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Happy Dec-10 Day!!!

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  Happy Dec-10 Day!!! "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-12-10 04:15 -0600
    Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-12-10 10:22 +0000
      Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-12-10 13:31 -0500
        Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-10 15:23 -0500
    Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! mausg@mail.com - 2015-12-10 10:45 +0000
      Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-12-10 13:30 -0500
        Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! mausg@mail.com - 2015-12-10 18:49 +0000
          Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-12-10 19:15 +0000
            Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-12-10 14:42 -0500
              Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2015-12-10 12:45 -0700
                Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-12-10 23:48 +0000
                  Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-12-10 23:09 -0500
                Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-12-11 14:56 -0600
              Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-12-11 06:10 -0800
                Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! mausg@mail.com - 2015-12-11 16:21 +0000
                  Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-12-11 14:43 -0500
                    Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! mausg@mail.com - 2015-12-11 21:56 +0000
                      Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Andrew Swallow <am.swallow@btinternet.com> - 2015-12-12 04:51 +0000
                      Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-12 08:11 -0500
                        Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com - 2015-12-13 13:50 -0800
                          Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-12-14 00:05 +0000
                            Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-12-13 21:48 -0500
                    Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-12-11 21:34 -0800
                      Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2015-12-12 08:38 +0000
                        Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-12-12 10:47 -0500
                          Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-12-12 18:41 +0000
                            Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Andrew Swallow <am.swallow@btinternet.com> - 2015-12-13 02:33 +0000
                              Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2015-12-13 23:48 -0600
                                Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-12-14 19:39 +0000
                            Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! mausg@mail.com - 2015-12-13 10:12 +0000
                              Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-12-13 12:54 -0500
                          Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2015-12-14 09:19 +0000
                            Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2015-12-14 14:31 +0000
                          Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2015-12-14 19:05 -0400
                      Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! mausg@mail.com - 2015-12-12 11:31 +0000
                        Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-12-12 10:52 -0500
                          Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! JimP <solosam90@gmail.com> - 2015-12-12 09:59 -0600
                            Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-12-12 11:50 -0500
                        Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-12-12 12:14 -0800
                          Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-12-12 21:37 -0500
                          Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Andrew Swallow <am.swallow@btinternet.com> - 2015-12-13 02:37 +0000
                            Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2015-12-12 22:55 -0600
                              Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-12-13 00:02 -0500
                                Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! mausg@mail.com - 2015-12-13 10:24 +0000
                                  Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com - 2015-12-13 13:59 -0800
                                    Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-14 06:09 -0500
                              Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Andrew Swallow <am.swallow@btinternet.com> - 2015-12-13 10:18 +0000
                                Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! mausg@mail.com - 2015-12-13 11:20 +0000
                                  Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-12-13 15:50 +0000
                                    Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! mausg@mail.com - 2015-12-13 18:41 +0000
                                  Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2015-12-13 11:35 -0800
                              Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! mausg@mail.com - 2015-12-13 10:17 +0000
                          Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-12-13 15:50 +0000
                            Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-12-13 12:58 -0500
                  Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-12-11 15:01 -0600
                    Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-12-11 21:36 -0800
                Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-12-11 14:31 -0500
        Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-12-10 19:11 +0000
    Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2015-12-10 15:49 -0400
      Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Lawrence Statton <lawrence@senguio.mx> - 2015-12-10 17:07 -0600
        Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2015-12-10 20:31 -0500
          Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-12-11 13:35 +0000
          Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-12-11 06:14 -0800
            Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2015-12-11 13:48 -0500
            Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-12-11 15:07 -0600
    Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2015-12-10 12:01 -0800
      Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! Bill Findlay <yaldnif.w@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2015-12-10 23:22 +0000
        Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! "gareth" <no.spam@thank.you.invalid> - 2015-12-11 11:01 +0000
      Re: Happy Dec-10 Day!!! "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-12-11 14:53 -0600

Page 3 of 4 — ← Prev page 1 2 [3] 4  Next page →

#155131

On 12/12/2015 20:14, Quadibloc wrote:
> On Saturday, December 12, 2015 at 4:31:26 AM UTC-7, ma...@mail.com wrote:
>
>> T'is a long time since I read "Homage to Catalonia", but I think it is
>> far more important than anything Hemingway wrote. Young idealist leftwingers
>> would find out that the world is far more complicated than they think.
>
>> Yes, Hemingway is a very good writer.
>
> In this case, though, while Hemingway _is_ more broadly recognized as a great
> writer than Orwell, I was focused on something far more narrow. I knew that
> there was at least one bullfighting scene in at least one of Hemingway's books
> set in Spain. In the case of "Homage to Catalonia", I was unsure.
>
> Basically, I was trying to make sense out of the statement relative to 'some
> animals being more important than others' which seemed to quite reverse the
> point of 'Animal Farm' - and given the geographical location of Catalonia, I
> saw a possible explanation of the joke.
>
> John Savard
>

The communists were liars. They promised equality but practised an 
aristocratic system. 'Animal Farm' was showing this and the excuses made 
when they were caught.

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#155134

"Andrew Swallow" wrrote:

> On 12/12/2015 20:14, Quadibloc wrote:
>> On Saturday, December 12, 2015 at 4:31:26 AM UTC-7, ma...@mail.com wrote:
>>
>>> T'is a long time since I read "Homage to Catalonia", but I think it is
>>> far more important than anything Hemingway wrote. Young idealist 
>>> leftwingers
>>> would find out that the world is far more complicated than they think.
>>
>>> Yes, Hemingway is a very good writer.
>>
>> In this case, though, while Hemingway _is_ more broadly recognized as a 
>> great
>> writer than Orwell, I was focused on something far more narrow. I knew 
>> that
>> there was at least one bullfighting scene in at least one of Hemingway's 
>> books
>> set in Spain. In the case of "Homage to Catalonia", I was unsure.
>>
>> Basically, I was trying to make sense out of the statement relative to 
>> 'some
>> animals being more important than others' which seemed to quite reverse 
>> the
>> point of 'Animal Farm' - and given the geographical location of 
>> Catalonia, I
>> saw a possible explanation of the joke.
>>
>> John Savard
>>
>
> The communists were liars. They promised equality but practised an 
> aristocratic system. 'Animal Farm' was showing this and the excuses made 
> when they were caught.

Are you sure aristocrat is the word you want? I thought aristocrats were 
such because of inherited genes?  Who was Stalin's father? Kruschev's? 
Gorbachev's?

I started _Animal Farm_ but never finished it, I think my expectations were 
too high. 

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#155135

On Sat, 12 Dec 2015, Osmium wrote:

> "Andrew Swallow" wrrote:
>
>> On 12/12/2015 20:14, Quadibloc wrote:
>>> On Saturday, December 12, 2015 at 4:31:26 AM UTC-7, ma...@mail.com wrote:
>>> 
>>>> T'is a long time since I read "Homage to Catalonia", but I think it is
>>>> far more important than anything Hemingway wrote. Young idealist 
>>>> leftwingers
>>>> would find out that the world is far more complicated than they think.
>>> 
>>>> Yes, Hemingway is a very good writer.
>>> 
>>> In this case, though, while Hemingway _is_ more broadly recognized as a 
>>> great
>>> writer than Orwell, I was focused on something far more narrow. I knew 
>>> that
>>> there was at least one bullfighting scene in at least one of Hemingway's 
>>> books
>>> set in Spain. In the case of "Homage to Catalonia", I was unsure.
>>> 
>>> Basically, I was trying to make sense out of the statement relative to 
>>> 'some
>>> animals being more important than others' which seemed to quite reverse 
>>> the
>>> point of 'Animal Farm' - and given the geographical location of Catalonia, 
>>> I
>>> saw a possible explanation of the joke.
>>> 
>>> John Savard
>>> 
>> 
>> The communists were liars. They promised equality but practised an 
>> aristocratic system. 'Animal Farm' was showing this and the excuses made 
>> when they were caught.
>
> Are you sure aristocrat is the word you want? I thought aristocrats were such 
> because of inherited genes?  Who was Stalin's father? Kruschev's? 
> Gorbachev's?
>
His point, I'd say, is that while Communism claimed to be flat, in reality 
there was the same hierarchy that existed elsewhere.

So the bosses got the food and the luxury and the front row seats, and in 
the Communist system, but leaders got the food and the luxury and the 
front row seats.  The rest had to wait in line hoping there'd be food to 
buy, and had to do without a car and likely jammed into a small apartment, 
and they got to go to the gulag if they complained too much.


> I started _Animal Farm_ but never finished it, I think my expectations were 
> too high. 
>
I've never reread it, so i suspect that says something.

   Michael

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#155140

On 2015-12-13, Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> wrote:
> On Sat, 12 Dec 2015, Osmium wrote:
>
>> "Andrew Swallow" wrrote:
>>
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> The communists were liars. They promised equality but practised an 
>>> aristocratic system. 'Animal Farm' was showing this and the excuses made 
>>> when they were caught.
>>
>> Are you sure aristocrat is the word you want? I thought aristocrats were such 
>> because of inherited genes?  Who was Stalin's father? Kruschev's? 
>> Gorbachev's?
>>
> His point, I'd say, is that while Communism claimed to be flat, in reality 
> there was the same hierarchy that existed elsewhere.
>
> So the bosses got the food and the luxury and the front row seats, and in 
> the Communist system, but leaders got the food and the luxury and the 
> front row seats.  The rest had to wait in line hoping there'd be food to 
> buy, and had to do without a car and likely jammed into a small apartment, 
> and they got to go to the gulag if they complained too much.
>
Many ex-eastern block people have this to say

``Under Communism, we had jobs, maybe not great jobs, but jobs
  We had houses, maybe not great houses, but houses
  We had a health service, maybe etc.''



>
>> I started _Animal Farm_ but never finished it, I think my expectations were 
>> too high. 
>>
> I've never reread it, so i suspect that says something.
>
>    Michael
>


-- 
greymaus
 .
  .
...

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#155161

On Sunday, December 13, 2015 at 5:24:22 AM UTC-5, ma...@mail.com wrote:

> Many ex-eastern block people have this to say
> 
> ``Under Communism, we had jobs, maybe not great jobs, but jobs
>   We had houses, maybe not great houses, but houses
>   We had a health service, maybe etc.''
> 

Indeed, I have heard them say this.

But upon closer examination, they will admit their jobs were
terrible, their houses were terrible (families often doubling up
in tiny apartments), etc.  More significantly, when the 
opportunity arose, they jumped at the chance to flee communism
and become capitalists.

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#155170

<hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com> wrote:
> On Sunday, December 13, 2015 at 5:24:22 AM UTC-5, ma...@mail.com wrote:
> 
>> Many ex-eastern block people have this to say
>> 
>> ``Under Communism, we had jobs, maybe not great jobs, but jobs
>> We had houses, maybe not great houses, but houses
>> We had a health service, maybe etc.''
>> 
> 
> Indeed, I have heard them say this.
> 
> But upon closer examination, they will admit their jobs were
> terrible, their houses were terrible (families often doubling up
> in tiny apartments), etc.  More significantly, when the 
> opportunity arose, they jumped at the chance to flee communism
> and become capitalists.
> 

Some did, some didn't.  Retirees in Russia are much worse off now, because
inflation has destroyed the value of their pension.  Factory managers
turned themselves into factory owners, many ordinary workers had difficulty
making the adjustment.

-- 
Pete

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#155138

On 13/12/2015 04:55, Osmium wrote:
> "Andrew Swallow" wrrote:
>
>> On 12/12/2015 20:14, Quadibloc wrote:
>>> On Saturday, December 12, 2015 at 4:31:26 AM UTC-7, ma...@mail.com
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> T'is a long time since I read "Homage to Catalonia", but I think it is
>>>> far more important than anything Hemingway wrote. Young idealist
>>>> leftwingers
>>>> would find out that the world is far more complicated than they think.
>>>
>>>> Yes, Hemingway is a very good writer.
>>>
>>> In this case, though, while Hemingway _is_ more broadly recognized as
>>> a great
>>> writer than Orwell, I was focused on something far more narrow. I
>>> knew that
>>> there was at least one bullfighting scene in at least one of
>>> Hemingway's books
>>> set in Spain. In the case of "Homage to Catalonia", I was unsure.
>>>
>>> Basically, I was trying to make sense out of the statement relative
>>> to 'some
>>> animals being more important than others' which seemed to quite
>>> reverse the
>>> point of 'Animal Farm' - and given the geographical location of
>>> Catalonia, I
>>> saw a possible explanation of the joke.
>>>
>>> John Savard
>>>
>>
>> The communists were liars. They promised equality but practised an
>> aristocratic system. 'Animal Farm' was showing this and the excuses
>> made when they were caught.
>
> Are you sure aristocrat is the word you want? I thought aristocrats were
> such because of inherited genes?  Who was Stalin's father? Kruschev's?
> Gorbachev's?
>
> I started _Animal Farm_ but never finished it, I think my expectations
> were too high.

I do mean aristocratic.

First a similar hierarchy was imposed - with commissar replacing duke 
and factory director replacing lord of the manor. Those people got 
similar privileges and luxuries based on rank.

Second it is inherited. If you look around China and Russia you will 
find lots of officials who are grandchildren of the 'communist' 
officials who gained power after the revolution.

Most of the first generation of top communist officials turn out to have 
been middle class. With occupations like lawyer, priest and scholar. The 
revolution was a method of promotion.

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#155142

On 2015-12-13, Andrew Swallow <am.swallow@btinternet.com> wrote:
> On 13/12/2015 04:55, Osmium wrote:
>> "Andrew Swallow" wrrote:
>>
>>> On 12/12/2015 20:14, Quadibloc wrote:
>>>> On Saturday, December 12, 2015 at 4:31:26 AM UTC-7, ma...@mail.com
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>> The communists were liars. They promised equality but practised an
>>> aristocratic system. 'Animal Farm' was showing this and the excuses
>>> made when they were caught.
>>
>> Are you sure aristocrat is the word you want? I thought aristocrats were
>> such because of inherited genes?  Who was Stalin's father? Kruschev's?
>> Gorbachev's?
>>
>> I started _Animal Farm_ but never finished it, I think my expectations
>> were too high.
>
> I do mean aristocratic.
>
> First a similar hierarchy was imposed - with commissar replacing duke 
> and factory director replacing lord of the manor. Those people got 
> similar privileges and luxuries based on rank.
>
> Second it is inherited. If you look around China and Russia you will 
> find lots of officials who are grandchildren of the 'communist' 
> officials who gained power after the revolution.
>
> Most of the first generation of top communist officials turn out to have 
> been middle class. With occupations like lawyer, priest and scholar. The 
> revolution was a method of promotion.

Familys that have fallen in `class' are a fertile ground for revolutionaries,
the `lumpenproletariate' vent their frustrations in family of social group.
China are following their own path, as opposed to Russia, the Chinese anti-
corruption drive at the moment is catching VeryImportantPeople. Contrast to 
the UK-US answer, specially in the UK, where it seems to be a mark of status
that one can `walk' even with seeming good evidence of fraud.

Its amazing that many people regard Russia still as a Socialist country,
in an argument split, leftists still regard Russia as `good'.


-- 
greymaus
 .
  .
...

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#155145

On 2015-12-13, mausg@mail.com <mausg@mail.com> wrote:

> Familys that have fallen in `class' are a fertile ground for revolutionaries,
> the `lumpenproletariate' vent their frustrations in family of social group.
> China are following their own path, as opposed to Russia, the Chinese anti-
> corruption drive at the moment is catching VeryImportantPeople. Contrast to 
> the UK-US answer, specially in the UK, where it seems to be a mark of status
> that one can `walk' even with seeming good evidence of fraud.

Canada too.  Look up the Mike Duffy scandal.

-- 
/~\  cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs)
\ /  I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way.
 X   Top-posted messages will probably be ignored.  See RFC1855.
/ \  HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored.  Join the ASCII ribbon campaign!

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#155153

On 2015-12-13, Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote:
> On 2015-12-13, mausg@mail.com <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>
>> Familys that have fallen in `class' are a fertile ground for revolutionaries,
>> the `lumpenproletariate' vent their frustrations in famiy of social group.
                                                            ^or^     

>> China are following their own path, as opposed to Russia, the Chinese anti-
>> corruption drive at the moment is catching VeryImportantPeople. Contrast to 
>> the UK-US answer, specially in the UK, where it seems to be a mark of status
>> that one can `walk' even with seeming good evidence of fraud.
>
> Canada too.  Look up the Mike Duffy scandal.
>


-- 
greymaus
 .
  .
...

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#155154

mausg@mail.com writes:
> Familys that have fallen in `class' are a fertile ground for revolutionaries,
> the `lumpenproletariate' vent their frustrations in family of social group.
> China are following their own path, as opposed to Russia, the Chinese anti-
> corruption drive at the moment is catching VeryImportantPeople. Contrast to 
> the UK-US answer, specially in the UK, where it seems to be a mark of status
> that one can `walk' even with seeming good evidence of fraud.
>
> Its amazing that many people regard Russia still as a Socialist country,
> in an argument split, leftists still regard Russia as `good'.

Then there is the "Harvard responsible for the rise of Putin"

John Helmer: Convicted Fraudster Jonathan Hay, Harvard's Man Who Wrecked
Russia, Resurfaces in Ukraine
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2015/02/convicted-fraudster-jonathan-hay-harvards-man-who-wrecked-russia-resurfaces-in-ukraine.html
How Harvard lost Russia; The best and brightest of America's premier
university came to Moscow in the 1990s to teach Russians how to be
capitalists. This is the inside story of how their efforts led to
scandal and disgrace.
http://www.institutionalinvestor.com/Article/1020662/How-Harvard-lost-Russia.html
Russian Military Politics and Russia's 2010 Defense Doctrine
http://www.strategicstudiesinstitute.army.mil/pubs/display.cfm?pubID=1050

similar to articles about US efforts last decade responsible for the
rise of ISIS. and then there is "Success of Failure" (sometimes serves
blank page on 1st click and have to click again)
http://www.govexec.com/excellence/management-matters/2007/04/the-success-of-failure/24107/

but also:

Spies like Us
http://www.investingdaily.com/17693/spies-like-us/
How Booz Allen Hamilton Swallowed Washington
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-06-23/visualizing-how-booz-allen-hamilton-swallowed-washington

For The Record, Yes, George W. Bush Did Help Create ISIS
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/05/14/jeb-bush-isis_n_7284558.html
Blowback---The Washington War Party's Folly Comes Home To Roost
http://davidstockmanscontracorner.com/blowback-the-washington-war-partys-folly-comes-home-to-roost/
Memo To Jim Acosta And Other Clueless War Channel
Correspondents---Washington Can't Take Out "Those Bastards" Because
That's Not Its Goal
http://davidstockmanscontracorner.com/memo-to-jim-acosta-and-other-clueless-war-channel-correspondents-washington-cant-take-out-those-bastards-because-thats-not-its-goal/

-- 
virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970

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#155139

On 2015-12-13, Osmium <r124c4u102@comcast.net> wrote:
> "Andrew Swallow" wrrote:
>
>> On 12/12/2015 20:14, Quadibloc wrote:
>>> On Saturday, December 12, 2015 at 4:31:26 AM UTC-7, ma...@mail.com wrote:
>>>
>>>> T'is a long time since I read "Homage to Catalonia", but I think it is
>>>> far more important than anything Hemingway wrote. Young idealist 
>>>> leftwingers
>>>> would find out that the world is far more complicated than they think.
>>>
>>>> Yes, Hemingway is a very good writer.
>>>
>>> In this case, though, while Hemingway _is_ more broadly recognized as a 
>>> great
>>> writer than Orwell, I was focused on something far more narrow. I knew 
>>> that
>>> there was at least one bullfighting scene in at least one of Hemingway's 
>>> books
>>> set in Spain. In the case of "Homage to Catalonia", I was unsure.
>>>
>>> Basically, I was trying to make sense out of the statement relative to 
>>> 'some
>>> animals being more important than others' which seemed to quite reverse 
>>> the
>>> point of 'Animal Farm' - and given the geographical location of 
>>> Catalonia, I
>>> saw a possible explanation of the joke.
>>>
>>> John Savard
>>>
>>
>> The communists were liars. They promised equality but practised an 
>> aristocratic system. 'Animal Farm' was showing this and the excuses made 
>> when they were caught.
>
> Are you sure aristocrat is the word you want? I thought aristocrats were 
> such because of inherited genes?  Who was Stalin's father? 

Reputadly a priest of the local Georgian Church, who helped pay for his
(Good for the time) education

Kruschev's? 
> Gorbachev's?
>
> I started _Animal Farm_ but never finished it, I think my expectations were 
> too high. 
>


-- 
greymaus
 .
  .
...

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#155146

On 2015-12-12, Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote:

> Basically, I was trying to make sense out of the statement relative to 'some 
> animals being more important than others' which seemed to quite reverse the 
> point of 'Animal Farm' - and given the geographical location of Catalonia, I 
> saw a possible explanation of the joke.

Point of order: the actual word was not "important", but "equal", as in
"All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others."  The subtext
indeed meant "important", but the use of the word "equal" was a dig at
pseudo-egalitarian societies.

-- 
/~\  cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs)
\ /  I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way.
 X   Top-posted messages will probably be ignored.  See RFC1855.
/ \  HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored.  Join the ASCII ribbon campaign!

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#155151

On Sun, 13 Dec 2015, Charlie Gibbs wrote:

> On 2015-12-12, Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote:
>
>> Basically, I was trying to make sense out of the statement relative to 'some
>> animals being more important than others' which seemed to quite reverse the
>> point of 'Animal Farm' - and given the geographical location of Catalonia, I
>> saw a possible explanation of the joke.
>
> Point of order: the actual word was not "important", but "equal", as in
> "All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others."  The subtext
> indeed meant "important", but the use of the word "equal" was a dig at
> pseudo-egalitarian societies.
>
You're right, and I'm sorry I got that wrong in my original post.  With 
"equal" it's a much better line.

   Michael

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#155062

<mausg@mail.com> wrote in message news:slrnn6lu0s.32o.mausg@smaus.org...
> On 2015-12-11, Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote:
>> On Thursday, December 10, 2015 at 12:39:04 PM UTC-7, Michael Black wrote:
>>> On Thu, 10 Dec 2015, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
>>
>>> > I just finished reading "Down and Out in Paris and London", written by
>>> > George Orwell around 1933.  Ah, the good old days... NOT!
>>
>>> It wasn't written by Eric Blair?
>>
>> Didn't Eric Arthur Blair also use his pen name of "George Orwell" to 
>> write
>> "Down and Out in Paris and London" as well as his more famous later 
>> fictional
>> work of 1984?
>>
>> John Savard
>
> Wow! someone has just woken up.!
>
> Interesting  Thing, he served in the police in British India, and in
> later years, was remembered as being authoritive, even leading a
> police charge to break up a riot|protest.
>

Blair/Orwell wrote a short story titled "Shooting an Elephant" about his 
time in British India.  It seems that an elephant went out of his head and 
killed a person.  Afterward the elephant was okay and *not* dangerous, but 
the crowd was so worked up about the death of the person that Blair was 
forced to kill the elephant.

http://sites.cssmi.qc.ca/nkeeley/IMG/pdf/shootinganelephant.pdf

-- 

numerist at aquaporin4 dot com

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#155088

On Friday, December 11, 2015 at 2:01:54 PM UTC-7, Charles Richmond wrote:

> Blair/Orwell wrote a short story titled "Shooting an Elephant" about his 
> time in British India.  It seems that an elephant went out of his head and 
> killed a person.  Afterward the elephant was okay and *not* dangerous, but 
> the crowd was so worked up about the death of the person that Blair was 
> forced to kill the elephant.

I wonder if this inspired Ian Fleming when he wrote "The Man with the Golden Gun".

John Savard

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#155052

On Fri, 11 Dec 2015, Quadibloc wrote:

> On Thursday, December 10, 2015 at 12:39:04 PM UTC-7, Michael Black wrote:
>> On Thu, 10 Dec 2015, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
>
>>> I just finished reading "Down and Out in Paris and London", written by
>>> George Orwell around 1933.  Ah, the good old days... NOT!
>
>> It wasn't written by Eric Blair?
>
> Didn't Eric Arthur Blair also use his pen name of "George Orwell" to write
> "Down and Out in Paris and London" as well as his more famous later fictional
> work of 1984?
>
> John Savard
>
Yes, except his famous later fictional work was "1984", he died before we 
actually got to 1984.

   Michael

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#154975

On 2015-12-10, Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> wrote:

> On Thu, 10 Dec 2015, mausg@mail.com wrote:
>
>> On 2015-12-10, Charles Richmond <numerist@aquaporin4.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Happy Dec-10 Day!!!   Seems like this comes around *every* year!!! ;-)

I'm waiting for OCT31.  Only 15 (decimal, 17 octal) days to go.

>> And a Bah-Humbug to you as well
>>
> And we take note of that, for the naughty list.

#!sh
better watchout
better !cry
better !pout
lpr why
santaclaus <northpole >town
cat /etc/passwd >list
ncheck list
ncheck list
grep naughty list >nogiftlist
grep nice list >giftlist
santaclaus <northpole >town
who | grep sleeping
who | grep awake
who | grep -E "(bad|good)"
for i in goodness sake
do
  be good
done

-- 
/~\  cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs)
\ /  I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way.
 X   Top-posted messages will probably be ignored.  See RFC1855.
/ \  HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored.  Join the ASCII ribbon campaign!

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#154980

"Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> writes:

> Happy Dec-10 Day!!!   Seems like this comes around *every* year!!! ;-)

But you missed (OT here) Takeda Shingen's birthday on Dec. 1.  Did DEC
make a "DEC 1"?

-- 
Mike Spencer                  Nova Scotia, Canada

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#154990

Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> writes:

> "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> writes:
>
>> Happy Dec-10 Day!!!   Seems like this comes around *every* year!!! ;-)
>
> But you missed (OT here) Takeda Shingen's birthday on Dec. 1.  Did DEC
> make a "DEC 1"?

Technically, none of their machines were named the "DEC-anything"

There were commercially sold PDP 1,4,5,6,8,9,10,11, and 15.

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