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Re: The Joy of *small* business

From D <nospam@example.net>
Newsgroups comp.os.linux.misc
Subject Re: The Joy of *small* business
Date 2024-12-22 22:54 +0100
Organization i2pn2 (i2pn.org)
Message-ID <1b67871a-8311-06f1-8738-c1d7068575f1@example.net> (permalink)
References (17 earlier) <QuydnT2QrdBxJvr6nZ2dnZfqn_SdnZ2d@earthlink.com> <lsq4iuF2ubgU2@mid.individual.net> <vk8nib$ie68$3@dont-email.me> <fd79319f-61cb-9c03-df4c-7fdd06cc6247@example.net> <vk9arn$lsr4$2@dont-email.me>

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On Sun, 22 Dec 2024, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> On 22/12/2024 11:28, D wrote:
>>> The only difference is the latter big bang has a sentient intelligence 
>>> with a Plan in charge.
>>> 
>>> Really we only reject it on the slender basis of Occam - it's simply more 
>>> complicated than necessary to explain this shit.
>> 
>> I'd add to that that one is a process and open to change (which has 
>> happened and does happen occasionally) and the other a religion.
>> 
> I wasn't talking about the *practice* of science, or of religion for that 
> matter. I was talking about their metaphysical *beliefs*.

Ahh... our definitions differ when it comes to science. I was tricked! But 
I will drop this line as I think it leads us back to old threads. ;)

>> I have mixed feelings about Occam, since Occam tends to shut down waaaay 
>> too many discussions waaay too quickly. Who is to say what is, in reality 
>> "simpler" or less complex, if the understanding of the questions is 
>> lacking?
>
> Precisely, In many ways the God explanation is simpler :
>
> "God did it all,  and faked it so it looks like he was never there at all, to 
> test you fuckers"
>
> ...there are only three people who understand quantum physics and two of them 
> are liars....

This is the truth and exactly one of the things I do not like with Occam. 
If you're on team God (TM) that's the easiest explanation, if you're on 
team Science (C), that's nonsense, and your version is the simplest.

There's no way to decide from a neutral point, if you are dealing with 
religious people regardless of if they are from the religion religion, or 
the religion science (which has very little to do with the science as a 
process).

> But if you examine Occam from outside the confines of realism and 
> materialism, he makes perfect sense.
>
> 1. The problem of induction means that no inference  can ever be proved to be 
> correct.
> 2. So given that its all bullshit anyway, why not pick the simplest bullshit 
> that fits the facts?
> 3.  ...And fits within the accepted already established bullshit, that 
> works...

Ah, but the problem of induction is a chimera, an illusion. Popper argued 
that justification is not needed at all, and seeking justification "begs 
for an authoritarian answer".

The only thing we need to worry about is if it works, and that's it.

> That is today's problem., People are absolutely reluctant to abandon the 
> established bullshit, that works.

This is not a problem, this is the way. If it works, is in fact the only 
way. If that is abandoned, everything else is meaningless. That is the 
strength of materialism and a common, shared external world, and one of 
the best arguments for it.

We've been down this path many times before I think.

> Even when they know it is actually wrong.
>
> The Kuhnian paradigm shift  is staring them in the face, but they simply cant 
> accept it.
>
>
>
>

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The Joy of *small* business Lars Poulsen <lars@cleo.beagle-ears.com> - 2024-12-14 21:26 +0000
  Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-14 23:31 +0100
    Re: The Joy of *small* business Lars Poulsen <lars@cleo.beagle-ears.com> - 2024-12-15 14:08 +0000
      Re: The Joy of *small* business Lars Poulsen <lars@cleo.beagle-ears.com> - 2024-12-15 14:15 +0000
        Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-15 18:05 +0100
      Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-15 18:02 +0100
      Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-15 19:47 +0000
        Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-15 23:10 +0100
          Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-16 00:04 -0500
            Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-16 10:44 +0100
            Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-16 21:18 +0000
              Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-16 21:14 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-17 04:07 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-17 10:49 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-17 10:28 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-17 21:41 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-18 00:05 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-18 07:09 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-18 10:01 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-18 19:11 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-18 20:15 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-18 23:02 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-19 05:09 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-19 11:07 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-19 10:08 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-19 10:59 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-18 22:32 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-19 05:06 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-19 10:01 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-19 19:43 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-18 22:03 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-19 05:14 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-19 09:59 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business Don_from_AZ <djatechNOSPAM@comcast.net.invalid> - 2024-12-19 09:45 -0700
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-19 19:06 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-19 09:56 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-19 19:08 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2024-12-19 16:35 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-20 03:32 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-20 03:56 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-20 05:05 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-20 10:42 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-20 11:00 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-18 21:56 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-19 05:25 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-19 09:50 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-19 19:49 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-19 09:47 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-18 10:00 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-18 23:28 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-19 00:16 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-19 10:17 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-19 10:15 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-20 03:22 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-20 09:18 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-20 11:45 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-21 01:23 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-21 09:54 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-21 21:45 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-22 09:40 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-22 12:06 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-21 22:04 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-22 05:46 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-22 02:12 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-22 09:31 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-22 09:53 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-22 12:28 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-22 15:22 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-22 22:54 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-23 08:46 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-23 12:59 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-23 00:13 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-12-23 06:09 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-23 08:15 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-12-23 18:20 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-23 21:29 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-23 09:10 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-24 02:10 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-23 06:26 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-23 12:55 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-23 09:10 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-23 12:43 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-24 01:57 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-24 15:28 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-24 21:08 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-25 12:36 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-22 20:54 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-22 23:42 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-23 09:05 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-24 01:24 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-23 12:38 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-22 12:24 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-22 21:12 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-23 12:15 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-22 23:14 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-23 12:35 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-22 09:29 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-20 11:38 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-20 20:30 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-21 01:40 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-21 08:15 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-18 20:34 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-18 20:17 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-19 10:40 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-12-19 10:27 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-18 23:32 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-19 10:52 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-18 19:56 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-17 21:38 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-18 20:24 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-18 23:38 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-19 11:00 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-17 23:56 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-18 20:31 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-12-18 21:49 -0500
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-19 10:56 +0100
              Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-17 10:47 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-17 22:31 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-18 20:28 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-18 23:48 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-19 10:54 +0100
                Re: The Joy of *small* business rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-12-19 19:22 +0000
                Re: The Joy of *small* business D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-12-20 10:27 +0100

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