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Re: Arrays in java

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On Wed, 11 Jul 2012 17:20:37 -0700 (PDT), Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com>
wrote:

>Gene Wirchenko wrote:
>> Lew wrote:
>> &gt;What exactly do you find unclear about 
>> &gt;
>> &gt;“Brackets are allowed in declarators as a nod to the tradition of C and C++. The general rules for variable declaration, however, permit brackets to appear on both the type and in declarators, so that the local variable declaration: 
>> &gt;
>> &gt;“    float[][] f[][], g[][][], h[];  // Yechh! 
>> &gt;
>> &gt;“We do not recommend &quot;mixed notation&quot; in an array variable declaration, where brackets appear on both the type and in declarators.” 
>> &gt;
>> &gt;&lt;http://docs.oracle.com/javase/specs/jls/se7/html/jls-10.html#jls-10.2&gt; 
>> &gt;
>> &gt;I would be glad to help you with it.
>> 
>>      That an individual example is clear does not prove that the whole
>> is clear.  Even if all examples are clear, it does not mean that the
>> whole coheres.
>
>It is the individual example that sparked Roedy's diatribe. Ergo 
>I concluded it must have posed him some difficulties for him to 
>gripe about it.
>
>Regardless, Roedy has expressed difficulty with the JLS and I am 
>happy to help him wherever that difficulty lies.
>
>I am astounded that you join him in apologetics for ignorance.

     I do no such thing.

>Programming is a game of knowledge and mastery. If you deliberately 
>exclude the normative documentation for the platform you use, 
>you are hurting yourself. If you recommend that others do so as well, 
>you are hurting them.

     I do not.  I do suggest that it is not an appropriate document
for a newbie.

>I extend you the same offer I did to Roedy, Gene. I'd be glad to help 
>you with anything in the JLS you find obscure.
>
>What really puzzles me is Roedy's apparent anger at me for recommending 
>the JLS. What the F? Spend the freaking time reading and understanding it, 
>reaching for auxiliary sources (such as those by the JLS's own authors) for 
>the parts that puzzle you. Study it. I've been studying the various 
>incarnations for over a decade. There's no magic, despite how hard Roedy 
>tries to enmystify the process. It's just determination and diligence, and 
>I dare say a modicum of raw talent for programming that many who 
>frequent this forum can lay claim to.
>
>Don't be an advocate for laziness and ignorance.
>
>Know. Don't guess. Read the JLS.
>
>Excoriate anyone who tries to discourage you from doing so.

     I have not read the JLS, but as I noted in my post, I did read
much of the JavaScript standard.  There were parts of it that were
very lucid indeed.  I expect that the JLS has lucid portions, too.
However, there were parts of the JavaScript standard that were very
obtuse.  Were I interested in implementing a JavaScript processor,
they would probably be just about what I needed, but for app
programmer level, no, very unclear.  I expect that the same is true
for the JLS.

     Langauge standards and language documentation for programmers are
two different things with some overlap.  I would not wish the standard
for any language on a newbie to the language.  After he has the
basics, yes, it would be appropriate then.

Sincerely,

Gene Wirchenko

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Thread

Arrays in java "mmc.java" <michael.p.mulligan@gmail.com> - 2012-07-09 07:54 -0700
  Re: Arrays in java Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2012-07-09 11:30 -0400
    Re: Arrays in java Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-07-09 15:03 -0700
      Re: Arrays in java Daniel Pitts <newsgroup.nospam@virtualinfinity.net> - 2012-07-09 15:16 -0700
        Re: Arrays in java Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-07-09 16:14 -0700
          Re: Arrays in java Daniel Pitts <newsgroup.nospam@virtualinfinity.net> - 2012-07-09 21:43 -0700
            Re: Arrays in java Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2012-07-09 23:47 -0700
          Re: Arrays in java Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2012-07-11 15:32 -0700
            Re: Arrays in java Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-07-11 16:21 -0700
              Re: Arrays in java Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-07-11 17:08 -0700
                Re: Arrays in java Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-07-11 17:20 -0700
                Re: Arrays in java Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-07-11 22:09 -0700
                Re: Arrays in java Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-07-12 11:31 -0700
                Re: Arrays in java Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-07-13 09:07 -0700
                Re: Arrays in java Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-07-13 13:00 -0700
                Re: Arrays in java Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-07-15 00:54 -0500
                Re: Arrays in java Jeff Higgins <jeff@invalid.invalid> - 2012-07-16 15:59 -0400
                Re: Arrays in java Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-07-16 23:44 -0700
                Re: Arrays in java glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2012-07-17 08:01 +0000
                Re: Arrays in java Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-07-17 03:04 -0700
                Re: Arrays in java Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-07-17 13:02 -0700
                Re: Arrays in java Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-07-17 22:03 -0700
                Re: Arrays in java Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2012-07-17 22:10 -0700
                Re: Arrays in java glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2012-07-18 05:12 +0000
                Re: Arrays in java Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-07-17 22:39 -0700
                Re: Arrays in java Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2012-07-18 21:24 +0000
                Re: teaching Java and formal grammars Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-07-19 06:48 -0700
                Re: teaching Java and formal grammars Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2012-07-19 10:27 -0400
                Re: teaching Java and formal grammars Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-07-19 10:55 -0700
                Re: Arrays in java Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-07-13 08:28 -0500
            Re: Arrays in java Daniel Pitts <newsgroup.nospam@virtualinfinity.net> - 2012-07-11 18:33 -0700
  Re: Arrays in java markspace <-@.> - 2012-07-09 09:17 -0700
    Re: Arrays in java Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-07-09 12:56 -0700
  Re: Arrays in java Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2012-07-09 12:45 -0400
  Re: Arrays in java Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2012-07-09 11:03 -0700
  Re: Arrays in java Arun GOPI <arun041@gmail.com> - 2012-07-16 02:53 -0700

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