Re: Apple Investors Beware?

From	Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com>
Newsgroups	comp.sys.mac.system
Subject	Re: Apple Investors Beware?
Date	2017-05-20 14:31 +1200
Organization	Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID	<ofo9q4$1fb6$1@gioia.aioe.org> (permalink)
References	<of7qcv$trm$1@news.albasani.net> <ofnu1k$101u$1@gioia.aioe.org> <ofnut3$417$1@news.datemas.de>

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On 2017-05-19 23:25:21 +0000, Alan Baker said:
> On 2017-05-19 4:10 PM, Your Name wrote:
>> On 2017-05-19 22:03:48 +0000, Alan Baker said:
>>> On 2017-05-18 6:37 PM, Your Name wrote:
>>>> On 2017-05-18 23:14:44 +0000, Alan Baker said:
>>>>> On 2017-05-18 2:31 PM, Your Name wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> B.  People want the convenience of having their own car and not
>>>>>>>> waiting for some silly "service" to decided to turn up.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> There are those that say the automobile is what led to the decline of
>>>>>>> public transportation in the United States.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> In some ways, yes.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> But the car also liberated the "common folk", allowing them to more
>>>>>> easily go on holiday, spend their leisure time elsewhere, live in the
>>>>>> suburbs.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> It's that last one that really kicked public transport since the
>>>>>> suburbs
>>>>>> have a lower population density, making public transport largely
>>>>>> unfeasible and unworkable.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I'm all for the private car, but driverless car services are going to
>>>>> be huge thing.
>>>> 
>>>> Only, perhaps, in the middle of large cities with a population density
>>>> that can make it worthwhile (at the expense of the taxi driver jobs).
>>>> Elsewhere they simply won't be economical to run and won't work ... just
>>>> like public transport now.
>>> 
>>> So... ...just like taxi cabs are today...
>>> 
>>> ...only less expensive.
>>> 
>>> :-)
>> 
>> I wouldn't bet on it. The cost of the cars themselves is likely to be
>> hugely over-priced (at least to begin with), plus the cost of the
>> battery pack replacements and constant recharging, then you've got to
>> factor in the simple corporate greed of the company running the
>> services, and the joke called "inflation" ... it's likely these
>> autonomous electric car services will actually cost more than a
>> *current* taxi ride does.
> 
> Nope. Because there'll be no way to hold onto a monopoly.

"Competition" doesn't necessarily mean lower prices. In fact it usually 
means artificially higher prices because everyone simply charges what 
the others do.

Apple's iPhone cost $1000 (just as an example figure), so Samsung make 
a similar phone and charge $999 ... technically it is cheaper, but 
realitisically it isn't.

Another example, here in New Zealand there are about five different 
supermarket brands, but the reality is that they are all owned by only 
two or three parent companies, so the "competition" is virtually 
non-existant and they simply copy each others prices - one has an item 
on "sale", and the other suddenly has the same / similar item on "sale".



>> Then, you're also unlikely to be able to just hail an autonomous
>> electric car on the street by sticking your arm out, so you also have to
>> factor in the cost of using your cellphone data and keeping your
>> cellphone charged.
> 
> Oh, no! Whatever will the billions of people who already do that do???

I don't even have a cellphone.  :-p
(Mind you, I have no intention of ever using a taxi nor autonomous car either.)

As is usual, people will want to get an auonomous car and suddenly find 
their cellphone has a flat battery, or is in dead zone ... of course 
that's marginally better than finding your personally-owned electric 
car has flat batteries!



>>>> And that's even ignoring that most roads around the world aren't defined
>>>> well enough for autonomous cars to understand, aren't mapped well enough
>>>> for GPS systems to utilise, etc.
>>> 
>>> I think you're rather underestimating:
>>> 
>>> 1. How well roads are being defined by companies like Google and Apple.
>>> 
>>> 2. How autonomous cars will operate with synthetic vision systems.
>>> 
>>> Will it start out with where the roads are best defined? Yes.
>>> 
>>> As it succeeds where that is true, will more roads get defined well
>>> enough to expand the system? You bet.
>> 
>> Believe me, there are many roads even around this suburban area that are
>> not clearly defined by centre-lines, kerbs, etc. ... and those are
>> suburban roads. Once you get out into real rural areas, you're lucky if
>> some roads even have tarmac surfaces. Plus far too many human drivers
>> still go in the exit of many shopping area carparks.
> 
> Yes. It will take some time...
> 
> ...but it's coming.

Many roads, admitedly mostly rural areas, will never be drivable by 
autonomous cars because there simply isn't enough distinguishable / 
navigable features to make them recognisable as roads.



>>>> It also ignores the fact that if anyone and everyone can then use a car,
>>>> the congestion is going to get WORSE, not better. You'll have all the
>>>> people who currently can't use a car able to use one (no license, too
>>>> disabled, too young, too old, even being used to pets being sent to the
>>>> vet / groomer / dog walker or parcels being delivered), and you'll still
>>>> mostly have single-occupant vehicles
>>> 
>>> No. Because autonomous cars will be able to coordinate with each other
>>> better and will need less space on the road between each of them for
>>> the same speed of travel.
>> 
>> Not for a LONG LONG time yet because there will still be proper cars on
>> the roads driven by humans that the autonomous cars will have to make
>> allowances for. Unless you going to restrict different cars to different
>> lanes (or worse yet, build an entire new separated lane / road structure
>> just for autonmous cars .. today we call those train tracks.   ;-)
> 
> But it's not like the congestion you're imagining is going to happen 
> all at once. That is a far down the road possibility of everyone having 
> an autonomous car to use.

It's actually near than you think. The instant autonomous cars come 
into public use, you'll have lots of people who previous couldn't drive 
suddenly able to "drive" themselves ... that will add MORE cars to the 
existing congestion.

As (supposedly) more people slowly switch their current normal car to 
an autonomous one, you'll still have the same congestion ... or in fact 
MORE congestion since the population is always rising.

Of course once *ALL* cars are autonomous, they will then be able to 
travel closer together at more efficient speeds, etc., but that is a 
long way off yet.

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Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2017-05-07 19:57 -0400
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                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-27 23:09 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-28 12:58 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-27 21:08 -0400
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                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 10:53 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-29 08:51 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-29 12:19 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-30 18:52 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-30 09:05 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-28 04:47 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-28 19:33 +1200
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                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-28 18:06 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-29 03:30 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-29 08:48 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-29 18:47 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-30 19:28 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-30 18:39 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-31 06:28 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-31 12:14 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-27 19:15 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-19 15:08 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-20 11:13 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-19 16:26 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-19 19:28 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-22 06:52 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-18 03:30 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-18 10:48 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-18 21:19 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-19 00:10 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-23 19:48 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-23 22:17 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-27 19:57 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-27 23:58 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-19 15:11 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-20 11:16 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-19 16:22 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-19 09:31 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-18 16:14 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-19 13:37 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-18 21:43 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-22 11:37 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 14:06 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-22 15:09 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 15:13 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-22 14:23 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 12:58 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 21:25 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-22 19:50 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-22 21:00 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 21:25 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-22 19:52 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 18:49 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-23 16:13 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2017-05-23 19:58 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-23 09:30 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 09:27 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-23 20:03 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-23 19:19 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-26 01:14 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-27 20:06 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-27 23:58 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 09:19 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-26 02:54 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-26 13:37 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-26 19:34 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-26 23:52 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-29 03:39 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-19 15:03 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-20 11:10 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-19 16:25 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-20 14:31 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-19 19:41 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-20 15:45 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-19 22:45 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-27 20:23 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-27 23:58 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-29 03:46 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 10:53 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-29 08:50 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-29 16:11 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-29 09:18 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 12:28 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-29 13:33 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 13:58 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-29 18:59 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-29 16:07 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 17:52 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-29 19:02 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 19:23 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-29 23:35 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-29 22:59 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 23:09 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-30 03:20 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-30 00:55 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-30 11:58 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 12:05 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-30 15:04 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-30 12:12 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-30 19:16 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 15:22 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-30 15:45 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-30 12:50 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 15:58 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-30 20:12 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-30 16:35 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-30 21:07 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-30 19:06 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-30 16:24 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 19:35 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-30 21:45 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-30 19:36 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 22:48 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-31 02:52 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 23:02 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-31 00:53 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-31 00:59 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-31 07:03 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-31 00:05 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-30 17:09 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-31 00:19 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2017-05-30 17:31 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-31 00:37 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 20:38 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-31 00:40 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-30 20:53 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-06-03 05:35 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-30 16:34 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2017-05-29 23:29 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-30 00:53 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-29 18:59 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 15:26 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-29 16:15 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 17:52 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-29 18:17 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 18:20 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-30 00:49 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 22:07 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-28 17:47 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-19 19:28 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-22 11:53 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-23 16:11 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 10:38 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-28 13:00 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-29 03:47 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-22 11:26 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 13:29 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 10:45 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-28 13:00 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-29 09:17 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-28 18:10 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 09:14 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-22 14:25 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 12:55 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 21:25 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-22 19:50 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-23 18:45 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-23 10:35 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 21:14 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 00:10 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-23 11:44 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-23 09:35 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 21:21 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 00:10 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-29 16:19 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 00:20 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-23 21:20 +0000
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 21:17 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 00:10 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-23 11:11 -0700
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 21:28 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-29 16:24 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-30 13:17 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-29 22:07 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-22 17:30 -0400
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-28 10:46 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Ken Springer <wordworks@greeleynet.com> - 2017-05-18 21:49 -0600
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-19 17:16 +1200
        Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-09 14:21 -0700
          Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-10 09:27 +1200
          Re: Apple Investors Beware? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2017-05-09 17:48 -0400
            Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-09 18:11 -0400
            Re: Apple Investors Beware? Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2017-05-10 09:50 -0700
              Re: Apple Investors Beware? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2017-05-11 12:49 +1200
                Re: Apple Investors Beware? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-11 08:55 -0400
          Re: Apple Investors Beware? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2017-05-09 22:42 +0000

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