Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone?

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Newsgroups	comp.sys.mac.system
Subject	Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone?
Date	2015-10-09 18:00 +0000
Organization	People for the Ethical Treatment of Pirates
Message-ID	<d7qdlnF25gvU9@mid.individual.net> (permalink)
References	(9 earlier) <6L6dnSjW2uJXdYvLnZ2dnUU7-f-dnZ2d@giganews.com> <d7p7vaFofs0U1@mid.individual.net> <VfOdnQVkHvIPVIrLnZ2dnUU7-aGdnZ2d@giganews.com> <d7q999F25gvU1@mid.individual.net> <4eydnbm5Up9HZYrLnZ2dnUU7-RmdnZ2d@giganews.com>

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On 2015-10-09, Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:
> On 2015-10-09 12:45, Jolly Roger wrote:
>> On 2015-10-09, Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:
>>> On 2015-10-09 03:16, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>> Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-10-08 17:02, nospam wrote:
>>>>>> In article <d7o3qoFgbrkU1@mid.individual.net>, Jolly Roger
>>>>>> <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The keys are encrypted with a pass phrase only I and my wife know. I'm
>>>>>>>>> not worried. : )
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hence the term "rubber hose decryption" (aka: court order).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Courts don't scare me. I'll never give it up, based on principle.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> a court can't compel you to disclose a password, however, they can
>>>>>> force you to put your finger on a fingerprint sensor of an iphone.
>>>>>
>>>>> There are cases in the US where the court successfully ordered the
>>>>> defendant to give up the keys.
>>>>
>>>> That doesn't mean the defendant can't refuse.
>>>>
>>>>> Also NSL's can be used to force disclosure of keys from 3rd parties.
>>>>> (Lavabit quit e-mail over it).
>>>>
>>>> If you can't trust your spouse with your deepest secrets, you married the
>>>> wrong person. ; )
>>>
>>> Agreed - but that's not what I was on about.
>>
>> Nobody else knows my pass phrases.
>
> Still not what I was on about.  I was referring to lavabit shutting down 
> to avoid being compelled to hand over customer e-mails.

Right, but which third party do you think has my encryption keys? 

I have them stored in a text file within an encrypted DMG with one pass
phrase only known by my wife and me, which is in turn stored on a
FileVault volume encrypted with a different pass phrase only known by us
on an SSD on one computer. To get to my encryption key someone would
have to thwart two sets of encryption with two different long pass
phrases only known by two people on planet Earth. : )

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? FPP <fredp151@gmail.com> - 2015-10-08 04:43 -0400
  Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Calum <com.gmail@nospam.scottishwildcat> - 2015-10-08 11:13 +0100
    Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? FPP <fredp151@gmail.com> - 2015-10-08 07:36 -0400
      Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-10-08 13:36 -0400
    Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-08 08:38 -0400
      Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 17:23 +0000
        Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-08 16:30 -0400
          Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 20:39 +0000
            Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-08 16:46 -0400
              Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 21:00 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-08 17:02 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 21:17 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-08 17:37 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 21:48 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-08 18:21 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 16:48 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-09 13:29 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 18:01 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-08 18:06 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 07:16 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-09 10:05 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-10-09 15:57 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-09 12:50 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 18:01 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-09 14:43 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-10-09 18:14 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-09 14:29 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-09 14:56 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-10-09 15:09 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-09 15:13 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-10-11 01:58 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-11 10:11 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-10-11 21:04 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-11 17:16 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-10-11 01:56 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-11 10:09 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-11 11:18 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-11 11:37 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-11 11:54 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-11 12:07 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-11 12:41 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-11 13:33 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-10-11 21:03 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-11 17:15 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-11 17:49 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-11 19:13 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-10-12 03:10 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-12 09:12 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-10-12 15:13 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-12 12:03 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-10-09 14:26 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 18:39 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-10-11 01:59 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 16:45 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-09 13:26 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 18:00 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-09 14:24 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 18:39 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-09 15:12 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2015-10-09 12:09 +0100
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-10-08 22:21 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? ANTant@zimage.com (Ant) - 2015-10-08 20:53 -0500
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 16:49 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-08 17:53 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 22:01 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-08 18:08 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 07:16 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-09 10:03 -0400
            Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-10-08 18:09 -0400
              Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 07:22 +0000
    Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2015-10-08 10:24 -0700
      Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-08 13:27 -0400
        Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 17:29 +0000
          Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2015-10-08 11:26 -0700
          Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? FPP <fredp151@gmail.com> - 2015-10-08 20:13 -0400
            Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 16:50 +0000
              Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? FPP <fredp151@gmail.com> - 2015-10-09 15:29 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-10 02:15 +0000
        Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-10-08 14:21 -0400
          Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 18:51 +0000
          Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2015-10-09 12:09 +1300
        Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> - 2015-10-08 13:49 -0500
        Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-08 16:35 -0400
      Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-08 16:31 -0400
        Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 20:40 +0000
          Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-08 16:47 -0400
            Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 21:00 +0000
              Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-08 17:56 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 22:03 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-08 18:08 -0400
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-10-08 18:16 -0400
              Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2015-10-08 16:40 -0700
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 07:22 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2015-10-09 10:14 -0700
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 18:04 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2015-10-09 14:11 -0700
          Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-10-08 18:09 -0400
            Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-08 18:11 -0400
            Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 07:17 +0000
          Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? FPP <fredp151@gmail.com> - 2015-10-08 20:14 -0400
          Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Calum <com.gmail@nospam.scottishwildcat> - 2015-10-09 20:18 +0100
            Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-10 04:00 +0000
        Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Electric Comet <electric-comet@mail.invalid> - 2015-10-09 08:04 -0700
          Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2015-10-10 16:00 +1300
            Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-10 04:05 +0000
            Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Electric Comet <electric-comet@mail.invalid> - 2015-10-10 11:02 -0700
              Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2015-10-11 10:39 +1300
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Electric Comet <electric-comet@mail.invalid> - 2015-10-11 10:10 -0700
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-11 13:38 -0400
              Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-10-11 02:02 +0000
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Electric Comet <electric-comet@mail.invalid> - 2015-10-11 10:16 -0700
                Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-10-11 21:06 +0000
  Re: El Capitan - Secure Delete Trash Option gone? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-10-08 15:04 +0000

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