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Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store?

From Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com>
Newsgroups comp.lang.c
Subject Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store?
Date 2020-09-02 09:19 -0700
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <865z8w882m.fsf@linuxsc.com> (permalink)
References (11 earlier) <4VhhmiNkewUzTX9GU@bongo-ra.co> <86ftbcp2yl.fsf@linuxsc.com> <5536866b-2ddf-4095-ad9d-4d2317bff0e9@googlegroups.com> <86sgemhsed.fsf@linuxsc.com> <c3faf1d3-3a40-45d8-a7fa-32e2c9cd2ac2o@googlegroups.com>

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James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> writes:

> On Tuesday, June 23, 2020 at 8:35:14 AM UTC-4, Tim Rentsch wrote:
>
>> James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> writes:
>>
>>> On Wednesday, June 3, 2020 at 11:46:21 AM UTC-4, Tim Rentsch wrote:
>>>
>>>> Spiros Bousbouras <spibou@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, 29 May 2020 21:23:00 -0700
>>>>> Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Spiros Bousbouras <spibou@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Tue, 26 May 2020 07:14:01 -0700
>>>>>>> Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I still think a bug report should be filed against gcc
>>>>>>>> itself.  If gcc is going to allow outside forces (meaning
>>>>>>>> ones completely outside its control) to alter its behavior
>>>>>>>> so it is no longer conforming, there should at least be an
>>>>>>>> option to prevent such alterations.
>>>
>>> As a user, you have that option:  install a version of gcc that
>>> was not so patched.
>>
>> Apparently I haven't made myself clear.  I see no reason to
>> suppose that gcc has been patched by anyone outside the gcc
>> developer group.  It seems more likely that they put in a
>> capability for enabling these transformations, triggered by a
>> setting in library header files.  The people who put together the
>> Ubuntu distribution simply enabled the setting in the library
>> headers;  they didn't any changes to gcc itself.
>
> On Tuesday, May 12, 2020 at 3:17:15 AM UTC-4, Philipp Klaus Krause wrote:
>
>> And indeed the problem is apparently in the gcc package for Ubuntu:
>> Their patch to the upstream Debian gcc package predefines
>> _FORTIFY_SOURCE to 2, which makes glibc non-compliant.
>
> Since he describes it as a patch to the gcc package, I feel
> comfortable describing it in the same fashion.

Exactly.  The gcc /package/ was changed, but the gcc /compiler/
was not changed.

>> ...  So gcc should
>> have a way of turning off that outside interference, since
>> they are the ones who enabled it in the first place.
>
> The only way I could see them doing that is to drop the currently
> optional and non-default support for _FORTIFY_SOURCE.

If you really think that then either you don't have much
imagination or you haven't been paying attention.  First the
non-conforming transformation is not unconditional, which means
it is under the compiler's control, even if _FORTIFY_SOURCE has
been predefined to be 2.  Second there was posted upthread a way
of circumventing the transformation using a -D option to gcc,
which again works even if _FORTIFY_SOURCE has been predefined to
be 2.  Clearly gcc could add an option -fno-fortify that would
accomplish exactly what I have suggested.

> Why should
> they do that, when they have users who actively want that feature?
> And even if they did, what's to prevent Ubuntu from reinstating
> that support, and continuing to have it default to 2, since they
> obviously want it to be 2?

A gcc option -fno-fortify has none of those problems.

> I reiterate that any defect report should be filed against Ubuntu,
> not gcc.

Then I think you are misunderstanding the problem I want addressed.
The problem is not Ubuntu arranging that _FORTIFY_SOURCE is
pre-defined to be 2.  The problem is that gcc doesn't provide an
easy and obvious way to disable the non-conforming transformation,
which after all they themselves enabled.  Simply adding an option
such as -fno-fortify would easily accomplish that, and the regular
gcc team is in an ideal position to do that.  The people who work
on Ubuntu are not.

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Thread

How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 13:30 +0200
  Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Manfred <noname@add.invalid> - 2020-05-11 13:55 +0200
    Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 14:01 +0200
      Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-05-11 09:08 -0400
        Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 15:19 +0200
        Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Manfred <noname@add.invalid> - 2020-05-11 18:32 +0200
        Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 18:59 +0200
          Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2020-05-11 17:42 +0000
            Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 20:30 +0200
            Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-05-12 00:29 -0400
              Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Manfred <noname@add.invalid> - 2020-05-12 14:41 +0200
              Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-05-12 16:19 +0200
  Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2020-05-11 13:03 +0100
    Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 14:07 +0200
  Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 15:20 +0200
    Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-05-11 16:31 +0200
    Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Barry Schwarz <schwarzb@delq.com> - 2020-05-11 10:06 -0700
  Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 15:58 +0200
    Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-05-11 10:24 -0400
    Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 16:52 +0200
      Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Manfred <noname@add.invalid> - 2020-05-11 18:55 +0200
    Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2020-05-11 15:51 +0000
      Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 19:01 +0200
        Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2020-05-11 17:33 +0000
          Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 20:57 +0200
            Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2020-05-11 19:17 +0000
              Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2020-05-11 19:41 +0000
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2020-05-11 20:01 +0000
            Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2020-05-11 19:19 +0000
    Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Florian Weimer <fw@deneb.enyo.de> - 2020-05-11 20:24 +0200
      Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 20:59 +0200
        Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2020-05-11 19:17 +0000
          Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 21:24 +0200
        Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Florian Weimer <fw@deneb.enyo.de> - 2020-05-11 22:30 +0200
  Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-05-11 16:44 +0200
    Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 16:54 +0200
      Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-05-11 16:57 +0200
        Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 17:07 +0200
          Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-05-11 17:08 +0200
          Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-05-11 11:25 -0400
      Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-05-11 09:06 -0700
        Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 19:05 +0200
          Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 19:19 +0200
            Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-05-23 07:51 -0700
              Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-23 20:27 +0200
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2020-05-23 14:25 -0700
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-05-26 07:09 -0700
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-05-26 07:14 -0700
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Spiros Bousbouras <spibou@gmail.com> - 2020-05-26 16:00 +0000
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-05-29 21:23 -0700
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Spiros Bousbouras <spibou@gmail.com> - 2020-05-30 20:08 +0000
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-06-03 08:46 -0700
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-06-03 10:18 -0700
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-06-23 05:35 -0700
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-06-26 06:32 -0700
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-09-02 09:19 -0700
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-09-02 19:50 -0700
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2020-06-04 20:34 +0000
        Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2020-05-11 17:39 +0000
          Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Autist <autist69@gmail.com> - 2020-05-11 19:42 +0200
          Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-11 20:28 +0200
            Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2020-05-11 18:37 +0000
              Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-05-11 11:50 -0700
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2020-05-12 20:02 +0100
                Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-05-12 13:12 -0700
          Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2020-05-11 19:56 +0000
          Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-05-24 16:49 -0700
      Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2020-05-11 14:19 -0700
        Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2020-05-11 14:22 -0700
          Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2020-05-12 09:17 +0200
        Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2020-05-24 16:12 +0000
          Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2020-05-24 15:10 -0700
          Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-05-24 22:58 -0400
  Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2020-05-11 20:07 +0000
  Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Andrey Tarasevich <andreytarasevich@hotmail.com> - 2020-06-25 21:42 -0700
    Re: How many wide characters may mbstowcs store? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-06-28 06:32 -0700

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