Re: Apple Investors Beware?

From	Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net>
Newsgroups	comp.sys.mac.system
Subject	Re: Apple Investors Beware?
Date	2017-05-30 16:24 -0700
Organization	Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID	<ogkv05$9dt$1@gioia.aioe.org> (permalink)
References	(18 earlier) <592dcbd3$0$1380$c3e8da3$1cbc7475@news.astraweb.com> <ep621eFg4qjU1@mid.individual.net> <592dd78c$0$27158$b1db1813$e2fc9064@news.astraweb.com> <ep658uFgnd9U1@mid.individual.net> <592dfaf5$0$43723$c3e8da3$5e5e430d@news.astraweb.com>

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On 2017-05-30 4:06 PM, JF Mezei wrote:
> On 2017-05-30 17:07, Jolly Roger wrote:
> 
>> The point is that you are desperately building stawman arguments in an
>> attempt to legitimize the wrong doing of the airline and authorities -
> 
> I am not supprtive of what happened. There is a difference between
> trying to understand why this happened and judging if it was right or wrong.
> 
> 
>> Nope, the contract lays out *very* specific conditions under which a
>> passenger may be legally removed from their boarded seat,
> 
> Actually, can be prevented from traveling. (this includes smelling bad
> in the UA contract).
> 
> In the case of Dao, this was denied boarding due to overbooking. They
> just did the "denied" boarding in the plane instead of at the gate.
> Again, the contract does not stipilate that "denied boarding" must be
> done before you're on the plane.
> 
> Go back a few years to paper boarding passes and manual counting. (your
> parents would know about this, you're obviouysly too young).
> 
> Two pax get assigned same seat and when they do the head count inside
> aircraft and check everyone boarding passes, they realize there is one
> pax too many. One of them gets "denied boarding" treatment (which has
> defined compensation different from refusal of transport)
> 
> (Important to read the contract of carriage applicable at time of
> accident, not the current one).
> 
> (In fact, contract of carriage is at time of buying ticket, not on day
> of flight and this is important when airline changes rules for baggage
> for instance).
> 
> 
>> Dao was not denied boarding. He was granted boarding and then
>> involuntarily removed from the airplane. What does the contract say
>> about that?
> 
> He was involuntarily denied boarding after he boarded. As the text of
> the contract does not define/limit where "denied boarding" can happen,
> doing so while on the plane remains possible (even if the wording
> *suggests* it should happen prior to boarding.)

Look at the way you just tortured the language:

"denied boarding after he boarded".

> 
> They did not target him because he did not comply with the
> clothing/smell/behaviour. They had too many people on plane and first
> asked for volunteers for denied boarding, and when none turned up, they
> went for involuntary denied boarding and selected Dao.

Excepted he was already boarded.

You can be denied eating after you've eaten.

> 
> 
>> Transport” (Rule 21), which lays out the conditions under which a
>> passenger can be removed and refused transport on the aircraft. This
>> includes situations where passengers act in a “disorderly, offensive,
>> abusive, or violent” manner, refuse to comply with the smoking policy,
> 
>  From the moment he refused the involuntary denied boarding, he became
> disorderly (refusing an order to deplane). To an FA, if your refuse her
> orders, even if you stay calm and don't bother others, you are
> disorderly. And that kicks in "he is disorderly, call in the swat team
> to have him removed" process.

No. That is a circular argument. They had no legitimate reason to 
deplane this passenger. Even if you want to call it denying boarding 
(which is absurd on its face), they lacked the necessary condition: 
overbooking of the aircraft.

> 
> It was all wrog and blown out of proportion, but there was a logic to it.
> 
> And if the 3 extra passengers were imposed onto gate agent by someone
> higher up, and gate agent then tells FAs to remove passenger X because
> some manager requeste it, it is harder for the crews to not comply with
> chain of command because they are trained to comply with chain of command.

They broke their own rules.

Period.

> 
> 
> 
> This didn't happen because they broke the rules, it is because they
> blindly and stupidly followed the rules and didn't think or use judgement.

It did happen because they broke their own rules.

'The problem that United faces is that, it appears, they breached their 
own Carriage Contract.  Dr. Dao was not denied boarding.  United should 
have, as most carriers do, taken care of the oversold situation before 
boarding passengers.  Once boarded, UA’s own contract controls with 
respect to why a passenger can be removed from a plane and being 
oversold is not a stated reason.

It has been argued that ‘boarding’ includes being seated on the plane 
while the plane is still at the gate.  As boarding is not defined in the 
contract, and when read in conjunction with Rule 21 which uses the 
language ‘remove from the aircraft’, there is at best ambiguity and as 
anyone who has studied contracts knows – ambiguity is construed against 
the drafter.

Rule 21 “Refusal of Transport” gives United to the right to remove from 
the aircraft a passenger who violates any of the stated reasons. Based 
on the facts as they have been presented to date it appears that Dr. Dao 
was not removed for any of the stated reasons in Rule 21: 1) Dr. Dao did 
not breach the contract of carriage; 2) He was not asked to leave 
because of a government request, regulation or security directive; 3) 
There was no force majeure or other unforeseeable condition; 4) There 
was no necessity to search Dr. Dao or his property; 5) There was no 
issue with his identification; 6) Dr. Dao had paid for his ticket; 7) He 
was not travelling across international boundaries and finally; 8) None 
of the 19 safety issues stated in Rule 21 applied.'
Jim Arkell
Assistant Professor, Business Administration
Jim, in addition to teaching courses in Business Law and Business 
Ethics, is a licensed attorney (Texas) and has extensive experience in 
employment litigation. '

<http://www.natlawreview.com/article/united-airlines-dr-dao-and-contract-carriage>

You lose.

> 
> And this is why rules were changed and airlines have to let crews a bit
> more freedom in using judgement.

Wrong.

> 
> 
> But lets not kid ourselves, denied boarding will happen to people
> already on planes, but it won't be for stupid reasons. (if a seatback is
> broken for instance, the 3 people on that block get booted off because
> that seat becomes no-op due to safety reasons.
> 
> Similarly, the is a MEL (minimumn equipment list) and there are defined
> parameters such as if one exit is inop, they have to reduce number of
> passengers by X. Same if there is a crew member missing. There are a lot
> of situations where the capacity fo aircraft can be reduced at last
> minute requiring denied borading to some passengers. (or all if flight
> cancelled).
> 

Incorrect. That is not a denial of boarding.

That is "Refusal of Transport" for "force majeure"

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Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-17 08:26 -0600
  Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-17 10:31 -0400
    Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-17 10:46 -0600
      Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-17 12:50 -0400
        Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-18 03:16 -0600
          Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-18 10:48 -0400
            Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-18 20:37 -0600
              Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-19 00:10 -0400
      Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-18 09:20 +1200
        Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-17 17:25 -0400
          Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-18 03:09 -0600
            Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-18 10:48 -0400
              Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-18 21:44 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-18 18:00 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-19 13:48 +1200
              Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-18 20:46 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-19 00:10 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-20 18:01 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-20 21:31 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-23 19:38 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-23 22:17 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-23 21:55 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-24 00:26 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-27 19:10 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-27 23:58 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-24 18:36 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-27 19:15 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-26 01:12 +0000
            Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-19 09:40 +1200
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                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-22 11:07 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 09:11 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 17:30 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-22 19:48 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 23:08 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-22 20:12 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 18:41 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-23 19:28 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-23 09:25 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-23 19:29 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-23 19:19 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-23 22:17 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-26 02:25 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-26 13:37 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-27 19:34 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-27 23:58 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-28 04:55 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 23:16 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-23 19:06 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-24 13:31 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2017-05-23 20:12 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-24 15:57 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-27 19:45 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-27 23:58 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-28 05:14 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 23:19 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-29 18:48 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-30 18:42 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 23:18 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 10:53 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-30 18:43 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 20:53 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-31 13:17 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-23 22:17 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-26 02:33 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-26 13:37 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-27 15:44 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-27 10:27 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-26 19:08 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-27 15:59 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-28 10:58 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-27 23:09 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-28 12:58 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-27 21:08 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-29 03:26 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 10:53 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-29 08:51 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-29 12:19 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-30 18:52 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-30 09:05 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-28 04:47 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-28 19:33 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-28 09:32 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-28 18:06 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-29 03:30 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-29 08:48 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-29 18:47 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-30 19:28 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-30 18:39 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-31 06:28 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-31 12:14 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-27 19:15 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-19 15:08 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-20 11:13 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-19 16:26 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-19 19:28 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-22 06:52 +0000
        Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-18 03:30 -0600
          Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-18 10:48 -0400
            Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-18 21:19 -0600
              Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-19 00:10 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-23 19:48 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-23 22:17 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-27 19:57 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-27 23:58 -0400
              Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-19 15:11 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-20 11:16 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-19 16:22 -0700
          Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-19 09:31 +1200
            Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-18 16:14 -0700
              Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-19 13:37 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-18 21:43 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-22 11:37 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 14:06 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-22 15:09 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 15:13 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-22 14:23 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 12:58 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 21:25 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-22 19:50 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-22 21:00 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 21:25 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-22 19:52 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 18:49 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-23 16:13 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2017-05-23 19:58 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-23 09:30 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 09:27 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-23 20:03 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-23 19:19 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-26 01:14 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-27 20:06 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-27 23:58 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 09:19 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-26 02:54 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-26 13:37 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-26 19:34 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-26 23:52 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-29 03:39 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-19 15:03 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-20 11:10 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-19 16:25 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-20 14:31 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-19 19:41 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-20 15:45 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-19 22:45 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-27 20:23 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-27 23:58 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-29 03:46 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 10:53 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-29 08:50 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-29 16:11 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-29 09:18 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 12:28 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-29 13:33 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 13:58 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-29 18:59 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-29 16:07 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 17:52 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-29 19:02 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 19:23 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-29 23:35 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-29 22:59 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 23:09 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-30 03:20 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-30 00:55 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-30 11:58 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 12:05 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-30 15:04 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-30 12:12 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-30 19:16 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 15:22 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-30 15:45 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-30 12:50 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 15:58 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-30 20:12 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-30 16:35 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-30 21:07 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-30 19:06 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-30 16:24 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 19:35 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-30 21:45 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-30 19:36 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 22:48 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-31 02:52 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 23:02 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-31 00:53 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-31 00:59 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-31 07:03 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-31 00:05 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-30 17:09 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-31 00:19 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2017-05-30 17:31 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-31 00:37 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 20:38 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-31 00:40 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 20:53 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-06-03 05:35 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-30 16:34 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-29 23:29 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-30 00:53 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-29 18:59 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 15:26 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-29 16:15 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 17:52 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-29 18:17 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 18:20 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-30 00:49 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 22:07 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-28 17:47 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-19 19:28 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-22 11:53 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-23 16:11 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 10:38 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-28 13:00 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-29 03:47 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-22 11:26 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 13:29 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 10:45 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-28 13:00 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-29 09:17 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-28 18:10 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 09:14 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-22 14:25 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 12:55 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 21:25 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-22 19:50 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 18:45 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-23 10:35 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 21:14 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 00:10 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-23 11:44 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-23 09:35 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 21:21 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 00:10 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-29 16:19 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 00:20 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-23 21:20 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 21:17 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 00:10 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-23 11:11 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 21:28 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-29 16:24 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-30 13:17 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 22:07 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 17:30 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 10:46 -0600
            Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-18 21:49 -0600
              Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-19 17:16 +1200

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