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Re: A love of languages

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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On 08/04/2022 17:15, David Brown wrote:
> On 08/04/2022 16:31, Bart wrote:
>> On 08/04/2022 14:08, David Brown wrote:
>>> On 08/04/2022 14:16, Juha Nieminen wrote:
>>>> In comp.lang.c++ Christian Gollwitzer <auriocus@gmx.de> wrote:
>>>>> Additionally, it's hard to get Bash working on Windows. Bash is rather
>>>>> useless without a bunch of other tools like awk, sed, cp, mv, find, 
>>>>> ...
>>>>>
>>>>> It is way easier to get a working Python installation.
>>>>
>>>> Is Python any easier?
>>>>
>>>> It's not like you can just run "apt install python" in Windows.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Installing Python on Windows is simple - using the standard Windows 
>>> installation method.  Go to "www.python.org", click "Downloads", 
>>> click "Windows", and download and install it.  (Or perhaps skip a 
>>> click or two by just googling "install python" on a Windows machine.)
>>>
>>> If you want to do more complicated Python work on Windows, and have 
>>> multiple versions installed, it can get a little more complicated. 
>>> But for simple "install the latest Python", it's easy.
>>>
>>> But anyone making a Python program that they want to make easy for 
>>> Windows can also use "py2exe" (or a similar system - there are a few 
>>> to choose from) that combines your Python code along with the Python 
>>> runtime, interpreter and required libraries, into a single exe file. 
>>> It can be quite big - you probably have a minimum size of about 8 or 
>>> 10 MB, but that's rarely a problem.
>>
>> I've downloaded one of those before; even for a simple program, there 
>> was an annoying start-up delay when I tried to run it.
>>
> 
> You don't use Python when you are looking for top speed.

This is start-up speed not execution speed.

One huge advantage of running scripting code from source is that there 
is little or no compile or link time; it's instant. Or it should be.

I think it was something like a half-second delay; you can imagine that 
if invoked dozens of times in succession to perform some trivial asks, 
it adds up.

>  A py2exe 
> package is a bit like these "portable" versions of Windows applications 
> that you get for running from USB sticks - it contains a whole lot of 
> files and libraries, packed into a self-extracting zip file.  Of course 
> it takes time to start.

Does it do that? In that case it's an installer, not a standalone EXE 
that you run directly as though it was a regular application built with 
a compiler.

>> Maybe it'll be different on my new machine, so I went to the py2exe 
>> site; there are ready-built distributions, but they are all .whl files 
>> that Windows knows nothing about. (Remember this is a program for 
>> Windows that runs on Windows.)
> 
> Did you bother to read the "installation" part on the py2exe PyPI page? 

I have now. I was already lost by step 2 (of 5). (Step 6 states that 
py2exe is not an installer builder.)

So you can't just do 'py2exe prog.py' as I said.

>   This is not the newsgroup for discussing Python, much less for 
> hand-holding people through the installation of programs they know 
> nothing about.
> 
> Suffice it to say that anyone who is familiar enough with Python to be 
> able to write a package manager in it, will have no problem making a 
> stand-alone Windows executable and/or installer for Windows users who 
> don't want to install Python separately.  Let's leave it at that - if 
> you want to know more, google for it or go to a Python group.
> 
> (And if you want to advertise your own scripting language yet again, 
> please do that somewhere else too.

Do you see me posting any links to it?

It is FACT that, if you have an interpreted language, then you all you 
should require to run any program is the interpreter, and the program, 
ideally in no more than two files.

If /I/ can do that and with no fuss, then anyone ought to be able to. 
(Actually I could do this on both Windows and Linux at one point.)

Of course such arguments are never going to cut any ice with people who 
work in Unix-like environments who create programs for people also 
working with Unix environments. They have no problem with dozens of 
sprawing, disseminated dependencies.

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Thread

A love of languages Jack Lemmon <invalid@invalid.net> - 2022-03-27 17:00 +0100
  Re: A love of languages Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2022-03-27 18:24 +0200
  Re: A love of languages Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-03-28 23:08 +0000
    Re: A love of languages Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> - 2022-03-30 21:53 +0100
      Re: A love of languages David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-03-31 10:29 +0200
      Re: A love of languages Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-03-31 08:29 +0000
        Re: A love of languages Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-04-04 06:00 +0000
          Re: A love of languages Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-04-04 08:28 +0000
            Re: A love of languages Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> - 2022-04-05 21:10 +0100
              Re: A love of languages red floyd <no.spam.here@its.invalid> - 2022-04-05 13:28 -0700
              Re: A love of languages om@iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) - 2022-04-11 13:24 -0400
              Re: A love of languages om@iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) - 2022-04-11 19:13 -0400
        Re: A love of languages legalize+jeeves@mail.xmission.com (Richard) - 2022-04-06 22:18 +0000
          Re: A love of languages Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-04-06 16:16 -0700
          Re: A love of languages Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-04-07 09:02 +0000
          Re: A love of languages David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-04-07 11:24 +0200
            Re: A love of languages Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-04-07 09:42 +0000
              Re: A love of languages David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-04-07 12:02 +0200
              Re: A love of languages Christian Gollwitzer <auriocus@gmx.de> - 2022-04-07 21:54 +0200
                Re: A love of languages Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-04-08 10:49 +0000
                Re: A love of languages Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-04-08 12:16 +0000
                Re: A love of languages David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-04-08 15:08 +0200
                Re: A love of languages Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2022-04-08 15:31 +0100
                Re: A love of languages David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-04-08 18:15 +0200
                Re: A love of languages Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2022-04-08 19:14 +0100
                Re: A love of languages scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2022-04-08 14:53 +0000
                Re: A love of languages David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-04-08 18:18 +0200
                Re: A love of languages scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2022-04-08 17:47 +0000
                Re: A love of languages Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-04-09 09:13 +0000
                Re: A love of languages scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2022-04-08 14:51 +0000
                Re: A love of languages Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2022-04-11 08:28 +0000
              Re: A love of languages legalize+jeeves@mail.xmission.com (Richard) - 2022-04-07 20:54 +0000

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