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Re: Future of C

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From Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org>
Newsgroups comp.lang.c
Subject Re: Future of C
Date Mon, 19 Mar 2018 14:48:24 -0700
Organization None to speak of
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supercat@casperkitty.com writes:
> On Saturday, March 17, 2018 at 12:50:10 PM UTC-5, Tim Rentsch wrote:
>> Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> writes:
>> 
>> >> [considering making a change re: the "one program rule"]
>> >
>> > [...] I don't believe it's either practical or necessary.  The
>> > "OPR loophole" is not a problem in practice.
>> 
>> Wholeheartedly agree.
>
> Is a program that uses 10-deep recursion "portable"?  How about one that
> uses 1000-deep recursion?  How about 1000000-deep recursion?

Any program can run into resource limits on a sufficiently small system.
There is no N for which we can reasonably say that a program that uses
N-deep recursion is portable while one that uses N+1-deep recursion is
not.

> Unless one unreasonably restricts the abilities of "portable" programs,
> small machines are going to be unable to run "portable" programs designed
> for larger ones.  Having a program which will either run usefully or fail
> in predictable fashion would seem rather more useful than simply saying
> that on any particular implementation a program might run usefully or might
> behave in totally arbitrary and unpredictable fashion.

So for the specific case of deep recursion, you want a program
that recurses more deeply than the system can handle to "fail in
predictable fashion", right?  Wouldn't that imply that all conforming
implementations must insert checking code for every construct that
grows the stack, with all the overhead that implies?

-- 
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) kst-u@mib.org  <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
Working, but not speaking, for JetHead Development, Inc.
"We must do something.  This is something.  Therefore, we must do this."
    -- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"

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Re: Future of C GOTHIER Nathan <nathan.gothier@gmail.com> - 2018-03-10 18:00 +0100
  Re: Future of C Real Troll <Real.Troll@Trolls.com> - 2018-03-10 17:25 -0400
    Re: Future of C GOTHIER Nathan <nathan.gothier@gmail.com> - 2018-03-11 00:03 +0100
      Re: Future of C David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2018-03-10 16:52 -0800
        Re: Future of C Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2018-03-10 23:41 -0600
          Re: Future of C GOTHIER Nathan <nathan.gothier@gmail.com> - 2018-03-11 16:15 +0100
            Re: Future of C David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2018-03-11 14:31 -0700
              Re: Future of C Spiros Bousbouras <spibou@gmail.com> - 2018-03-11 21:50 +0000
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-11 15:02 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2018-03-11 17:48 -0700
                Re: Future of C Wouter Verhelst <w@uter.be> - 2018-03-12 22:25 +0100
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-12 16:18 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-12 16:24 -0700
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-12 23:55 +0000
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-12 17:14 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-12 18:29 -0700
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-13 07:58 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-13 17:05 +0100
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-13 09:38 -0700
                Re: Future of C Melzzzzz <Melzzzzz@zzzzz.com> - 2018-03-13 21:51 +0000
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-13 15:06 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-14 12:22 +0100
                Re: Future of C Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2018-03-26 21:02 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-27 09:39 +0200
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-27 07:37 -0700
                Re: Future of C Steven Petruzzellis <frelwizzen@gmail.com> - 2018-03-28 11:19 -0700
                Re: Future of C Steven Petruzzellis <frelwizzen@gmail.com> - 2018-03-27 00:42 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-27 08:52 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-12 18:24 -0700
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-13 01:40 +0000
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-13 17:11 +0100
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-13 17:06 +0100
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-13 09:38 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-13 16:58 +0100
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-12 17:01 -0700
                Re: Future of C Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2018-03-13 12:25 +1300
                Re: Future of C Wouter Verhelst <w@uter.be> - 2018-03-13 10:19 +0100
                Re: Future of C jameskuyper@verizon.net - 2018-03-13 07:45 -0700
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-13 16:15 +0000
                Re: Future of C jameskuyper@verizon.net - 2018-03-13 10:20 -0700
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-13 17:45 +0000
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-13 11:51 -0700
                Re: Future of C Wouter Verhelst <w@uter.be> - 2018-03-13 21:12 +0100
                Re: Future of C Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2018-03-17 10:11 -0700
                Re: Future of C Steven Petruzzellis <frelwizzen@gmail.com> - 2018-03-18 05:21 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-13 17:16 +0100
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-13 18:05 +0000
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-13 21:28 +0100
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-13 13:39 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-13 21:57 +0100
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-13 14:26 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-14 12:23 +0100
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-13 21:22 +0000
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-14 13:02 +0100
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-14 08:48 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-14 17:02 +0100
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-14 17:09 +0000
                Re: Future of C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-03-14 10:18 -0700
                Re: Future of C Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2018-03-14 20:04 +0000
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-14 21:46 +0100
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-14 14:03 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-15 09:22 +0100
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-14 14:55 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-15 09:36 +0100
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-15 07:55 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-16 00:19 +0100
                Re: Future of C scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-03-15 13:53 +0000
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-14 11:37 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-14 12:12 -0700
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-14 13:04 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-14 13:37 -0700
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-14 14:16 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-14 15:27 -0700
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-14 15:50 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-14 17:09 -0700
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-14 20:18 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-15 10:25 -0700
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-15 11:27 -0700
                Re: Future of C scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-03-15 19:42 +0000
                Re: Future of C Steven Petruzzellis <frelwizzen@gmail.com> - 2018-03-15 22:03 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-15 12:54 -0700
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-15 14:31 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-15 15:27 -0700
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-15 15:47 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-15 16:05 -0700
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-16 08:19 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-16 10:23 -0700
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-16 17:21 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-16 18:37 -0700
                Re: Future of C Steven Petruzzellis <frelwizzen@gmail.com> - 2018-03-16 21:25 -0700
                Re: Future of C Wouter Verhelst <w@uter.be> - 2018-03-20 11:46 +0100
                Re: Future of C Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2018-03-17 10:50 -0700
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-19 14:00 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-19 14:48 -0700
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-19 15:21 -0700
                Re: Future of C "Chris M. Thomasson" <invalid_chris_thomasson@invalid.invalid> - 2018-03-19 21:47 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-15 11:12 +0100
                Re: Future of C Steven Petruzzellis <frelwizzen@gmail.com> - 2018-03-15 03:28 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-15 10:57 +0100
                Re: Future of C William Ahern <william@25thandClement.com> - 2018-03-15 04:06 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-15 13:35 +0100
                Re: Future of C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2018-03-15 05:47 -0700
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-15 08:25 -0700
                Re: Future of C scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-03-15 16:14 +0000
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-15 09:56 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-15 10:45 -0700
                Re: Future of C scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-03-15 18:15 +0000
                Re: Future of C Steven Petruzzellis <frelwizzen@gmail.com> - 2018-03-15 11:22 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-15 12:38 -0700
                Re: Future of C scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-03-15 20:46 +0000
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-15 15:14 -0700
                Re: Future of C William Ahern <william@25thandClement.com> - 2018-03-15 22:56 -0700
                Re: Future of C Steven Petruzzellis <frelwizzen@gmail.com> - 2018-03-16 00:39 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-19 11:35 +0100
                Re: Future of C Steven Petruzzellis <frelwizzen@gmail.com> - 2018-03-19 03:46 -0700
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-15 10:35 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-16 00:36 +0100
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-15 10:40 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-16 00:26 +0100
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-15 10:36 +0100
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-15 14:43 +0000
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-15 16:03 +0100
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-15 09:46 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-15 09:45 +0100
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-14 17:35 +0000
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-15 11:25 +0100
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-15 14:57 +0000
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-16 00:45 +0100
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-16 00:34 +0000
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-16 09:29 +0100
                Re: Future of C Steven Petruzzellis <frelwizzen@gmail.com> - 2018-03-16 01:42 -0700
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-16 11:40 +0000
                Re: Future of C Steven Petruzzellis <frelwizzen@gmail.com> - 2018-03-16 05:03 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-19 13:49 +0100
                Re: Future of C Steven Petruzzellis <frelwizzen@gmail.com> - 2018-03-19 06:55 -0700
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-19 14:37 +0000
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-19 22:23 +0100
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-19 13:28 -0700
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-19 23:39 +0100
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-19 23:47 +0000
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-20 00:59 +0100
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-20 00:20 +0000
                Re: Future of C Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2018-03-20 12:42 +0000
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-20 14:09 +0100
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-16 01:36 +0000
                Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-13 14:24 -0700
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-13 20:40 +0000
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-13 22:12 +0100
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-13 14:36 -0700
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-13 22:25 +0000
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-13 15:54 -0700
                Re: Future of C bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-03-14 01:01 +0000
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-14 13:30 +0100
                Re: Future of C Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2018-03-14 01:02 +0000
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-14 10:04 -0700
                Re: Future of C Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2018-03-14 18:32 +0000
                Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-14 13:22 +0100
                Re: Future of C Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-03-14 10:45 -0700
                Re: Future of C Wouter Verhelst <w@uter.be> - 2018-03-13 21:19 +0100
                Re: Future of C GOTHIER Nathan <nathan.gothier@gmail.com> - 2018-03-13 00:25 +0100
                Re: Future of C Wouter Verhelst <w@uter.be> - 2018-03-13 10:08 +0100
                Re: Future of C GOTHIER Nathan <nathan.gothier@gmail.com> - 2018-03-13 13:17 +0100
                Re: Future of C Melzzzzz <Melzzzzz@zzzzz.com> - 2018-03-13 15:55 +0000
                Re: Future of C Wouter Verhelst <w@uter.be> - 2018-03-13 21:20 +0100
          Re: Future of C supercat@casperkitty.com - 2018-03-11 14:55 -0700
      Re: Future of C Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2018-03-10 23:44 -0600
      Re: Future of C Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2018-03-11 06:17 +0000
        Re: Future of C jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2018-03-12 11:55 +0100
    Re: Future of C john.ladasky@gmail.com - 2018-03-11 03:34 -0700
      Re: Future of C Wouter Verhelst <w@uter.be> - 2018-03-12 22:47 +0100
        Re: Future of C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-03-13 17:25 +0100
          Re: Future of C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2018-03-13 09:40 -0700
    Re: Future of C jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2018-03-12 11:45 +0100
    Re: Future of C scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-03-12 16:01 +0000
      Re: Future of C jameskuyper@verizon.net - 2018-03-12 09:25 -0700
        Re: Future of C scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-03-12 17:31 +0000
          Re: Future of C jameskuyper@verizon.net - 2018-03-12 10:59 -0700
  Re: Future of C jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2018-03-12 11:44 +0100

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