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Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists

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"Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> wrote:

>| Only if your client/employer has signed in blood that they have read
>| and understood this document
>| <http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/vstudio/ms788708.aspx?ppud=4>.
>|
>
>  In blood? You must have some rather oddball clients.

Is that expression not used in the United States?
>
>  That page basically says what I already explained: VB6 software
> is widely supported, from Win95 through Win8, but the VB6 IDE as
>a programming tool is no longer supported and won't be updated.
>So newer aspects like 64-bit software are not possible with VB6.
>

Agreed, and I think it is important to ensure that a client
understands that they are not getting programs written in Microsoft's,
or anybody else's, current preferred language. In your case they may
well decide that they are getting their preferred programmer and they
will leave the choice of language to you. That would be foolish if
they are giving the job to a novice programmer.

>   I've seen the argument put forth that Basic is poorly designed
>and sets bad habits for programmers. It's debated periodically on
>Slashdot. I still don't see exactly why that's the case. It's always
>seemed to me more of a matter of personal taste and pros/cons
>for a given job. The main point I see put forth is that VB allows
>one to be sloppy. Then again, so does the blade guard on a table
>saw. Surely the context of the job to be done has some bearing on
>how to choose a tool? Maybe C for drivers, B for database front-ends,
>and a blending in the spectrum in between?
>
>   Either way, I'm curious what you would suggest for a simple
>GUI program like that described.

I was faced with this choice and I chose Java plus the Netbeans IDE
that comes with a GUI designer that writes the Java GUI code for you.
After Microsoft abandoned VB Classic I was determined not to rely on
Microsoft again and I felt that IBM and/or Oracle would continue to
support Java.  I am an experienced programmer, including C, so Java
was not frightening and, if necessary, I can wade through the code
that Netbeans generates for a GUI.

I can't recommend this choice for a beginner and I don't know a
general purpose language that I would recommend to one.   

> .Net has gigantic dependencies
>and a questionable future. C++? That's an awfully lot of work, and
>GUIs are tedious at best. And even that may have a shaky future.
>Windows itself has a questionable future. One can use C++ to write
>to Metro, but why go to so much trouble when you can only access
>the WinRT wrapper sandbox? Since you're talking about a doomed
>future, presumably you're talking about Win9 in .... 2016? What if
>Win9 is Metro-only, and only MS software can run with the full API
>(as will be the case with WinARM)? Should people then just stick to
>javascript, on the assumption that it will be the lingua franca of a
>cloud-crazed future where accessing an OS API will be a thing of
>the past and the only widespread "programming" will be jazzed-up
>webpages? (Personally I don't like javascript, but it *is* popping
>up in an awfully lot of places.)
>
>  Auric_ mentioned the many other current Basic options. Do you
>consider all of them to be junk because of an inherent fault in
>the design of Basic-style languages?
>
>  I see no need to move from VB for many years to come, but if
>I were just starting now the choices would be far less clear.
>Windows programming is getting more restrictive. It's not clear
>how useful custom compiled software will be in the future. MacOS
>has always been restrictive. Linux will probably never be a suitable
>Desktop OS. I don't even own a cellphone and have no plans to
>buy one. Even if I did, having seen the shareware bubble come
>and go, I'm not anxious to jump on the "phone app" bandwagon.
>So for now I love VB and can do pretty much anything I need
>with it, but it would be hard to recommend it as a first choice
>to someone new.... except that I can't think of another first
>choice that would be unquestionably better, at least for general
>Windows "Desktop" software.
>
>   I don't know if I really have a point here. You just raised a
>couple of interesting issues; issues that are potentially transforming
>with the arrival of Metro and WinARM.

In your interesting coverage of the issues raised when choosing a
programming language you have omitted that of maintenance. I would
reject many languages including various flavours of BASIC because
there are not enough programmers familiar with the language. I would
also base my selection on a choice of development environments rather
than being dependant on a single IDE.

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VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Sandwich <liam.whan@gmail.com> - 2012-05-19 22:10 -0700
  Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mike Williams" <Mike@WhiskyAndCoke.com> - 2012-05-20 10:24 +0100
  Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-20 09:41 -0400
  Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Auric__" <not.my.real@email.address> - 2012-05-20 19:27 +0000
    Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Sandwich <liam.whan@gmail.com> - 2012-05-20 19:06 -0700
      Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-20 23:32 -0400
        Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Sandwich <liam.whan@gmail.com> - 2012-05-20 22:05 -0700
      Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Gordon Levi <gordon@address.invalid> - 2012-05-23 01:37 +1000
        Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-22 13:24 -0400
          Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-22 11:30 -0600
            Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-22 14:03 -0400
              Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-22 12:15 -0600
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-22 15:05 -0400
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-22 14:01 -0600
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-22 17:29 -0400
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-22 17:13 -0600
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-23 09:10 -0400
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-23 10:24 -0600
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-22 14:37 -0600
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-25 10:55 -0400
            Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-22 14:38 -0400
              Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-22 12:47 -0600
          Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Gordon Levi <gordon@address.invalid> - 2012-05-24 23:44 +1000
            Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-24 10:07 -0400
            Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mike Williams" <Mike@WhiskyAndCoke.com> - 2012-05-24 16:07 +0100
              Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-24 09:57 -0600
              Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Gordon Levi <gordon@address.invalid> - 2012-05-25 18:39 +1000
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mike Williams" <Mike@WhiskyAndCoke.com> - 2012-05-25 11:23 +0100
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Gordon Levi <gordon@address.invalid> - 2012-05-27 23:07 +1000
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mike Williams" <Mike@WhiskyAndCoke.com> - 2012-05-27 16:44 +0100
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists ralph <nt_consulting64@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-27 17:12 -0500
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mike Williams" <Mike@WhiskyAndCoke.com> - 2012-05-30 07:04 +0100
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists ralph <nt_consulting64@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-30 02:36 -0500
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mike Williams" <Mike@WhiskyAndCoke.com> - 2012-05-31 08:54 +0100
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists ralph <nt_consulting64@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-31 10:33 -0500
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Gordon Levi <gordon@address.invalid> - 2012-05-30 23:19 +1000
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists ralph <nt_consulting64@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-30 14:09 -0500
        Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists GS <gs@somewhere.net> - 2012-05-25 13:44 -0400
          Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists -mhd <not_real@invalid.com> - 2012-05-25 17:47 -0400
            Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists GS <gs@somewhere.net> - 2012-05-25 19:51 -0400
      Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-22 11:09 -0600
        Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mike Williams" <Mike@WhiskyAndCoke.com> - 2012-05-23 13:07 +0100
          Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-23 10:14 -0600
            Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Schmidt <sss@online.de> - 2012-05-24 20:38 +0200
              Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-24 15:46 -0600
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mike Williams" <Mike@WhiskyAndCoke.com> - 2012-05-25 06:52 +0100
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Schmidt <sss@online.de> - 2012-05-25 11:14 +0200
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "DaveO" <djo@dial.pipex.com> - 2012-05-25 10:57 +0100
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Schmidt <sss@online.de> - 2012-05-25 13:36 +0200
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-25 09:25 -0400
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-25 10:12 -0600
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-25 12:27 -0400
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-25 14:22 -0600
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Schmidt <sss@online.de> - 2012-05-26 18:38 +0200
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-26 14:12 -0600
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Henning" <computer_hero@coldmail.com> - 2012-05-26 23:31 +0200
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-26 18:07 -0400
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-26 16:50 -0600
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-26 20:53 -0400
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Tom Shelton <tom_shelton@comcast.invalid> - 2012-05-26 20:31 -0600
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-27 09:49 -0400
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists Karl E. Peterson <karl@exmvps.org> - 2012-05-29 12:50 -0700
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> - 2012-05-29 19:14 -0400
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists ralph <nt_consulting64@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-29 18:25 -0500
                Re: VB.net (2010) Beginner Question: Directory Lists "Mike Williams" <Mike@WhiskyAndCoke.com> - 2012-05-30 06:51 +0100

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