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Re: tools for programming applets

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horos22 wrote:

Attribution restored (shame on you, horos22!)
Joshua Cranmer wrote:
>> Java applets were designed to be as secure as possible. Hence why, for
>> example, they are forbidden from opening a network connection to
>> anywhere other than their source domain. Allowing you to replace your
>> own applet to run in another's context domain is a recipe for security
>> holes; in principle, you could allow the server to list other applets
>> that can run in their domain (in similarity to how CORS stuff works),
>> but that is essentially the same level of changes needed as hosting
>> another copy of the applet.
>>
>> --

> Josuha,

That's not how his name is spelled.

> I understand that this is a security risk - if used in production
> systems. But as a development tool, it's invaluable.

As a development tool, a copy of the server environment is what's invaluable. 
  What you ask is unnecessary and harmful.

Something smells bad about your setup, horos22.  You can't fake a development 
environment with heinous security hacks.  What's actually going on?  Come on, 
you can tell us.  We won't snitch.

> Consider protocol development. When I develop a ssh client, or mysql
> client, or iscsi client, I don't need to make a new server instance or
> somehow have to duplicate the server environment. The tests are

Yes, you do.  You are so wrong here.  Of course you work in a duplicate 
environment.  Development directly in the production environment is stupid, 
risky, unprofessional, idiotic, untoward, and really not recommended.

> *client* driven. I change the client, and as long as the protocol
> works, I can make whatever changes I want behind the scenes without
> touching *anything* except the source code on the client.

But you aren't asking to change a *client* [sic].  You're asking to change a 
server.  But you don't want to do it safely, properly or ethically.  Doesn't 
smell right, in the sense that Stilton cheese left outin late August in El 
Paso doesn't smell right.

> Suppose you had 10 developers working on an applet. What are they
> supposed to do? Duplicate the parent environment 10 separate times?

YES!

Duhhh.

Why not?  Why do you seem so frelling horrified by that perfectly sensible and 
common and proper approach?

Hm?

> What if the central environment changes? Do you then need to propogate
> those changes to all 10 daughter environments? what if two people want
> to merge changes or then test their changes our versus production
> data? Do they need then to impact production by having their applet
> hosted in the production world?
>
> This makes no sense. I can't believe there isn't something out there

What you suggest makes no sense, and is harmful.

> to do this. Unix has a permissions system and its invaluable - you

and was not developed on the production box.

> open up the permissions on things to do development, get stuff done,
> and then close down the permissions when you ship. There's gotta be a
> way to overcome the extreme development penalty inherent in cloning

That's rich, "extreme development penalty" for the safest, most common and 
proper way to go.  Hahaha.  ROTFLMAO.

> environments here; elsewise I feel damn sorry for the java [sic] applet
> developer..

Get over it.  I certainly don't feel sorry for you.

Do start attributing citations, please.  Have you not posted to Usenet before, 
horos22?

-- 
Lew
Honi soit qui mal y pense.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Friz.jpg

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tools for programming applets horos22 <ed.peschko@gmail.com> - 2011-05-20 14:43 -0700
  Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-21 09:57 +1200
    Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-20 18:27 -0400
    Re: tools for programming applets "Richard Maher" <maher_rj@hotspamnotmail.com> - 2011-05-21 08:56 +0800
    Re: tools for programming applets Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-05-20 21:28 -0400
      Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-22 11:11 +1200
    Re: tools for programming applets markspace <-@.> - 2011-05-20 18:31 -0700
    Re: tools for programming applets "Nasser M. Abbasi" <nma@12000.org> - 2011-05-21 12:15 -0700
      Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-22 11:15 +1200
      Re: tools for programming applets Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> - 2011-05-22 14:35 +0100
        Re: tools for programming applets Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> - 2011-05-22 08:12 -0700
          Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-23 12:26 +1200
            Re: tools for programming applets Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-05-22 20:59 -0400
              Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-22 22:01 -0400
              Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-23 14:17 +1200
                Re: tools for programming applets Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-05-22 23:34 -0400
                Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-23 18:44 +1200
                Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-23 09:13 -0400
                Re: tools for programming applets Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-05-23 10:37 -0400
                Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-24 20:15 +1200
                Re: tools for programming applets Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-05-24 07:04 -0300
                Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-27 14:14 +1200
                Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-24 08:10 -0400
                Re: tools for programming applets Stanimir Stamenkov <s7an10@netscape.net> - 2011-05-24 16:09 +0300
                Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-26 11:35 +1200
                Re: tools for programming applets Stanimir Stamenkov <s7an10@netscape.net> - 2011-05-27 00:13 +0300
                Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-27 18:50 +1200
                Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-27 09:55 -0400
                Re: tools for programming applets Michael Wojcik <mwojcik@newsguy.com> - 2011-05-27 11:31 -0400
                Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-28 14:35 +1200
                Re: tools for programming applets Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> - 2011-05-28 12:17 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets Alessio Stalla <alessiostalla@gmail.com> - 2011-05-30 03:26 -0700
  Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-20 18:29 -0400
  Re: tools for programming applets markspace <-@.> - 2011-05-20 16:11 -0700
    Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-20 20:12 -0400
      Re: tools for programming applets horos22 <ed.peschko@gmail.com> - 2011-05-21 09:10 -0700
        Re: tools for programming applets Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-05-21 12:55 -0400
          Re: tools for programming applets horos22 <ed.peschko@gmail.com> - 2011-05-22 05:18 -0700
            Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-22 08:37 -0400
            Re: tools for programming applets markspace <-@.> - 2011-05-22 05:58 -0700
              Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-23 12:34 +1200
                Re: tools for programming applets markspace <-@.> - 2011-05-22 18:11 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-22 22:06 -0400
                Re: tools for programming applets markspace <-@.> - 2011-05-22 20:26 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2011-05-22 21:31 -0400
                Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-23 14:14 +1200
              Re: tools for programming applets horos22 <ed.peschko@gmail.com> - 2011-05-23 08:31 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-23 12:08 -0400
                Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-27 14:13 +1200
            Re: tools for programming applets Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-05-22 17:39 -0400
        Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-22 15:38 +1200
          Re: tools for programming applets horos22 <ed.peschko@gmail.com> - 2011-05-22 05:24 -0700
            Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-22 08:41 -0400
            Re: tools for programming applets markspace <-@.> - 2011-05-22 05:43 -0700
              Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-22 08:53 -0400
                Re: tools for programming applets markspace <-@.> - 2011-05-22 06:15 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets horos22 <ed.peschko@gmail.com> - 2011-05-23 08:38 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-23 12:17 -0400
                Re: tools for programming applets Alessio Stalla <alessiostalla@gmail.com> - 2011-05-24 05:22 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-24 08:38 -0400
                Re: tools for programming applets Alessio Stalla <alessiostalla@gmail.com> - 2011-05-24 06:33 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-25 12:06 +1200
                Re: tools for programming applets Alessio Stalla <alessiostalla@gmail.com> - 2011-05-26 05:54 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-27 00:57 +1200
                Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-26 09:04 -0400
                Re: tools for programming applets Alessio Stalla <alessiostalla@gmail.com> - 2011-05-26 06:12 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-26 09:28 -0400
                Re: tools for programming applets Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> - 2011-05-26 14:47 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2011-05-26 13:51 +0000
                Re: tools for programming applets Alessio Stalla <alessiostalla@gmail.com> - 2011-05-26 07:38 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2011-05-26 15:23 +0000
                Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-27 14:10 +1200
                Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-27 14:11 +1200
                Re: tools for programming applets Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2011-05-27 14:47 +0000
                Re: tools for programming applets Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> - 2011-05-24 10:07 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets markspace <-@.> - 2011-05-23 11:27 -0700
            Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-23 12:23 +1200
              Re: tools for programming applets horos22 <ed.peschko@gmail.com> - 2011-05-23 08:50 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-24 14:45 +1200
                Re: tools for programming applets Andrew Thompson <andrewthommo@gmail.com> - 2011-05-25 03:46 -0700
                Re: tools for programming applets Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-27 14:12 +1200
  Re: tools for programming applets Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2011-05-21 09:31 -0700
  Re: tools for programming applets "Richard Maher" <maher_rj@hotspamnotmail.com> - 2011-05-22 08:05 +0800
    Re: tools for programming applets horos22 <ed.peschko@gmail.com> - 2011-05-22 05:30 -0700
      Re: tools for programming applets markspace <-@.> - 2011-05-22 06:05 -0700
  Re: tools for programming applets Silvio <silvio@moc.com> - 2011-05-24 12:30 +0200
    Re: tools for programming applets Michael Wojcik <mwojcik@newsguy.com> - 2011-05-26 14:29 -0400
  Re: tools for programming applets Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-05-26 16:37 +0000

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