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Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity.

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Am Freitag000021, 21.02.2025 um 20:37 schrieb LaurenceClarkCrossen:
> On Fri, 21 Feb 2025 8:26:26 +0000, Thomas Heger wrote:
> 
>> Am Donnerstag000020, 20.02.2025 um 22:44 schrieb Richard Hachel:
>>> Le 20/02/2025 à 22:31, "Paul B. Andersen" a écrit :
>>>> So you prefer to believe that your derivation that
>>>> photons are not affected by gravity is correct,
>>>> and that GR's predictions thus are proven wrong.
>>>>
>>>> So you must be ignorant of the fact that photons are observed
>>>> to be deflected by gravity exactly as predicted by GR.
>>>>
>>>> Because you would not claim that "photons cannot be affected
>>>> by gravity" if you knew that they are.
>>>>
>>>> Or would you? :-D
>>>>
>>>> Paul
>>>
>>> What is the evidence that photons are deflected by the presence of
>>> matter in space?
>>
>> The photons are not affected, but space itself is.
>>
>> The idea of GR was, that gravity is actually an effect of 'curvature',
>> which is itself caused by gravity.
>>
>> What gets curved is actually the 'axis of time' local to a certain part
>> of space.
>>
>> What we call 'space' has a certain (geometric) relation to the axis of
>> time, if we regard the axis of time as imaginary and the axes of space
>> as real.
>>
>> Then we have i as a factor, by which time gets multiplied and what gives
>> us three real axes of space.
>>
>> This space is therefore depending on the direction of time.
>>
>> Curvature of the axis of time is actually an acceleration in a
>> space-time diagram, which usually has one axis of time and only one of
>> type space.
>>
>> Now this can 'curve' and we get gravity, which is a force, that results
>> from such curvature.
>>
>> Now light ('photons') pass through such a distorted space upon force
>> free straight lines, which are actually curved in spacetime in presence
>> of a gravitational field.
>>
>> This pass is NOT curved by gravitation, but by curvature of space.
>>
>>
>> ....
>>
>>
>> TH
> it is good to hear someone here who can plainly explain relativity so
> everyone can understand. The only problem is that space is not a
> surface, so it can't curve. Non-Euclidean geometry cannot curve space,
> so it can't cause gravity. The idea that the concept of curved space is
> somehow an improvement over the idea of fields of force is mistaken
> because it involves the elementary error of reification fallacy.

Well, let's assume, that relativity is actually correct and 'length 
contraction' and 'time dilation' are real phenomena, which can make a 
certain space disappear, while another one unfolds.

But his is NOT caused by velocity, as Einstein assumed in SRT, but by 
acceleration (as Einstein assumed in GR).

Now we could extend this idea by allowing different directions of the 
axis of time, which would also include timelines, which point into the 
opposite direction (towords our own time).

The time flowing backwards would have an associated space, too, but one, 
that we cannot see.

That space could pass like a ghost throuh our world and we wouldn't 
recognize its existence.

But that space is actually real and also populated, while we live in 
that 'negative world in a mirror' like ghosts, which passes through 
their world like being not there.

Betwenn forward and backwards time we can have a continuum of degrees 
and also 'sideways' time, which is a bit difficult to imagine.

Since matter is timelike stable, we are (as all matter) bound to our own 
time and could not exist in such a 'mirrored world'. Matter would simply 
disapear like in a black hole, if it enters such a realm of negative time.

But it would 'pop out of nowhere' in the space behind the mirror and 
that is, what we call 'big bang'.

TH

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Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-19 15:28 +0000
  Mass of photon? What it can't exist.  Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2025-02-19 15:53 +0000
    Re: Mass of photon? What it can't exist. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-19 19:26 +0000
      Re: Mass of photon? What it can't exist. Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2025-02-20 15:35 +0000
        Re: Mass of photon? What it can't exist. Maciej Wozniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2025-02-20 18:10 +0100
  Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. film.art@gmail.com (JanPB) - 2025-02-19 20:39 +0000
    Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-19 21:42 +0000
      Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. film.art@gmail.com (JanPB) - 2025-02-20 21:35 +0000
        Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-20 22:37 +0000
      Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2025-02-20 18:36 -0800
    Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-19 21:45 +0000
      Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. film.art@gmail.com (JanPB) - 2025-02-20 21:37 +0000
        Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-22 19:25 +0000
    Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-19 21:51 +0000
      Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. film.art@gmail.com (JanPB) - 2025-02-20 21:39 +0000
        Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-20 22:39 +0000
          Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2025-02-21 02:03 +0000
            Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-21 05:22 +0000
        Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-20 22:44 +0000
    Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-19 23:33 +0000
    Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-20 04:45 +0000
  Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2025-02-20 19:49 +0100
    Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Maciej Wozniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2025-02-20 20:13 +0100
      Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-20 19:34 +0000
        Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2025-02-20 22:34 +0100
          Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2025-02-20 21:44 +0000
            Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-21 05:53 +0000
            Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2025-02-21 09:26 +0100
              Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2025-02-21 11:29 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2025-02-22 08:31 +0100
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2025-02-22 12:48 -0800
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2025-02-22 20:52 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-22 21:43 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2025-02-22 23:22 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-23 04:24 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2025-02-23 14:45 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Maciej Wozniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2025-02-23 07:51 +0100
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2025-02-23 09:24 +0100
              Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-21 19:37 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-02-21 23:18 -0800
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-22 19:21 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2025-02-22 09:57 +0100
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-02-22 10:27 -0800
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2025-02-23 09:12 +0100
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2025-02-22 22:30 +0100
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2025-02-22 16:05 -0800
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2025-02-23 02:13 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-23 04:50 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. "Paul.B.Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2025-02-23 14:17 +0100
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Maciej Wozniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2025-02-23 15:53 +0100
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-23 20:03 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-23 21:46 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Maciej Wozniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2025-02-24 07:44 +0100
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-24 00:17 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-24 04:33 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2025-02-25 14:58 -0800
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2025-02-23 20:20 +0100
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2025-02-23 19:30 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-02-23 22:27 -0800
              Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-22 19:28 +0000
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2025-02-23 09:16 +0100
                Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. clzb93ynxj@att.net (LaurenceClarkCrossen) - 2025-02-23 21:51 +0000
          Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Maciej Wozniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2025-02-21 10:46 +0100
        Re: Relativity Derives Zero Deflection of Light By Gravity. Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2025-02-20 21:34 +0000

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