Groups > sci.physics.relativity > #656590

Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage

From	Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de>
Newsgroups	sci.physics.relativity
Subject	Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage
Date	2024-08-31 08:03 +0200
Message-ID	<ljfq00F34jeU2@mid.individual.net> (permalink)
References	(4 earlier) <M4vxPZKxPU6U7NDCGNWCGCM0lRc@jntp> <ljahm9F9dfdU2@mid.individual.net> <vapd5l$3tffr$1@dont-email.me> <ljd51mFl74gU4@mid.individual.net> <vas655$e2la$2@dont-email.me>

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Am Freitag000030, 30.08.2024 um 12:16 schrieb Python:
> Le 30/08/2024 à 07:53, Thomas Heger a écrit :
>> Am Donnerstag000029, 29.08.2024 um 10:57 schrieb Python:
> ...
>>>> But Einstein, however, had not written about a symmetric system of 
>>>> clock synchronization.
>>>
>>> Liar!
>>>
>>> « We assume that this definition of synchronism is free from 
>>> contradictions, and possible for any number of points; and that the 
>>> following relations are universally valid:
>>>
>>> 1.    *If the clock at B synchronizes with the clock at A, the clock 
>>> at A synchronizes with the clock at B*.
>>>
>>> 2.    If the clock at A synchronizes with the clock at B and also 
>>> with the clock at C, the clocks at B and C also synchronize with each 
>>> other.
>>> »
>>>
>>> What is point 1. if not *symmetry*?
>>
>> See here for instance:
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCGuhcrb-qM
>>
>> This is a video in German about Einstein's simultaneity , but you will 
>> certainly find something equivalent in English.
>>
>> The trick of Einstein's method was an extra-observer in the middle 
>> between the two ends of a longish train.
>>
>> Now this system would not require to correct the delay 'by hand'.
>>
>> And this method was apparently meant by Einstein himself.
> 
> This video is in NO WAY describing a synchronization procedure ! It
> actually assumes that clocks (both on train and platform) has been
> synchronized. This video is illustrating the relativity of simultaneity.

This 'relativity of simultaneity' is based on observations by an 
observer in the middle between A and B.

So, Einstein used this setting and related time the observations of an 
observer in the middle.

That observer (called 'M' for instance) would define, what is 
synchronous and what is not.

BUT: M would not take part in a synchronization procedure, because that 
would be carried out by operators of the clocks at A and B, which 
therefore need to be observers, too.

Now we could name those operators/observers 'A' and 'B', too (same as 
there position).

Then A would send a signal to B, which B reads and send it back to A.

Then the same process is initiated from B, who sends a ping to A. This 
is reflected back. B is then enabled to calculate the proper synch-time 
and dial his clock appropriately.

Now both (A and B) have clocks in synch.

What is not essential for their considerations, however, that is M and 
what M regards as time.


...


TH

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Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-08-26 10:06 +0300
  Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-08-27 07:32 +0200
    Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-08-27 11:58 +0200
      Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2024-08-27 10:40 +0000
        Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage "Paul.B.Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-08-27 20:11 +0200
          Is it a Joke? ? ?  Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2024-08-27 18:34 +0000
            Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? "Paul.B.Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-08-27 21:40 +0200
              Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2024-08-27 21:39 +0000
                Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? "Paul.B.Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-08-28 20:28 +0200
                Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2024-08-28 18:57 +0000
                Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? "Paul.B.Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-08-29 13:22 +0200
                Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2024-08-29 11:53 +0000
                Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? "Paul.B.Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-08-29 15:13 +0200
                Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? Richard Hachel <r.hachel@wanadou.fr> - 2024-08-29 13:36 +0000
                Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? "Paul.B.Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-08-29 20:35 +0200
                Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? "Paul.B.Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-08-29 15:36 +0200
                Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? Richard Hachel <r.hachel@wanadou.fr> - 2024-08-29 13:45 +0000
                Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-08-29 15:57 +0200
                Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? Richard Hachel <r.hachel@wanadou.fr> - 2024-08-29 15:00 +0000
                Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? Athel Cornish-Bowden <me@yahoo.com> - 2024-08-29 18:19 +0200
                Re: Is it a Joke? ? ? "Paul.B.Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-08-29 21:04 +0200
      Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-08-28 08:22 +0200
        Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-08-28 11:41 +0200
        Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2024-08-28 11:04 +0000
          Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-08-29 08:21 +0200
    Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2024-08-27 10:25 +0000
      Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-08-29 08:10 +0200
        Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Athel Cornish-Bowden <me@yahoo.com> - 2024-08-29 09:39 +0200
          Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-08-30 07:41 +0200
            Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Athel Cornish-Bowden <me@yahoo.com> - 2024-08-30 10:07 +0200
            Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-08-30 12:24 +0200
        Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-08-29 10:57 +0200
          Et ça continue...  Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2024-08-29 12:16 +0000
            Re: Et ça continue... Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-08-29 14:35 +0200
              Re: Et ça continue... Richard Hachel <r.hachel@wanadou.fr> - 2024-08-29 12:46 +0000
            Re: Et ça continue... Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-08-29 14:42 +0200
              Re: Et ça continue... Richard Hachel <r.hachel@wanadou.fr> - 2024-08-29 12:47 +0000
                Re: Et ça continue... "Paul.B.Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-08-29 21:25 +0200
          Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-08-30 07:53 +0200
            Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-08-30 12:16 +0200
              Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2024-08-30 10:38 +0000
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-08-30 12:45 +0200
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Maciej Wozniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2024-08-30 13:44 +0200
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-08-30 17:09 +0200
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Maciej Wozniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2024-08-30 20:03 +0200
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-08-31 14:19 +0200
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Maciej Wozniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2024-08-31 15:05 +0200
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-08-31 15:22 +0200
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Maciej Wozniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2024-08-31 15:32 +0200
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-08-31 15:36 +0200
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2024-08-30 12:12 +0000
              Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Maciej Wozniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2024-08-30 13:41 +0200
              Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-08-31 08:03 +0200
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2024-08-31 06:40 +0000
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Athel Cornish-Bowden <me@yahoo.com> - 2024-08-31 09:44 +0200
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-09-01 08:47 +0200
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Richard Hachel <r.hachel@wanadou.fr> - 2024-09-01 10:37 +0000
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-09-01 14:33 +0200
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Maciej Wozniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2024-09-01 15:37 +0200
                Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-08-31 12:30 +0200
        Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-08-29 13:10 +0300
    Re: [SR and synchronization] Cognitive Dissonances and Mental Blockage Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-08-27 15:39 +0300

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