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Groups > alt.folklore.computers > #219578
| From | Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | alt.folklore.computers |
| Subject | Re: Who Knew ? |
| Date | 2021-11-04 15:37 -0400 |
| Organization | PANIX Public Access Internet and UNIX, NYC |
| Message-ID | <mdd8ry3n259.fsf@panix5.panix.com> (permalink) |
| References | (18 earlier) <20211103072641.1f36fd9ef1e2138951d0396c@eircom.net> <RvzgJ.30520$Kw9.8925@fx45.iad> <20211103195806.3f51c2f392a43944cfa3df04@eircom.net> <NfDgJ.25017$ya3.6058@fx38.iad> <09682853-a234-4fbc-91ce-2b88894497abn@googlegroups.com> |
Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> writes:
> On Wednesday, November 3, 2021 at 3:34:39 PM UTC-6, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
> > On 2021-11-03, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <ste...@eircom.net> wrote:
>
> > > What Orwell missed completely was that all of this has not needed
> > > to be imposed by an authoritative Big Brother with lethal enforcement but
> > > rather has been dangled and freely chosen like Coffiest.
>
> > Yes, it didn't occur to Orwell that Big Brother would actually turn out
> > to be Big Business. But let's face it, that one went past most people
> > (but not Pohl & Kornbluth, as you point out).
>
> Orwell was reacting, perhaps, to McCarthyism, by warning of the danger
> that a long-continued Cold War could cause the West to become like the
> Soviet Union.
>
> Since Brave New World was already out there, the alternative of an iron fist
> hidden in a velvet glove had been addressed in literature already; his goal
> was not to imitate it.
_Animal Farm_ was published in 1945, _1984_ in 1948.
Senator Joseph McCarthy made his first speech about his "list of Communists in
the State Department" in 1950.
I do not believe that Eric Blair was reacting to anything in the US, but rather
to the Stalinist takeover of the international Communist Party starting in the
Spanish Civil War.
Reference: _Cold Warriors: Writers who Waged the Literary Cold War_ by Duncan
White, 2019. Covers both Western and Soviet writers, and I recommend it highly.
--
Rich Alderson news@alderson.users.panix.com
Audendum est, et veritas investiganda; quam etiamsi non assequamur,
omnino tamen proprius, quam nunc sumus, ad eam perveniemus.
--Galen
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Re: Who Knew ? Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-11-01 13:52 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-01 21:40 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-11-01 19:27 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-02 05:19 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2021-11-01 17:38 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? Joy Beeson <jbeeson@invalid.net.invalid> - 2021-11-02 00:21 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-04 19:09 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? 1p166 <z24ba6.net> - 2021-11-02 00:11 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-11-02 06:17 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Niklas Karlsson <nikke.karlsson@gmail.com> - 2021-11-02 10:16 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? 1p166 <z24ba6.net> - 2021-11-03 00:27 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-03 07:26 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-11-03 17:18 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-03 19:58 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-11-03 21:34 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2021-11-04 09:51 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2021-11-04 15:37 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-05 15:13 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? 711 Spooky Mart <711@spooky.mart> - 2021-11-04 15:22 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-05 15:22 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? D.J. <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-11-05 12:05 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2021-11-05 08:20 -1000
Re: Who Knew ? Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2021-11-04 10:02 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-11-04 17:26 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? 711 Spooky Mart <711@spooky.mart> - 2021-11-04 15:25 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-04 19:10 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-11-04 23:27 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-04 21:43 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2021-11-05 08:53 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-05 11:38 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-05 13:30 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-11-05 18:23 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-05 19:37 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Churchillian version John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-11-05 20:02 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-05 17:14 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-05 07:26 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-05 14:47 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-11-05 17:40 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-05 17:17 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-05 21:50 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-05 15:55 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-06 19:07 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-06 11:31 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-06 15:14 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-06 16:45 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-05 12:28 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2021-11-05 22:43 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-11-04 11:05 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-11-04 17:19 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-04 20:13 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-04 16:11 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-11-04 23:27 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-05 11:40 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-11-05 14:09 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-05 15:53 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-11-05 17:40 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-05 19:18 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-05 20:04 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-11-05 23:52 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-06 05:13 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-05 15:16 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? "Kurt Weiske" <kurt.weiske@realitycheckbbs.org.remove-n7j-this> - 2021-11-04 07:17 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-11-04 15:47 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2021-11-04 20:34 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-11-04 23:27 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? "Kurt Weiske" <kurt.weiske@realitycheckbbs.org.remove-m46-this> - 2021-11-05 07:08 -0800
Re: Who Knew ? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-11-07 15:43 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-04 16:17 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-11-04 17:19 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-04 22:18 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2021-11-04 19:21 -0300
Re: Who Knew ? Leonard Blaisdell <leoblaisdell@sbcglobal.net> - 2021-11-05 05:46 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2021-11-05 04:01 -0300
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-05 15:27 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-04 16:11 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-05 07:29 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? 711 Spooky Mart <711@spooky.mart> - 2021-11-04 15:12 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-04 16:11 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? 1p166 <z24ba6.net> - 2021-11-03 21:02 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2021-11-04 00:01 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-11-04 11:09 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2021-11-04 13:49 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2021-11-04 10:11 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2021-11-04 10:16 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-04 17:31 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? D.J. <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-11-04 13:04 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-05 14:58 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2021-11-04 17:47 -1000
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-05 15:07 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-05 12:28 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? D.J. <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-11-05 14:42 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2021-11-04 17:53 -1000
Re: Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-05 13:33 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-05 12:28 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2021-11-05 10:06 -1000
Re: Who Knew ? Robert Swindells <rjs@fdy2.co.uk> - 2021-11-06 15:38 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-05 17:39 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-05 15:55 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-05 19:33 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? D.J. <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-11-06 12:17 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-06 14:45 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? D.J. <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-11-06 15:28 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-06 18:52 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? D.J. <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-11-07 08:54 -0600
Re: Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-07 10:07 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2021-11-06 08:26 -1000
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-05 22:05 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-05 15:55 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-05 12:04 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-04 18:32 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? 711 Spooky Mart <711@spooky.mart> - 2021-11-06 19:25 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-07 11:20 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? D.J. <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-11-07 08:55 -0600
Re: Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-07 10:15 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? 711 Spooky Mart <711@spooky.mart> - 2021-11-07 23:44 -0600
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-08 15:39 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-11-08 17:06 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? lawrenabae@abaluon.abaom (Lawrence Statton (NK1G)) - 2021-11-09 19:06 -0600
Re: Who Knew ? D.J. <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-11-08 09:51 -0600
Re: Who Knew ? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-08 10:52 -0700
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-08 19:14 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2021-11-08 12:09 -1000
Re: Who Knew ? 711 Spooky Mart <711@spooky.mart> - 2021-11-08 22:38 -0600
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-09 15:30 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? D.J. <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-11-09 14:57 -0600
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-11 15:03 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2021-11-11 17:02 -1000
Re: Alternate Who Knew ? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-11-08 22:22 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-08 18:07 -0500
Re: military options, was Who Knew ? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-11-09 01:58 +0000
Re: military options, was Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-08 23:17 -0500
Re: military options, was Who Knew ? Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-11-09 10:02 -0500
Re: military options, was Who Knew ? 711 Spooky Mart <711@spooky.mart> - 2021-11-08 22:51 -0600
Re: Who Knew ? 711 Spooky Mart <711@spooky.mart> - 2021-11-08 22:35 -0600
Re: Who Knew ? D.J. <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-11-09 09:09 -0600
Re: Who Knew ? Andreas Eder <a_eder_muc@web.de> - 2021-11-14 18:45 +0100
Re: Who Knew ? D.J. <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-11-14 12:39 -0600
Re: Who Knew ? 711 Spooky Mart <711@spooky.mart> - 2021-11-15 00:43 -0600
Re: Who Knew ? D.J. <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-11-16 08:58 -0600
Re: Who Knew ? Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-11-16 16:57 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? D.J. <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-11-17 10:54 -0600
Re: Who Knew ? Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-11-17 14:16 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-11-14 14:32 -0500
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-04 05:01 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2021-11-04 13:48 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-11-04 15:46 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2021-11-04 15:26 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? 1p166 <z24ba6.net> - 2021-11-04 23:51 -0400
Re: Who Knew ? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-11-05 07:37 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2021-11-05 08:54 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-11-05 13:49 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-11-04 11:08 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-11-03 17:18 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2021-11-05 22:17 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Maus <Greymaus@mail.com> - 2021-11-05 22:46 +0000
Re: Who Knew ? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-11-05 15:55 -0700
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