Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen

Message-ID	<6688b347@news.ausics.net> (permalink)
From	not@telling.you.invalid (Computer Nerd Kev)
Subject	Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen
Newsgroups	comp.misc
References	(1 earlier) <v657js$26kh2$1@news.mixmin.net> <2a4c6859-bc2a-ad3a-0625-5a21db61204c@example.net> <v67cdi$2v6vc$3@dont-email.me> <871q48kyiz.fsf@eder.anydns.info> <v6a6v6$3gqkm$5@dont-email.me>
Date	2024-07-06 13:00 +1000
Organization	Ausics - https://newsgroups.ausics.net

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Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
> On Fri, 05 Jul 2024 10:56:20 +0200, Andreas Eder wrote:
>> Free markets ten ro become oligopols, if not regulated.
> 
> Case in point: the introduction of mobile phones. The Europeans decided 
> that there had to be a common standard, rather than having every carrier 
> build its own proprietary network. So they came up with a Government-
> mandated spec called "GSM". Yes, it was a complex. bureaucratic spec, but 
> it was a proper spec, with compliance tests and everything. So you had 
> proper interoperability. The only thing that tied you to a particular 
> carrier was that you got your SIM card from them. So switching carriers 
> was as easy as getting a new SIM card.

Ahh, except that the spec included SIM Locking, with which all that
compatiblity can be made irrelevent for a user with a network-locked
phone:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIM_lock

Worse Telstra in Australia silently clamped down the network
locking so my new Telstra-locked 4G phone won't work with a
Telstra-reseller's SIM (same network, resold by another
company), even though my old 3G Telstra-locked phone does. So I
wasted my money on that (they'll unlock it, but for more than I
paid for the phone).

By the way, an example of BS on Wikipedia:
"In Australia, carriers can choose whether to SIM/Network Lock 
 handsets or not, however in practice, is rarely performed except in 
 limited cases. Almost all handsets available on the Australian 
 market have no such restriction."
 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIM_lock#Australia

Stores here are _full_ of locked phones and have been for decades.

This checks out for the UK though:
"The UK's mobile networks are to be forbidden from selling phones 
 locked to their services from December 2021."
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIM_lock#United_Kingdom

Mobile networks banned from selling locked phones
https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-54692179

So yes governments can mandate universal SIM compatibility, though
it looks like it's not something broadly applicable in Europe, and
it's not just thanks to GSM. GSM clearly served the purposes of the
network operators more than those of users, by allowing them to use
common hardware while still restricting its usage to one company's
network. There's also still different frequency bands which aren't
all supported by phones.

Here in Aus I got an unlocked Nokia instead, and I now know I can't
buy new Telstra-locked mobile devices expecting them to work with
my SIMs anymore. So that's market forces at work. I'm one new
customer in the unlocked phone market, although a pretty grumpy
one who'd have been better off in the UK. I'll get around to
selling the locked phone on Ebay eventually.

-- 
__          __
#_ < |\| |< _#

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My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Ben Collver <bencollver@tilde.pink> - 2024-07-01 13:18 +0000
  Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Kees Nuyt <k.nuyt@nospam.demon.nl> - 2024-07-01 23:28 +0200
  Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-01 23:37 +0200
    Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Ben Collver <bencollver@tilde.pink> - 2024-07-02 04:52 +0000
  Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-01 21:53 +0000
  Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Anonymous <anon@anon.net> - 2024-07-04 00:15 -0400
    Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-04 12:42 +0200
      Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-04 23:49 +0000
        Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Andreas Eder <a_eder_muc@web.de> - 2024-07-05 10:56 +0200
          Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-05 11:44 +0200
            Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2024-07-05 12:34 +0000
              Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-05 19:09 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2024-07-05 18:51 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2024-07-05 23:37 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-06 12:20 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-06 12:18 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2024-07-06 13:28 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-07 12:31 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2024-07-08 02:35 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-08 12:22 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2024-07-08 21:50 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-09 12:09 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2024-07-09 12:28 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-10 12:31 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-07 04:48 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-07 12:38 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Andreas Eder <a_eder_muc@web.de> - 2024-07-06 12:12 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Eric Pozharski <apple.universe@posteo.net> - 2024-07-06 13:40 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-07 12:35 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-08 22:13 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Eric Pozharski <apple.universe@posteo.net> - 2024-07-08 12:11 +0000
          Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-06 01:34 +0000
            Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen not@telling.you.invalid (Computer Nerd Kev) - 2024-07-06 13:00 +1000
              Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-06 07:10 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen not@telling.you.invalid (Computer Nerd Kev) - 2024-07-07 09:09 +1000
            Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-06 12:28 +0200
              Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Dave Yeo <dave.r.yeo@gmail.com> - 2024-07-06 08:41 -0700
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-07 12:34 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Dave Yeo <dave.r.yeo@gmail.com> - 2024-07-07 09:27 -0700
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-07 21:08 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-08 22:12 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Eric Pozharski <apple.universe@posteo.net> - 2024-07-09 08:34 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-09 12:10 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Eric Pozharski <apple.universe@posteo.net> - 2024-07-08 12:04 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-07 22:06 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-08 12:19 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-08 12:17 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Anonymous <anon@anon.net> - 2024-07-07 20:44 -0400
              Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-07 01:35 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-07 12:36 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-07 22:07 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-08 12:17 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2024-07-09 00:18 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-09 12:10 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Dave Yeo <dave.r.yeo@gmail.com> - 2024-07-10 08:57 -0700
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-10 22:32 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-11 11:20 +0200
        Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-05 11:37 +0200
          Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-06 01:25 +0000
            Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-06 12:21 +0200
              Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-07 01:37 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-07 12:37 +0200
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-07 22:34 +0000
                Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-08 12:18 +0200
    Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-04 23:48 +0000
      Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-05 11:40 +0200
        Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-06 01:24 +0000
          Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-06 12:21 +0200
            Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-07-07 01:38 +0000
              Re: My Dinner With Marc Andreessen D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-07-07 12:37 +0200

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