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How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022

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  How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-04 16:57 +0000
    Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Henk de Jong <newsgroup@nospam-hsdejong.nl> - 2022-03-04 18:55 +0100
      Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 00:17 +0000
    Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2022-03-04 10:01 -0800
      Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 00:18 +0000
        Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 WaltS48 <schw01@invalid.net> - 2022-03-04 20:22 -0500
          Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 01:38 +0000
            Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Christian Riechers <chriechers@netscape.net.invalid> - 2022-03-05 13:30 +0100
              Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 15:47 +0000
    Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Soviet_Mario <SovietMario@CCCP.MIR> - 2022-03-04 19:41 +0100
      Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 PietB <www.godfatherof.nl/@opt-in.invalid> - 2022-03-04 20:41 +0100
    Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2022-03-04 21:23 +0100
      Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 12:40 -0800
        Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2022-03-04 20:49 +0000
          Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 12:57 -0800
            Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2022-03-04 22:10 +0100
              Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 14:39 -0800
                Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2022-03-04 23:51 +0100
                  Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Big Al <Bears@invalid.com> - 2022-03-04 17:58 -0500
                  Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 15:33 -0800
                    Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Jasen Betts <usenet@revmaps.no-ip.org> - 2022-03-05 01:00 +0000
                      Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 WaltS48 <schw01@invalid.net> - 2022-03-04 20:25 -0500
                      Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 21:20 -0800
                        Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2022-03-05 09:22 +0100
                        Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Jasen Betts <usenet@revmaps.no-ip.org> - 2022-03-05 22:09 +0000
                    Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2022-03-05 09:27 +0100
                      Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 "Gary R. Schmidt" <grschmidt@acm.org> - 2022-03-05 21:57 +1100
                        Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2022-03-05 13:11 +0100
                Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Nobody <jock@soccer.com> - 2022-03-04 16:18 -0800
                Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 00:55 +0000
                  Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 ant@zimage.comANT (Ant) - 2022-03-04 18:57 -0600
                    Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 01:28 +0000
                      Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2022-03-05 11:18 +0000
                        Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 15:36 +0000
                          Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2022-03-05 16:04 +0000
                            Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2022-03-05 18:58 +0100
                              Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2022-03-05 18:47 +0000
                                Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2022-03-05 21:21 +0100
                Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2022-03-05 11:10 +0000
                  Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> - 2022-03-06 09:11 -0800
                    Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2022-03-06 12:46 -0500
                      Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> - 2022-03-06 21:23 -0800
            Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2022-03-04 21:26 +0000
              Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2022-03-04 23:05 +0100
              Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 15:23 -0800
                Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2022-03-05 09:31 +0100
                Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2022-03-05 11:20 +0000
              Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 00:59 +0000
                Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 WaltS48 <schw01@invalid.net> - 2022-03-04 20:27 -0500
                  Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 01:48 +0000
                  Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2022-03-05 11:26 +0000
                    Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 15:30 +0000
                      Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2022-03-05 15:39 +0000
                        Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 22:37 +0000
                          Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-07-23 10:03 +0100
        Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2022-03-04 22:07 +0100
          Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 WaltS48 <schw01@invalid.net> - 2022-03-04 16:26 -0500
          Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 14:15 -0800
            Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2022-03-05 00:00 +0100
          Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 01:05 +0000
            Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2022-03-05 09:39 +0100
              Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 15:24 +0000
      Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 00:19 +0000
      Re: How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022 Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> - 2022-03-05 01:02 +0000

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#3582 — How to recover from Google dropping password support on May 30th 2022

Do you have a solution that allows us to keep using a passwd in an MUA?

Did you get this message today in all your Google email accounts?
 <https://i.postimg.cc/2yBvxJhJ/gmailpasswd02.jpg>

It implies Google is dropping third-party mail user agent passwd support.
 <https://i.postimg.cc/MGfN2Z7r/gmailpasswd01.jpg>

Verbatim:
 "On May 30, you may lose access to apps that are using 
  less secure sign-in technology
  To help keep your account secure, Google will no longer support 
  the use of third-party apps or devices which ask you to sign in 
  to your Google Account using only your username and password. 

  Instead, you'll need to sign in using Sign in with Google 
  or other more secure technologies, like OAuth 2.0."

I'm sure I'm like others in that I do _not_ want to use my phone to
authorize anything (not text, not 2FA, not my IP, nothing). I simply want a
login and a password and I don't want anything more than only that.

I'm not even sure if I want to use OATH2 (only if there is no other way).

I don't use Google applications if I can help it, so I use 3rd party MUAs on
all my platforms (K-9 Mail, Thunderbird, FairEmail, etc.).

Do you have any solution that allows us to keep using a password in an MUA?
-- 
Usenet is a team sport where each of us pitches in to help all the others.

[toc] | [next] | [standalone]

#3583

On 4-3-2022 17:57, Andy Burnelli wrote:
> Do you have a solution that allows us to keep using a passwd in an MUA?
> 
> Did you get this message today in all your Google email accounts?
> <https://i.postimg.cc/2yBvxJhJ/gmailpasswd02.jpg>
> 
> It implies Google is dropping third-party mail user agent passwd support.
> <https://i.postimg.cc/MGfN2Z7r/gmailpasswd01.jpg>
> 
> Verbatim:
> "On May 30, you may lose access to apps that are using  less secure 
> sign-in technology
>   To help keep your account secure, Google will no longer support  the 
> use of third-party apps or devices which ask you to sign in  to your 
> Google Account using only your username and password.
>   Instead, you'll need to sign in using Sign in with Google  or other 
> more secure technologies, like OAuth 2.0."
> 
> I'm sure I'm like others in that I do _not_ want to use my phone to
> authorize anything (not text, not 2FA, not my IP, nothing). I simply want a
> login and a password and I don't want anything more than only that.
> 
> I'm not even sure if I want to use OATH2 (only if there is no other way).
> 
> I don't use Google applications if I can help it, so I use 3rd party 
> MUAs on
> all my platforms (K-9 Mail, Thunderbird, FairEmail, etc.).
> 
> Do you have any solution that allows us to keep using a password in an MUA?

OAuth2 is really simple to use in Thunderbird.
For example have a look at:
https://www.supertechcrew.com/thunderbird-oauth2-gmail/

-- 
With kind regards,
Henk de Jong

7 Sisters Restaurant
https://www.7sistersrestaurant.com

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#3612

Henk de Jong wrote:

> OAuth2 is really simple to use in Thunderbird.
> For example have a look at:
> https://www.supertechcrew.com/thunderbird-oauth2-gmail/

Thanks for trying to help as I just want the simplest login that preserves
as much of my privacy as possible, where I'll _never_ want the phone to be
part of that authentication process. Never. Never. Never. Never. Never.

Google locks me out a lot (they _hate_ VPN for example), but even so, it may
be more complicated than you (or Google) intimate though as I just looked
and I _already_ have OATH2 set (or so it seems) on my Windows TB setup.
[Tools/AccountSettings/YourGmailAccount/ServerSettings/SecuritySettings/AuthenticationMethod]

Do you see anything wrong with this TB setup I just snapshotted for you?
 <https://i.postimg.cc/432zCNgx/gmailpasswd03.jpg> Current Gmail OATH2 setup
-- 
Usenet isn't for amusement; it's for learning from and helping each other.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#3584

Andy Burnelli wrote:
> Do you have a solution that allows us to keep using a passwd in an MUA?
> 
> Did you get this message today in all your Google email accounts?

Here's it from google:

https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/6010255?hl=en  Less secure 
apps & your Google Account

This is not the first time that google has decided to make that policy; 
in the past it has pushed the deadline back and then eliminated it. 
Maybe this time it is for 'real'.

> It implies Google is dropping third-party mail user agent passwd support.

Rather it *says* google is going to require anything that accesses to be 
NOT 'LSA' less secure app.

The concept that google wants to enforce is that just user/pass is not 
sufficiently secure.

Imagine that with the millions and millions of gmail accounts how many 
of them must have been hacked, with great resultant misery on the part 
of the users and such users turning to google for 'what can I do' 
bemoaning that the account has been hacked and misused.
> 
> "On May 30, you may lose access to apps that are using  less secure 
> sign-in technology
>   To help keep your account secure, Google will no longer support  the 
> use of third-party apps or devices which ask you to sign in  to your 
> Google Account using only your username and password.
>   Instead, you'll need to sign in using Sign in with Google  or other 
> more secure technologies, like OAuth 2.0."
> 
> I'm sure I'm like others in that I do _not_ want to use my phone to
> authorize anything (not text, not 2FA, not my IP, nothing). I simply want a
> login and a password and I don't want anything more than only that.
> 
If you feel strongly and you don't want to use an app that has more 
secure login like 0AUTH2, then you should find an email provider that 
suits your wishes.

> I'm not even sure if I want to use OATH2 (only if there is no other way).
> 
> I don't use Google applications if I can help it, so I use 3rd party 
> MUAs on
> all my platforms (K-9 Mail, Thunderbird, FairEmail, etc.).
> 
> Do you have any solution that allows us to keep using a password in an MUA?

Tb supports 0AUTH2.


-- 
Mike Easter

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#3614

Mike Easter wrote:

> If you feel strongly and you don't want to use an app that has more 
> secure login like 0AUTH2, then you should find an email provider that 
> suits your wishes.

I _already_ have OATH2 set (or so it seems) on my Windows TB setup.
[Tools/AccountSettings/YourGmailAccount/ServerSettings/SecuritySettings/AuthenticationMethod]

Do you see anything wrong with this TB setup I just snapshotted for this?
 <https://i.postimg.cc/432zCNgx/gmailpasswd03.jpg> Current Gmail OATH2 setup
-- 
Usenet isn't for amusement; it's for learning from and helping each other.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#3623

On 3/4/22 7:18 PM, Andy Burnelli wrote:
> Mike Easter wrote:
> 
>> If you feel strongly and you don't want to use an app that has more 
>> secure login like 0AUTH2, then you should find an email provider that 
>> suits your wishes.
> 
> I _already_ have OATH2 set (or so it seems) on my Windows TB setup.
> [Tools/AccountSettings/YourGmailAccount/ServerSettings/SecuritySettings/AuthenticationMethod]
> 
> Do you see anything wrong with this TB setup I just snapshotted for this?
> <https://i.postimg.cc/432zCNgx/gmailpasswd03.jpg> Current Gmail OATH2 setup

That's the way all 3 of mine are configured.

-- 
OS: Fedora 35 Workstation - Gnome 41 Desktop
https://www.thunderbird.net/en-US/get-involved/
Same Nightmare, Different Day
https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/

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#3628

WaltS48 wrote:

>> Do you see anything wrong with this TB setup I just snapshotted for this?
>> <https://i.postimg.cc/432zCNgx/gmailpasswd03.jpg> Current Gmail OATH2 setup
> 
> That's the way all 3 of mine are configured.

Well then, my Thunderbird appears to be correctly set up for OAuth2 already.
I rarely log into my "google account" but I went on VPN and just logged in.

It says I have the "Less Secure App Access" turned on as shown in this shot.
 <https://i.postimg.cc/cL9r9qFW/gmailpasswd05.jpg>

And it says Thunderbird is one of the "Apps with access to your account".
 <https://i.postimg.cc/MGs3HSyn/gmailpasswd04.jpg>

So what exactly is the problem with Google & what are they telling me to do?

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#3646

On 3/5/22 02:38, Andy Burnelli wrote:
> Well then, my Thunderbird appears to be correctly set up for OAuth2 
> already.
> I rarely log into my "google account" but I went on VPN and just logged in.
> 
> It says I have the "Less Secure App Access" turned on as shown in this 
> shot.
> <https://i.postimg.cc/cL9r9qFW/gmailpasswd05.jpg>
> 
> And it says Thunderbird is one of the "Apps with access to your account".
> <https://i.postimg.cc/MGs3HSyn/gmailpasswd04.jpg>
> 
> So what exactly is the problem with Google & what are they telling me to 
> do?

You can turn off the 'allow less secure apps' setting. It's not needed 
for OAuth2.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#3653

Christian Riechers wrote:

>> So what exactly is the problem with Google & what are they telling me to 
>> do?
> 
> You can turn off the 'allow less secure apps' setting. It's not needed 
> for OAuth2.

Thank you for clarifying what wasn't obvious as I set TB to Oath2 about a
year ago under duress as it was forced upon me for some reason as I recall.
 <https://i.postimg.cc/RhHkj4gJ/gmailpasswd06.jpg>

I see, belatedly, that what Google "maybe" did was send that nastigram to
everyone who had "allow less secure apps" turned to "On".
 <https://i.postimg.cc/cL9r9qFW/gmailpasswd05.jpg>

And from what's not here, that means K9 got me in trouble with Google.
 <https://i.postimg.cc/MGs3HSyn/gmailpasswd04.jpg>

Presumably, the items on that list above must already be using OAuth2?
a. Mozilla Thunderbird Email (Has access to Gmail)
b. FairEmail privacy aware email (Has access to Gmail)
c. Email - Edison Mail (Has access to Gmail, Google Contacts)
d. SRWare Iron (Has full access to your Google Account)
e. 1 of your apps is secured by Cross-Account-Protection (Edison Mail)

Is that an accurate (belated) assessment as to _why_ I got the message?
If so, the problem morphs from Thunderbird to other apps like Claws & K9.
-- 
Usenet is a team sport where each person adds unique value in their own way.

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#3585

On 04/03/22 17:57, Andy Burnelli wrote:
> Do you have a solution that allows us to keep using a passwd 
> in an MUA?
> 
> Did you get this message today in all your Google email 
> accounts?
> <https://i.postimg.cc/2yBvxJhJ/gmailpasswd02.jpg>
> 
> It implies Google is dropping third-party mail user agent 
> passwd support.
> <https://i.postimg.cc/MGfN2Z7r/gmailpasswd01.jpg>
> 
> Verbatim:
> "On May 30, you may lose access to apps that are using  less 
> secure sign-in technology
>   To help keep your account secure, Google will no longer 
> support  the use of third-party apps or devices which ask 
> you to sign in  to your Google Account using only your 
> username and password.
>   Instead, you'll need to sign in using Sign in with Google 
>   or other more secure technologies, like OAuth 2.0."
> 
> I'm sure I'm like others in that I do _not_ want to use my 
> phone to
> authorize anything (not text, not 2FA, not my IP, nothing). 
> I simply want a
> login and a password and I don't want anything more than 
> only that.
> 
> I'm not even sure if I want to use OATH2 (only if there is 
> no other way).
> 
> I don't use Google applications if I can help it, so I use 
> 3rd party MUAs on
> all my platforms (K-9 Mail, Thunderbird, FairEmail, etc.).
> 
> Do you have any solution that allows us to keep using a 
> password in an MUA?

I received the msg too, and I was thinking to enable (if 
still possible) FORWARDING to a REAL email account from 3rd 
party.

If they'll disable that too, I'll write to my valuable 
contact to delete the address and let Gmail fillup and age 
abandoned.

If there is a better workaround, I'm curious to learn it too.
Maybe I begin early to disable contacts or divert the 
mailing list subscriptions ....


-- 
1) Resistere, resistere, resistere.
2) Se tutti pagano le tasse, le tasse le pagano tutti
Soviet_Mario - (aka Gatto_Vizzato)

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#3587

Soviet_Mario wrote:
> Andy Burnelli wrote:
>> Do you have any solution that allows us to keep using a 
>> password in an MUA?
> 
> I received the msg too, and I was thinking to enable (if 
> still possible) FORWARDING to a REAL email account from
> 3rd party.

That's still possible and it works.

> If they'll disable that too

Why?

-p

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#3589

On 2022-03-04 17:57, Andy Burnelli wrote:
> Do you have a solution that allows us to keep using a passwd in an MUA?
> 
> Did you get this message today in all your Google email accounts?
> <https://i.postimg.cc/2yBvxJhJ/gmailpasswd02.jpg>

No.

Only in one account that is not associated with a phone. Not all.

> 
> It implies Google is dropping third-party mail user agent passwd support.
> <https://i.postimg.cc/MGfN2Z7r/gmailpasswd01.jpg>
> 
> Verbatim:
> "On May 30, you may lose access to apps that are using  less secure 
> sign-in technology
>   To help keep your account secure, Google will no longer support  the 
> use of third-party apps or devices which ask you to sign in  to your 
> Google Account using only your username and password.
>   Instead, you'll need to sign in using Sign in with Google  or other 
> more secure technologies, like OAuth 2.0."
> 
> I'm sure I'm like others in that I do _not_ want to use my phone to
> authorize anything (not text, not 2FA, not my IP, nothing). I simply want a
> login and a password and I don't want anything more than only that.
> 
> I'm not even sure if I want to use OATH2 (only if there is no other way).
> 
> I don't use Google applications if I can help it, so I use 3rd party 
> MUAs on
> all my platforms (K-9 Mail, Thunderbird, FairEmail, etc.).
> 
> Do you have any solution that allows us to keep using a password in an MUA?


As you are setting the followup to alt.comp.software.thunderbird (which 
I ignored, of course), it means that you are only interested in an 
answer for Thunderbird.

So, for Thunderbird, the solution is obvious: Use Oauth2, like it or not.

Alternatively, use application passwords (a different password for each 
application). This requires you to active 2FA, which I know you dislike 
because it implies using your phone.

Thus you can only stop using Google.

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

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#3590

On 03/04/2022 12:23 PM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 2022-03-04 17:57, Andy Burnelli wrote:
>> Do you have a solution that allows us to keep using a passwd in an MUA?
>>
>> Did you get this message today in all your Google email accounts?
>> <https://i.postimg.cc/2yBvxJhJ/gmailpasswd02.jpg>
>
> No.
>
> Only in one account that is not associated with a phone. Not all.
>
>>
>> It implies Google is dropping third-party mail user agent passwd support.
>> <https://i.postimg.cc/MGfN2Z7r/gmailpasswd01.jpg>
>>
>> Verbatim:
>> "On May 30, you may lose access to apps that are using  less secure
>> sign-in technology
>>   To help keep your account secure, Google will no longer support  the
>> use of third-party apps or devices which ask you to sign in  to your
>> Google Account using only your username and password.
>>   Instead, you'll need to sign in using Sign in with Google  or other
>> more secure technologies, like OAuth 2.0."
>>
>> I'm sure I'm like others in that I do _not_ want to use my phone to
>> authorize anything (not text, not 2FA, not my IP, nothing). I simply want a
>> login and a password and I don't want anything more than only that.
>>
>> I'm not even sure if I want to use OATH2 (only if there is no other way).
>>
>> I don't use Google applications if I can help it, so I use 3rd party
>> MUAs on
>> all my platforms (K-9 Mail, Thunderbird, FairEmail, etc.).
>>
>> Do you have any solution that allows us to keep using a password in an MUA?
>
>
> As you are setting the followup to alt.comp.software.thunderbird (which
> I ignored, of course), it means that you are only interested in an
> answer for Thunderbird.
>
> So, for Thunderbird, the solution is obvious: Use Oauth2, like it or not.
>
> Alternatively, use application passwords (a different password for each
> application). This requires you to active 2FA, which I know you dislike
> because it implies using your phone.
>
> Thus you can only stop using Google.

So let me get this straight...  I can keep using Thunderbird38 on my 
computer with my gmail accounts as long as I implement Oauth2 (whatever 
that is) and delete my stored passwords (which I just saved with an xv 
screenshot).

What about uploading photos to google photos?  What about using google 
maps?  What about my saved places in google maps?  What about those 
things using my phone instead of my linux (or windows or laptop or other 
people's computers) computer?  Will they send me a text message with a 
code to load in every single time I use a google app?

Personally, password security is perfectly acceptable to me -- if I were 
plotting to overthrow the world perhaps I'd feel differently, but I 
don't say a hell of a lot in email that I wouldn't be willing to post 
publicly.  I AM unwilling to pay T-Mobile a dime every time I need to 
deal with a text message in order to deal with any google product.

Is there a website that deals with the details of this travesty in detail?

-- 
Cheers, Bev
   "If anyone disagrees with anything I  say, I am quite prepared
    not only to  retract it,  but also to deny under  oath that I
    ever said it."                                   -- T. Lehrer

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#3591

The Real Bev wrote:

> So let me get this straight...  I can keep using Thunderbird38 on my computer 
> with my gmail accounts as long as I implement Oauth2 

yes

> (whatever that is) and 
> delete my stored passwords (which I just saved with an xv screenshot).
> 
> What about uploading photos to google photos? 

Your phone will be logged in to your google account, so it will Just Work[TM] if 
you want to upload to the photos web site, just login with your password.

> What about using google maps?

You might not have any need to login, but if you do, just use your password

> What about my saved places in google maps? 

That's an example of when you will want to login with your password

> What about those things using my 
> phone instead of my linux (or windows or laptop or other people's computers) 
> computer?  Will they send me a text message with a code to load in every single 
> time I use a google app?

Depends if you have 2FA enabled or not.

> Personally, password security is perfectly acceptable to me 

Then none of this is the end of the world to you, just carry on using your password.

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#3592

On 03/04/2022 12:49 PM, Andy Burns wrote:
> The Real Bev wrote:
>
>> So let me get this straight...  I can keep using Thunderbird38 on my computer
>> with my gmail accounts as long as I implement Oauth2
>
> yes
>
>> (whatever that is) and
>> delete my stored passwords (which I just saved with an xv screenshot).
>>
>> What about uploading photos to google photos?
>
> Your phone will be logged in to your google account, so it will Just Work[TM] if
> you want to upload to the photos web site, just login with your password.

I use bluemail to access my gmail accounts.  I do this because I don't 
want to download email to my phone automatically, which gmail didn't 
seem to offer any way to opt out of.  Will this be a problem?

>> What about using google maps?
>
> You might not have any need to login, but if you do, just use your password
>
>> What about my saved places in google maps?
>
> That's an example of when you will want to login with your password
>
>> What about those things using my
>> phone instead of my linux (or windows or laptop or other people's computers)
>> computer?  Will they send me a text message with a code to load in every single
>> time I use a google app?
>
> Depends if you have 2FA enabled or not.

Two-factor authentication, right?  Is the text-code-to-your-phone method 
the only way of doing this?

>> Personally, password security is perfectly acceptable to me
>
> Then none of this is the end of the world to you, just carry on using your password.

BUT google's messages seem to say that passwords will no longer work 
with google apps.  WTF?  Google's website offers no enlightenment.

I resent being made to jump through hoops (opening an account in order 
to ask a manufacturer a simple question about one of their products, for 
example) in order to do things whose security is irrelevant.  This seems 
like an even bigger nuisance.

Perhaps I should already know this stuff, but given the fact that most 
of what I do I could post on a billboard with no problems, exactly WHO 
am I protecting with all this crap?  </rant>

-- 
Cheers, Bev
   Polish loan sharks:  they loan you money and then skip town.

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#3594

On 2022-03-04 21:57, The Real Bev wrote:
> 
> BUT google's messages seem to say that passwords will no longer work 
> with google apps.  WTF?  Google's website offers no enlightenment.
> 
> I resent being made to jump through hoops (opening an account in order 
> to ask a manufacturer a simple question about one of their products, for 
> example) in order to do things whose security is irrelevant.  This seems 
> like an even bigger nuisance.
> 
> Perhaps I should already know this stuff, but given the fact that most 
> of what I do I could post on a billboard with no problems, exactly WHO 
> am I protecting with all this crap?  </rant>

You may know what you are doing, but millions do not. So google enforces 
settings for those millions - and you.


-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

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#3604

On 03/04/2022 01:10 PM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 2022-03-04 21:57, The Real Bev wrote:
>>
>> BUT google's messages seem to say that passwords will no longer work
>> with google apps.  WTF?  Google's website offers no enlightenment.
>>
>> I resent being made to jump through hoops (opening an account in order
>> to ask a manufacturer a simple question about one of their products, for
>> example) in order to do things whose security is irrelevant.  This seems
>> like an even bigger nuisance.
>>
>> Perhaps I should already know this stuff, but given the fact that most
>> of what I do I could post on a billboard with no problems, exactly WHO
>> am I protecting with all this crap?  </rant>
>
> You may know what you are doing, but millions do not. So google enforces
> settings for those millions - and you.

The price is too high.

I did find out something useful, though.  oath2whatever can't be 
implemented for POP by Thunderbird, but it shows up for the accounts I 
marked as IMAP.  SOME accounts I marked as both POP and IMAP at the 
gmail website, and they seemed to work just fine.  I shall investigate 
further.

-- 
Cheers, Bev
     "...so she told me it was either her or the ham radio, over."

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#3605

On 2022-03-04 23:39, The Real Bev wrote:
> On 03/04/2022 01:10 PM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>> On 2022-03-04 21:57, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>
>>> BUT google's messages seem to say that passwords will no longer work
>>> with google apps.  WTF?  Google's website offers no enlightenment.
>>>
>>> I resent being made to jump through hoops (opening an account in order
>>> to ask a manufacturer a simple question about one of their products, for
>>> example) in order to do things whose security is irrelevant.  This seems
>>> like an even bigger nuisance.
>>>
>>> Perhaps I should already know this stuff, but given the fact that most
>>> of what I do I could post on a billboard with no problems, exactly WHO
>>> am I protecting with all this crap?  </rant>
>>
>> You may know what you are doing, but millions do not. So google enforces
>> settings for those millions - and you.
> 
> The price is too high.

You have no say in the matter :-p

> 
> I did find out something useful, though.  oath2whatever can't be 
> implemented for POP by Thunderbird, but it shows up for the accounts I 
> marked as IMAP.  SOME accounts I marked as both POP and IMAP at the 
> gmail website, and they seemed to work just fine.  I shall investigate 
> further.
> 

I use imap on all my accounts.

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

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#3606

On 3/4/22 17:51, this is what Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 2022-03-04 23:39, The Real Bev wrote:
>> On 03/04/2022 01:10 PM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>>> On 2022-03-04 21:57, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>
>>>> BUT google's messages seem to say that passwords will no longer work
>>>> with google apps.  WTF?  Google's website offers no enlightenment.
>>>>
>>>> I resent being made to jump through hoops (opening an account in order
>>>> to ask a manufacturer a simple question about one of their products, for
>>>> example) in order to do things whose security is irrelevant.  This seems
>>>> like an even bigger nuisance.
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps I should already know this stuff, but given the fact that most
>>>> of what I do I could post on a billboard with no problems, exactly WHO
>>>> am I protecting with all this crap?  </rant>
>>>
>>> You may know what you are doing, but millions do not. So google enforces
>>> settings for those millions - and you.
>>
>> The price is too high.
> 
> You have no say in the matter :-p
> 
>>
>> I did find out something useful, though.  oath2whatever can't be implemented for POP by Thunderbird, but it shows up for the accounts I 
>> marked as IMAP.  SOME accounts I marked as both POP and IMAP at the gmail website, and they seemed to work just fine.  I shall investigate 
>> further.
>>
> 
> I use imap on all my accounts.
> 
When the first OAuth2 thing hit last year, I changed every account to IMAP.  I have found it a great asset.
Just a week ago I tried something and lost my system.  I had morning backups but had done a good amount of emails and responses and received 
a lot from my doctors etc.
The reload took only a bit and the instant TB was launch, as much as it was a bit outdated, all the folders got in sync.  Fabulous.

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#3609

On 03/04/2022 02:51 PM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 2022-03-04 23:39, The Real Bev wrote:
>> On 03/04/2022 01:10 PM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>>> On 2022-03-04 21:57, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>
>>>> BUT google's messages seem to say that passwords will no longer work
>>>> with google apps.  WTF?  Google's website offers no enlightenment.
>>>>
>>>> I resent being made to jump through hoops (opening an account in order
>>>> to ask a manufacturer a simple question about one of their products, for
>>>> example) in order to do things whose security is irrelevant.  This seems
>>>> like an even bigger nuisance.
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps I should already know this stuff, but given the fact that most
>>>> of what I do I could post on a billboard with no problems, exactly WHO
>>>> am I protecting with all this crap?  </rant>
>>>
>>> You may know what you are doing, but millions do not. So google enforces
>>> settings for those millions - and you.
>>
>> The price is too high.
>
> You have no say in the matter :-p

Unfortunately.  Voting is about as useful.

>> I did find out something useful, though.  oath2whatever can't be
>> implemented for POP by Thunderbird, but it shows up for the accounts I
>> marked as IMAP.  SOME accounts I marked as both POP and IMAP at the
>> gmail website, and they seemed to work just fine.  I shall investigate
>> further.
>
> I use imap on all my accounts.

I chose POP because I wanted to download mail to my computer and delete 
it from the server.  The idea of having it floating around forever in 
the cloud is unsettling.

This causes a problem when I take a tablet/phone on a trip and want to 
read my mail on it, but download it to my computer when I get back. 
This isn't easy, but I never considered the possibility when I 
established most of my accounts.  IMAP is certainly more practical.  I 
need to do some experimentation...  I don't think anything changed when 
I added IMAP to those two existing POP accounts...

-- 
Cheers, Bev
  "Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course
  without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point
  of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different
  perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and
  by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and
  every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely
  forgot what I was going to say."                    -- S. Kumar

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