instance. Ordered containers
> (keep in sorted order) are missing from this first version too.
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| From | pacman@kosh.dhis.org (Alan Curry) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-29 17:27 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <jv3rpc$e32$1@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #23880 |
In article <jv2qgt$s7c$1@speranza.aioe.org>, jacob navia <jacob@jspamsink.org> wrote: > >We have discussed the glib several times in this group. Specifically, >the behavior of "xmalloc" of the glib was questioned that aborts the >program instead of returning NULL. Yes, it has major problems. But it also has millions of installations and thousands of programmers are already familiar with it. > >The basic problem is that the glib is GNU, and that means that it can't >be used outside the restrictions of the GPL. I don't see how this matters. Was there a public domain implementation of all the C89 functions before they were standardized? My point would be equally valid if I used the Microsoft equivalent to GLib as an example, but I don't know what the Microsoft equivalent to GLib is. (I assume they have a similar library of non-standard utility functions with trees and hash tables and such.) -- Alan Curry
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| From | jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-29 20:56 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <jv411k$qpg$1@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #23901 |
Le 29/07/12 19:27, Alan Curry a écrit : > In article <jv2qgt$s7c$1@speranza.aioe.org>, > jacob navia <jacob@jspamsink.org> wrote: >> >> We have discussed the glib several times in this group. Specifically, >> the behavior of "xmalloc" of the glib was questioned that aborts the >> program instead of returning NULL. > > Yes, it has major problems. But it also has millions of installations > and thousands of programmers are already familiar with it. > So, you propose that the standard accepts something hat has "major problems" as you say just because it is used in GTK+ ? What is the logic behin d that? I do not see any. >> >> The basic problem is that the glib is GNU, and that means that it can't >> be used outside the restrictions of the GPL. > > I don't see how this matters. Was there a public domain implementation > of all the C89 functions before they were standardized? > > My point would be equally valid if I used the Microsoft equivalent to > GLib as an example, but I don't know what the Microsoft equivalent to > GLib is. (I assume they have a similar library of non-standard utility > functions with trees and hash tables and such.) > Microsoft has abandonned any development in C or C++ since the adoption of the C# language. Even Visual Basic now runs in the virtual .net machine, as do many other languages that are just different language front ends for the .net VM. Of course there isn't any official announcement of this but you can see where the Microsoft emphasis is just by reading between the lines There isn't any new versions of the SDK since several years now, the developments of the C++ wrappers for the windows API has ceased, and in general Microsoft is going in the direction of "managed" C++ if at all. So, from that side there isn't anything. From the linux/gnu side GTK+ uses the glib yes, but I do not know of many major software that uses that stuff OUTSIDE gtk+. I would be interested to know if there is any. Can you name a few? Thanks
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| From | pacman@kosh.dhis.org (Alan Curry) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-30 00:07 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <jv4j8t$3k7$1@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #23902 |
[resending post, it seems to have been lost] In article <jv411k$qpg$1@speranza.aioe.org>, jacob navia <jacob@jspamsink.org> wrote: >Le 29/07/12 19:27, Alan Curry a écrit : >> In article <jv2qgt$s7c$1@speranza.aioe.org>, >> jacob navia <jacob@jspamsink.org> wrote: >>> >>> We have discussed the glib several times in this group. Specifically, >>> the behavior of "xmalloc" of the glib was questioned that aborts the >>> program instead of returning NULL. >> >> Yes, it has major problems. But it also has millions of installations >> and thousands of programmers are already familiar with it. >> > >So, you propose that the standard accepts something hat has "major >problems" as you say just because it is used in GTK+ ? If you think I proposed it you should read again. I said a proposal based on a working library with known flaws is more reasonable than a proposal based on a library that's never seen real-world use (and which therefore has *unknown* flaws). > > From the linux/gnu side GTK+ uses the glib yes, but I do not know of >many major software that uses that stuff OUTSIDE gtk+. I would be >interested to know if there is any. Can you name a few? I stitched together some "aptitude why" queries and verified that at least 719 packages available in Debian require libglib but not libgtk. Here are some of the highlights: amanda-common: Advanced Maryland Automatic Network Disk Archiver (Client) asterisk: Open Source Private Branch Exchange (PBX) bluez: Bluetooth tools and daemons dvdauthor: create DVD-Video file system e16: the Enlightenment Window Manager DR16 fontforge: font editor gettext: GNU Internationalization utilities gphotofs: filesystem to mount digital cameras gpsim: Simulator for Microchip's PIC microcontrollers ifuse: FUSE module for iPhone and iPod Touch devices imagemagick: image manipulation programs jnettop: View hosts/ports taking up the most network traffic lilypond: A program for typesetting sheet music nbd-server: Network Block Device protocol - server pcb-lesstif: printed circuit board (pcb) design program - LessTif interface sobby: a dedicated server for collaborative editing usbip: USB device sharing system over IP network wireshark-common: network traffic analyzer - common files xplanet: planetary body renderer zorp: An advanced protocol analyzing firewall Quite a variety of stuff now depends on GLib. -- Alan Curry
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| From | "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-30 00:07 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <jv58ob$b23$3@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #23902 |
"jacob navia" <jacob@spamsink.net> wrote in message news:jv411k$qpg$1@speranza.aioe.org... > Le 29/07/12 19:27, Alan Curry a écrit : >> In article <jv2qgt$s7c$1@speranza.aioe.org>, >> jacob navia <jacob@jspamsink.org> wrote: >>> >>> We have discussed the glib several times in this group. Specifically, >>> the behavior of "xmalloc" of the glib was questioned that aborts the >>> program instead of returning NULL. >> >> Yes, it has major problems. But it also has millions of installations >> and thousands of programmers are already familiar with it. >> > > So, you propose that the standard accepts something hat has "major > problems" as you say just because it is used in GTK+ ? > > > What is the logic behin d that? I do not see any. > > >>> >>> The basic problem is that the glib is GNU, and that means that it can't >>> be used outside the restrictions of the GPL. >> >> I don't see how this matters. Was there a public domain implementation >> of all the C89 functions before they were standardized? >> >> My point would be equally valid if I used the Microsoft equivalent to >> GLib as an example, but I don't know what the Microsoft equivalent to >> GLib is. (I assume they have a similar library of non-standard utility >> functions with trees and hash tables and such.) >> > > Microsoft has abandonned any development in C or C++ since the adoption > of the C# language. You are a year or two behind the change of direction in that regard. C++ seems to be prime path these days at MS -- but I'm not an insider, I just get that impression from the external info they release, and I don't even hardly keep up with such things diligently. Where have you been? Insiders (and others), please correct me if my impression about that is wrong. > Even Visual Basic now runs in the virtual .net > machine, as do many other languages that are just different language > front ends for the .net VM. .net is on another level. Languages are still the foundation for "real" software product. .net is there for those who want high-level APIs that can deliver product on Windows fast. (Noted and granted that a company's product built on top of .net may be more of a toll-stop entry onto the Windows highway than a "real" software product). > Of course there isn't any official announcement of this but you can > see where the Microsoft emphasis is just by reading between the lines You seem to be living in the past? It was obvious to even the casual observer that C# was a prime path at MS for awhile. They even tried to bastardize C++ by introducing C++/CLI at the time. Now if that isn't a bastard of a name, nothing is (!): "Oh yes, and have you met our son? His name is C++ (/CLI). Yes, half human, and 10% artificiality. (Don't ask about the rest -- you *don't* want to know). C# started out as a competitive response to java. C# has merits. I defy any C++ programmer (I cannot say C programmer, but it may be so too) to examine, to some thorough degree, C# and *not* come away a better programmer. I am pointing at those C/C++ programmers that don't really use or eval other languages much. Then again, it could likely be that examining C# cured some of my deficiencies in understanding about certain topics and others don't have those or any deficiencies. It is worth a look, IMO. On that note, it would be much worth a look at the container architecture if one was creating such a thing. Again, I'm not an insider and spurt out what I think I know based upon what I read and hear -- and I'm hardly up with current events either, but Jacob seems to be too far removed and needs to "read the paper" a bit IMO. I *encourage* factual correction, for then my brain gets reprogrammed with current data. Yes, I am a cyborg. > > There isn't any new versions of the SDK since several years now, What do you care? You are a C programmer and compete directly with MS and .net. You're not Johnny or Jainie pointing-and-clicking their ways to software production nirvana. Get a bit more lax, though, and they may do just that! (Ref: the movie with Sly Stallone as the thawed-out cop in the future world where Taco Bell is then "Fine Dining"). > the > developments of the C++ wrappers for the windows API has ceased, and > in general Microsoft is going in the direction of "managed" C++ if > at all. "Hello". What year is this please? Someone post that info so that I can know whether I am insane or Jacob is asleep. > > So, from that side there isn't anything. > "So", via your decree? I am sceptical now. I was proceeding as if you did not have a "white paper" about your CCL, and was expecting you to "shut me up" with: "dude, the white paper is available at <link>". You have on gun and holster, but no bullets? Duel in October you said -- you better learn to shoot fast and straight before then, because it's the real thing and the talk is about to end. You're not thinking about backing out and waiting for next committee meeting which would require more bits to convey the date, are you? Need more time? You got two months -- use them. I suggest you create the white paper and pander it around the guru circles and let them tear up each detail. In private. You're not developing a product, don't need NDA, and that makes it waaay easier. People who like words, love the challenge of crosswords. Guru developers, love evaluating code, for it expands their knowledge synergistically. Then there are architects and designers, most of who couldn't program their way out of a subway and wouldn't care to, and your CCL is what they do and it behooves you to get their input. God bless those who can work for a paycheck. > From the linux/gnu side GTK+ uses the glib yes, but I do not know of > many major software that uses that stuff OUTSIDE gtk+. I would be > interested to know if there is any. Can you name a few? > > Thanks > >
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| From | Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-29 11:58 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <lnd33e4co6.fsf@nuthaus.mib.org> |
| In reply to | #23901 |
pacman@kosh.dhis.org (Alan Curry) writes:
> In article <jv2qgt$s7c$1@speranza.aioe.org>,
> jacob navia <jacob@jspamsink.org> wrote:
>>
>>We have discussed the glib several times in this group. Specifically,
>>the behavior of "xmalloc" of the glib was questioned that aborts the
>>program instead of returning NULL.
>
> Yes, it has major problems. But it also has millions of installations
> and thousands of programmers are already familiar with it.
And as far as I can tell, glib has no function called "xmalloc".
Perhaps it was in an earlier version?
--
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) kst-u@mib.org <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
Will write code for food.
"We must do something. This is something. Therefore, we must do this."
-- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"
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| From | jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-29 22:06 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <jv4547$4p7$1@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #23903 |
Le 29/07/12 20:58, Keith Thompson a écrit : > > And as far as I can tell, glib has no function called "xmalloc". > Perhaps it was in an earlier version? > We have discussed this to death but here we go again. http://eli.thegreenplace.net/2009/10/30/handling-out-of-memory-conditions-in-c/ Examples – libraries In this section, I present the OOM policies of a couple of well-known libraries. Glib Glib is a cross platform utility library in C, used most notably for GTK+. At first sight, Glib’s approach to memory allocation is flexible. It provides two functions (with several variations): g_malloc: attempts to allocate memory and exits with an error if the allocation fails, using g_error [1]. This is the abort policy. g_try_malloc: attempts to allocate memory and just returns NULL if that fails, without aborting. This way, Glib leaves the programmer the choice – you can choose the policy. However, the story doesn’t end here. What does Glib use for its own utilities? Let’s check g_array for instance. Allocation of a new array is done by means of calling g_array_maybe_expand that uses g_realloc, which is implemented with the same abort policy as g_malloc – it aborts when the memory can’t be allocated. Curiously, Glib isn’t consistent with this policy. Many modules use g_malloc, but a couple (such as the gfileutils module) use g_try_malloc and notify the caller on memory allocation errors. So what do we have here? It seems that one of the most popular C libraries out there uses the abort policy of memory allocations. Take that into account when writing applications that make use of Glib – if you’re planning some kind of graceful OOM recovery, you’re out of luck.
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| From | jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-29 22:23 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <jv464e$6v8$1@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #23901 |
You gdon't glike ghaving gall gyour gvariables gprexfed gwith g?
Why, you don't like the following code?
#include <glib.h>
gint main (gint argc, gchar **argv)
{
gchar *s = g_strdup ("Hello there!");
g_print ("%s\n", s);
g_free (s);
}
:-)
Got that from
https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!msg/comp.lang.c/DqFUdNyf_uY/3s3hef9fAsMJ
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| From | Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-30 00:13 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <jv4ci1$bua$1@solani.org> |
| In reply to | #23906 |
On Sun, 29 Jul 2012 22:23:46 +0200
jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> wrote:
> You gdon't glike ghaving gall gyour gvariables gprexfed gwith g?
>
> Why, you don't like the following code?
>
> #include <glib.h>
>
> gint main (gint argc, gchar **argv)
> {
> gchar *s = g_strdup ("Hello there!");
> g_print ("%s\n", s);
> g_free (s);
> }
>
> :-)
>
> Got that from
> https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!msg/comp.lang.c/DqFUdNyf_uY/3s3hef9fAsMJ
>
>
C doesn't have namespaces ;)
--
drwxr-xr-x 2 bmaxa bmaxa 4096 Jul 29 16:36 .
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| From | "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-30 00:13 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <jv58od$b23$4@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #23910 |
"Melzzzzz" <mel@zzzzz.invalid> wrote in message news:jv4ci1$bua$1@solani.org... > C doesn't have namespaces ;) C invented C++ namespaces. In C it was a technique. I C++ it was formalized and developed.
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| From | Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-30 01:10 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <lnzk6h3c0n.fsf@nuthaus.mib.org> |
| In reply to | #23923 |
"Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> writes:
> "Melzzzzz" <mel@zzzzz.invalid> wrote in message
> news:jv4ci1$bua$1@solani.org...
>> C doesn't have namespaces ;)
>
> C invented C++ namespaces. In C it was a technique. I C++ it was formalized
> and developed.
That doesn't make a lot of sense.
--
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) kst-u@mib.org <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
Will write code for food.
"We must do something. This is something. Therefore, we must do this."
-- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"
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| From | "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-30 02:57 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <jv5ibj$1k3$1@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #23931 |
Keith Thompson wrote: > "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> writes: >> "Melzzzzz" <mel@zzzzz.invalid> wrote in message >> news:jv4ci1$bua$1@solani.org... >>> C doesn't have namespaces ;) >> >> C invented C++ namespaces. In C it was a technique. I C++ it was >> formalized and developed. > > That doesn't make a lot of sense. Oh? Apparently you have motive.
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| From | Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-30 15:47 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnk1db4p.ph6.grahn+nntp@frailea.sa.invalid> |
| In reply to | #23933 |
On Mon, 2012-07-30, Ansel wrote: > Keith Thompson wrote: >> "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> writes: >>> "Melzzzzz" <mel@zzzzz.invalid> wrote in message >>> news:jv4ci1$bua$1@solani.org... >>>> C doesn't have namespaces ;) >>> >>> C invented C++ namespaces. In C it was a technique. I C++ it was >>> formalized and developed. >> >> That doesn't make a lot of sense. > > Oh? Apparently you have motive. "-- Let's see ... Mr Thompson had a motive to invent namespaces, *and* he had access to a wood-chipper. We also found stack traces from November 1980 in his car. Unfortunately, he has an alibi for that night." /Jorgen -- // Jorgen Grahn <grahn@ Oo o. . . \X/ snipabacken.se> O o .
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| From | Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-30 13:01 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <lnvch52f3y.fsf@nuthaus.mib.org> |
| In reply to | #23933 |
"Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> writes:
> Keith Thompson wrote:
>> "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> writes:
>>> "Melzzzzz" <mel@zzzzz.invalid> wrote in message
>>> news:jv4ci1$bua$1@solani.org...
>>>> C doesn't have namespaces ;)
>>>
>>> C invented C++ namespaces. In C it was a technique. I C++ it was
>>> formalized and developed.
>>
>> That doesn't make a lot of sense.
>
> Oh? Apparently you have motive.
What are you talking about?
No C did not invent C++ namespaces. The C standard does use
the phrase "name space", but it doesn't refer to the same thing.
C does not have user-defined namespaces (apart from the kludge of
using consistent prefixes in identifiers).
And I honestly have no idea what you mean by "Apparently you have
motive".
--
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) kst-u@mib.org <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
Will write code for food.
"We must do something. This is something. Therefore, we must do this."
-- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"
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| From | Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-30 04:53 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <166d191b-4b6a-4a49-82e8-5c40cf35b401@f30g2000vbz.googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #23931 |
On Jul 30, 9:10 am, Keith Thompson <ks...@mib.org> wrote: > "Ansel" <tinker...@trytospammenowloser.com> writes: > > "Melzzzzz" <m...@zzzzz.invalid> wrote in message > >news:jv4ci1$bua$1@solani.org... > >> C doesn't have namespaces ;) it does actually. It has several. > > C invented C++ namespaces. In C it was a technique. I C++ it was formalized > > and developed. > > That doesn't make a lot of sense. because it's nonsense. If he means it is common to use naming conventions to distinguish namespaces in C, then this was common in plenty of other languages.
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| From | Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-30 13:04 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <lnr4rt2ez2.fsf@nuthaus.mib.org> |
| In reply to | #23946 |
Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> writes:
[...]
> because it's nonsense. If he means it is common to use naming
> conventions
> to distinguish namespaces in C, then this was common in plenty of
> other
> languages.
Nick, if this layout is a response to my "A plea for short lines
in posts here", ragged lines like this are even harder to read than
overly long lines. Compare to this:
> because it's nonsense. If he means it is common to use naming
> conventions to distinguish namespaces in C, then this was common in
> plenty of other languages.
--
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) kst-u@mib.org <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
Will write code for food.
"We must do something. This is something. Therefore, we must do this."
-- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"
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| From | "Ansel" <tinker454@trytospammenowloser.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-08-02 02:11 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <jvdebt$vv7$2@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #23946 |
Nick Keighley wrote: > On Jul 30, 9:10 am, Keith Thompson <ks...@mib.org> wrote: >> "Ansel" <tinker...@trytospammenowloser.com> writes: >>> "Melzzzzz" <m...@zzzzz.invalid> wrote in message >>> news:jv4ci1$bua$1@solani.org... > >>>> C doesn't have namespaces ;) > > it does actually. It has several. > >>> C invented C++ namespaces. In C it was a technique. I C++ it was >>> formalized and developed. >> >> That doesn't make a lot of sense. > > because it's nonsense. If he means it is common to use naming > conventions > to distinguish namespaces in C, then this was common in plenty of > other > languages. But we are talking about the C-to-C++ evolution. C++ automated and abstracted-away the decorative naming conventions used by C programmers as a technique, into a some keywords. To say that C++ invented anything new would be overstating it.
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| From | James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-08-02 06:52 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <jvdm50$2bm$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #24117 |
On 08/02/2012 04:11 AM, Ansel wrote: > Nick Keighley wrote: >> On Jul 30, 9:10 am, Keith Thompson <ks...@mib.org> wrote: >>> "Ansel" <tinker...@trytospammenowloser.com> writes: ... >>>> C invented C++ namespaces. In C it was a technique. I C++ it was >>>> formalized and developed. >>> >>> That doesn't make a lot of sense. >> >> because it's nonsense. If he means it is common to use naming >> conventions >> to distinguish namespaces in C, then this was common in plenty of >> other >> languages. > > But we are talking about the C-to-C++ evolution. C++ automated and > abstracted-away the decorative naming conventions used by C programmers as a > technique, into a some keywords. To say that C++ invented anything new would > be overstating it. C programmers didn't invent that technique; it long pre-dates C. C++ did invent the keywords, special syntax, and the rules associated with those keywords and syntax. To say that "C invented C++ namespaces" is nonsense because "C++ namespaces" refers very specifically to those keywords, that syntax, and the associated rules. It is not a term that can be loosely extended to cover the naming conventions that were used in other languages to achieve the same goal. What you're saying is roughly comparable to denying the significance of the invention of the prefix ++ operator, by pointing out that it's just equivalent to i = i + 1. There's no denying the equivalence, but recognizing that fact doesn't reduce the significance of the invention. -- James Kuyper
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| From | James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-08-02 06:46 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <jvdlqh$vq4$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #23946 |
On 07/30/2012 07:53 AM, Nick Keighley wrote: > On Jul 30, 9:10�am, Keith Thompson <ks...@mib.org> wrote: >> "Ansel" <tinker...@trytospammenowloser.com> writes: >>> "Melzzzzz" <m...@zzzzz.invalid> wrote in message >>> news:jv4ci1$bua$1@solani.org... > >>>> C doesn't have namespaces ;) > > it does actually. It has several. No, what C has are name spaces, a somewhat different concept than namespaces. C++ has them too, but fewer (and correspondingly less significant) than C's name spaces. -- James Kuyper
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| From | Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-07-30 00:41 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <jv4hmt$1ef$1@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #23906 |
jacob navia wrote: > You gdon't glike ghaving gall gyour gvariables gprexfed gwith g? The pthreads API prefixes all its symbols with pthread_,[1] and that didn't stopped it from being made an interantional standard or becoming widely adopted. Rui Maciel [1] http://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/007908799/xsh/pthread.h.html
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