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Groups > talk.politics.misc > #1179880
| From | -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | talk.politics.misc, alt.fan.rush-limbaugh, alt.politics |
| Subject | Re: Trumpcession |
| Date | 2025-04-04 09:40 -0400 |
| Organization | A noiseless patient Spider |
| Message-ID | <vsongt$3bdd5$2@dont-email.me> (permalink) |
| References | (5 earlier) <avinuj53ambkqmmildb4uga4tmqaa7fhj5@4ax.com> <vsgqfk$36mma$1@dont-email.me> <vsi6lr$i94t$1@dont-email.me> <vsmqgt$1g92s$1@dont-email.me> <vsn7j7$1v84f$1@dont-email.me> |
Cross-posted to 3 groups.
On 4/3/25 20:02, pothead wrote: > On 2025-04-03, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote: >> On 4/1/25 22:16, pothead wrote: >>> On 2025-04-01, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote: >>>> On 4/1/25 07:21, NoBody wrote: >>>>> On Mon, 31 Mar 2025 12:16:53 -0000 (UTC), bks@panix.com (Bradley K. >>>>> Sherman) wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> | "We could see a recession" -- Maria Bartiromo >>>>>> >>>>>> | >>>>>> | Policy uncertainty and new sweeping tariffs from the Trump >>>>>> | administration are combining to create a stagflationary >>>>>> | outlook for the U.S. economy in the latest CNBC Rapid >>>>>> | Update. >>>>>> | ... >>>>>> <https://www.cnbc.com/2025/03/31/first-quarter-gdp-growth-will-be-just-0point3percent-as-tariffs-stoke-stagflation-conditions-says-cnbc-survey.html> >>>>>> >>>>>> | >>>>>> | Uncertainty around how and when Congress will enact tax >>>>>> | legislation, on top of Trump's ever-changing tariff >>>>>> | announcements, is dragging down expectations for >>>>>> | investment, surveys from across the country show. Many >>>>>> | firms are putting their investment plans, a key driver of >>>>>> | economic growth, on hold. That's one reason why economists >>>>>> | are dialing back growth forecasts for this year. >>>>>> | ... >>>>>> <https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-03-31/us-business-put-spending-plans-on-ice-with-tariffs-tax-cut-wait?srnd=homepage-americas> >>>>>> >>>>>> --bks >>>>> >>>>> Laughter. >>>>> >>>>> I warned you a year ago that Biden's inflation was going to cause a >>>>> recession. They don't happen over night. This is that particular >>>>> chicken coming home to roost. >>>>> >>>>> And you'll actually blame Trump for this. >>>>> >>>>> Sad. >>>> >>>> >>>> Well, Goldman Sachs is blaming Trump for it. Their latest report hit >>>> the news yesterday and they've put the recession risk update at 35%: >>>> >>>> <https://www.cnn.com/2025/03/31/business/recession-tariffs-goldman-sachs/index.html> Update: JP Morgan has raised the US recession risk to 60% <https://www.reuters.com/markets/jpmorgan-lifts-global-recession-odds-60-us-tariffs-stoke-fears-2025-04-04/> >>>> And for "But Blame Biden!" attempts, the problem with this claim is >>>> Goldman Sach's last report has changed since the election. Their last >>>> assessment prior to the election was in Oct 2024 and it said a 15% risk: >>>> >>>> Headline (8 Oct 24) >>>> <https://www.goldmansachs.com/insights/articles/the-probability-of-a-us-recession-in-the-next-year-has-fallen-to-15-percent> >>>> >>>> Full analysis (6 Oct 24): >>>> <https://www.gspublishing.com/content/research/en/reports/2024/10/07/8ba0c80f-a90e-49f9-8c38-1276047e7533.html> >>>> >>>> >>>> And now that 1Q is over so firms can go back to deviating from their >>>> index fund percentages, the DJIA has just opened with a 200 points drop. >>>> >>>> >>>> -hh >>> >>> Personally I don't trust any of the financial firms because they are wrong more >>> often than not. >> >> >> Their assessments have to be stochastic, not deterministic. As such, >> its not if they are/aren't "correct", but if they're *useful*. > > Big words. > I had to look them up :) > >> >>> The economy, while rooted in SOME basic tenants is also highly voodoo as well to >>> some degree. >> >> More variables and interactions than one can reasonably expect to gather >> sufficient data to model with. Plus a lot of these variables are >> "squishy" in that they're things like consumer sentiments. > > Back in the 80's when I was working on Wall Street I was in the computer > command center on black Monday 10/19/1987 of one of the largest brokerage firms on the planet. > > I was watching the SAD displays (System Activity Display) of the various mainframe computers > running the business and these were bar graphs that typically would go up and down. > They were pegged full on and the high level executives were concerned that the computers > would crash under the load. > > That was when I learned how trend analysis worked. > So basically at the time, considering the technology, the mainframes would figure out > for example, what stocks went up or down every time say GM stock went up or down. > > It was an eye opener for sure. Yes, there's a lot of M&S that's been in development for decades for investment houses to have a competitive edge over others. As I'd just posted a few minutes ago, a friend's DIY modeler is able to detect the trading logic of these large trading houses, and uses them to inform his own day trading momentum-based plans. I have an older copy of his model, but my hardware isn't beefy enough to run it. >>> Back in the late 70's into the 80's brokers were moonlighting driving taxi cabs >>> in NYC and the joke was well if you know so much about where the market is headed >>> why aren't YOU rich? >>> >>> I'm mixed on Trump's tariffs TBH. >> >> I see them as a train wreck, which the Market today is also voting with >> their dollars manifested as a stampede for the door: DJIA closed -1679 >> (-4%) SP500 -274 (-4.8%) NASDAQ -1050 (-6%). > > > I think it's going to take some time to sink in and stabilize. Well, Asia was down -3% today, and Europe is -3% to -4% at present. US futures started tanking at ~4am; a bit more stable at this hour, but still looks like another big down day again, roughly comparable to yesterday (DJIA -1400; SP500 -140; NASDAQ -700): > The markets sure are tanking, but why? Because the tariffs are a sudden and highly disruptive shock to long term corporate plans & operations. > The USA has been getting screwed on tariffs for years so it's about time > we level the playing field. Or the US hasn't really been getting 'screwed' on tariffs in the fashion that we're being told. For example, if this is about trying to restore manufacturing jobs for the middle class, that's a deluded belief mired in the 1970s/80s because its too late: those jobs have already been ~90% eliminated by automation worldwide. > Is Trump's methodology the correct way, I'm not so sure. The methodology is from the Mafia protection racket 'shakedown' book. That's good for the bosses, but not the working class, nor country. >>> However I am 1000000% in favor of bringing jobs, especially manufacturing jobs, >>> back stateside. >> >> Agreed ... to a degree. There's pros/cons to any policy, so the broader >> question is what are these pros/cons and where have the current policies >> been delinquent. Because part of that these trades is that one only has >> a finite labor pool to allocate, so is it better to have, say, 20% >> working in low value-added & fungible goods vs alternatives, such as in >> better paying Service industry jobs. > > It's all about profit and satisfying the stockholders and far less about > control and not allowing the US to become vulnerable and dependent upon > other countries for our goods. Its a trade-off, as increased trade & economic ties between sovereigns makes military conflicts vastly less likely to occur between them. > I am anti corporation and especially those linked tightly to overseas > manufacturing. > I will gladly pay an extra $100 for a TV made in the USA. > I think most people feel the same. Most people do say & believe that, but when it comes to actually doing that...most do not: "A Reuters/Ipsos poll released on [July 2017] found 70 percent of Americans think it is “very important” or “somewhat important” to buy U.S.-made products. Despite that sentiment, 37 percent said they would refuse to pay more for U.S.-made goods versus imports. Twenty six percent said they would only pay up to 5 percent more to buy American, and 21 percent capped the premium at 10 percent." <https://www.reuters.com/article/business/americans-want-us-goods-but-not-willing-to-pay-more-reutersipsos-poll-idUSKBN1A3210/> > We have lost control and that is extremely dangerous. Decades without a major world conflict that kills millions. >>> As for tariffs themselves, I would like to see fair trade. >> >> The problem is what is an effective definition for what is "fair"? >> Because it can't be merely this formula based on trade balance, where >> Trump is imposing tariffs on literally uninhabited islands (and also on >> our own military base on Diego Garcia!), which only shows up because its >> shown as the 'origin' for some lobsters caught there. > > Fair is no tariff at all. > As for islands, these are sweeping regulations. > Look up what tariffs other countries impose upon US goods. FYI, do be aware that a lot of the 'tariff' numbers that Trump released yesterday are flat-out wrong. > All Trump is saying is we need fair trade. > Some countries are already asking for negations. > Others are still fighting back. > Time will tell. There's also been analysis which identified what formula was used - - its not based on tariffs at all, but trade imbalance. Needless to day, a country that's 1/10th the size of the USA can't import as much goods for their local economy as they can sell to us, so there's structurally fundamental imbalances that no tariff can ever fix. Likewise, its been determined that the work was done by a LLM AI, and not checked well by a human: that's why there were so many weird locations named -- it wasn't by actual sovereign nation, but by Internet country code top-level domains (ccTLD). For example, the tariff on the US Military Base at Diego Garcia is domain ".io", and the penguins at the uninhabited Heard and McDonald Islands is ".hm" >>> I doubt China will ever agree, but I'm sure we can work something >>> out with other countries. >>> Why should the US be screwed all the time? >>> Level set the playing field is all I would like to see. >> >> My personal thoughts on it is that the manufacture of physical goods >> should have had (for decades) a baseline that's pollution-based: make >> goods in an environmentally dirty fashion is cheaper, so that becomes >> the basis of a 'tariff'-esque handicap. However, this is limited to >> just physical goods, not services. > > Personally I disagree. > As long as reasonable guidelines are set, I don't give a hoot about > green, over regulation that slows the process and costs the consumer. > > So yea, a factory shouldn't be allowed to pollute a river by dumping > toxic chemicals from manufacturing into it. > But at the same time, the type of windows, heating system, etc should not > be over regulated. I mentioned this approach because things like environmental regulations are an example of where we can honestly say that domestic industries have been handicapped, which raises our domestic products' costs. To that end, we would not be forcing other nations to "clean up", but simply assigning a trade-based externality expense to their policies which are easy to objectively measure and be able uphold in places like the WTO. >>> Will Trump's tariffs upset the economy? >>> Maybe. >> >> Market today showed that they're betting that it will be a huge upset. > > Just a point in time. > The market goes up and it goes down. > Time will tell. Indeed it will. Who within your family needs to still work, and thus will be adversely affected by a recession later this year? >>> But what is the alternative? >>> We simply cannot go on as things are. >> >> So long as revenues received from services exported still exceed >> revenues out from material goods imported ... why can't it? After all, >> that is still a next inflow of cash. > > We can increase those revenues by not being the world's piggy bank. There's tremendous power by being the world's piggy bank. > Why can other nations impose huge tariffs on the US but we can't do the same? Again, look at the real tariff data, not Trump's bogus numbers from yesterday. For example, what's the tariff being imposed on the USA from the Heard and McDonald Islands? > For example, India has a 100% tariff on US agricultural goods. Says who? Because this cite says its 17% overall, with Agricultural goods at 39%.: <https://www.india-briefing.com/news/us-imposes-26-tariff-on-india-36763.html/> Someone's lying. > Why is the left so opposed to fair trade? > That is really the question here. Someone's lying. > Similar question for why is the left so opposed to eliminating government > waste? Someone's lying. The pushback has been because DOGE/MAGA has been claiming that there's huuuuuuuuuge amounts of waste/fraud/abuse, but they've still not found anything significant, or which wasn't Congressionally authorized: One can dispute that you don't *like* a particular spending program, but the Agencies all have to work within the budgets and directives therein that Congress orders them to do. As such, if you don't like there being an HIV control program in Gaza, Mozambique - tell Congress to stop funding the Agency that was assigned to carry out that policy task. >>> What do you propose? >> >> Well, it starts with not using tariff exemptions as a means of >> blackmail/extortion. > > It's simply a tool to negotiate fair trade. I disagree. We can watch where the likely negotiations go -- and the key thing to watch for is a "follow the money", with emphasis on who gets the money. If it isn't the US public, you're being ripped off. For example: "Vietnam...moved to approve Starlink services, as the country tries to avoid being hit with US tariffs because of its large bilateral trade surplus." <https://www.cnn.com/2025/03/26/business/vietnam-approves-starlink-us-tariffs-intl-hnk/index.html> >> It is also integral to our overall fiscal policies in how the government >> should/shouldn't generate its operating revenue, specifically on the >> question of how the policies are assessed to determine if they're >> progressive vs regressive. Note that this isn't a question of if the >> government is "too big"/"spending too much": anyone trying to claim >> that is attempting to make a diversion to avoid its key policy point. > > > You are way deep in the weeds. > This is simple. > You inflict tariffs on US goods, we will do the same to you. > And why shouldn't we? Because they're lying about what the tariff rates really are, for a start. Because they're being deliberately disruptive to commerce, which benefits our enemies (like Russia) more than it helps ourselves. Because they're out for personal gain, not to benefit the USA. Because tariffs of this magnitude have catastrophically failed both times we've tried it before, plunging us into deeper recessions/depressions. Are you ready for 15+ years of a bad economy? Because the propaganda is "Short term pain for long term gain", but they've failed to provide the business case with ROI details for how much short term pain and what the probability is for long term gain (how much, and how far distant in the future): since they can't quantify this, it really means that they have a very poor business case. Because we also know that tariffs are a regressive tax policy which hurts the lower/middle class with lesser impact on the top 5%. And so on. -hh
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Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-03-27 03:03 +0000
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-03-31 12:16 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Mitchell Holman <noemail@aol.com> - 2025-03-31 13:32 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter <none@none.com> - 2025-03-31 08:42 -0600
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-13 20:00 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-13 18:07 -0600
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-14 01:50 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-01 00:27 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-01 07:21 -0400
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-01 09:42 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-01 15:38 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter <none@none.com> - 2025-04-01 15:57 -0600
Re: Trumpcession pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> - 2025-04-02 02:16 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2025-04-02 00:17 -0700
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-02 07:05 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Lee <cleetius@gmail.corn> - 2025-04-02 14:46 -0700
Re: Trumpcession pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> - 2025-04-02 23:03 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Mitchell Holman <noemail@aol.com> - 2025-04-03 01:48 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-03 01:57 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-03 01:53 -0400
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-03 16:19 -0400
Re: Trumpcession pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> - 2025-04-04 00:02 +0000
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-04 09:40 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-04 22:23 +0000
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-05 13:50 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-05 20:45 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-06 08:57 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-06 13:14 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-06 11:55 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-06 23:06 +0000
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-07 00:28 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-07 22:13 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-08 22:23 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-09 23:46 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-07 09:24 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-07 13:48 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-07 22:14 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-07 22:16 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-08 09:08 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2025-04-07 07:07 -0700
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-07 17:53 +0000
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-07 19:46 +0000
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-08 09:09 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-08 21:51 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Blue Lives Matter <Iron_White@Systemic_Patrriotism.org> - 2025-04-08 19:46 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2025-04-08 18:25 -0700
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-09 12:36 +0000
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-09 09:39 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-09 13:50 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-10 00:01 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-10 11:41 -0400
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-10 15:10 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-10 13:29 -0600
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-10 19:35 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-10 17:53 -0600
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-11 06:56 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-11 05:59 -0600
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-11 08:09 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-11 06:55 -0600
Re: Trumpcession Blue Lives Matter <Iron_White@Systemic_Patrriotism.org> - 2025-04-11 10:22 -0400
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-11 12:59 -0400
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-11 14:55 -0400
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-11 20:29 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-11 19:33 -0600
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-12 08:56 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-12 07:21 -0600
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-12 09:51 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-12 08:05 -0600
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-12 14:20 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Michael A Terrell <mike.am.surreal@earthlink.nut> - 2025-04-12 11:31 -0700
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-12 14:56 -0600
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-12 21:07 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-13 14:48 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Blue Lives Matter <Iron_White@Systemic_Patrriotism.org> - 2025-04-13 11:15 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2025-04-13 09:25 -0700
Re: Trumpcession Blue Lives Matter <Iron_White@Systemic_Patrriotism.org> - 2025-04-13 12:39 -0400
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-13 13:55 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Blue Lives Matter <Iron_White@Systemic_Patrriotism.org> - 2025-04-13 14:43 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Dave Wainwright <Ken@invalid.com> - 2025-04-13 11:58 -0700
Re: Trumpcession Blue Lives Matter <Iron_White@Systemic_Patrriotism.org> - 2025-04-13 15:44 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Dave Wainwright <Ken@invalid.com> - 2025-04-13 14:05 -0700
Re: Trumpcession Blue Lives Matter <Iron_White@Systemic_Patrriotism.org> - 2025-04-13 17:14 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Dave Wainwright <Ken@invalid.com> - 2025-04-13 15:37 -0700
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-13 17:58 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Dave Wainwright <Ken@invalid.com> - 2025-04-13 15:36 -0700
Re: Trumpcession Blue Lives Matter <Iron_White@Systemic_Patrriotism.org> - 2025-04-14 02:52 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-14 13:10 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-14 12:36 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-14 22:41 +0000
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-14 20:21 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Lou Bricano <lb@cap.con> - 2025-04-14 17:51 -0700
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-17 18:14 -0500
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-20 12:41 +0000
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-21 06:59 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-22 06:56 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2025-04-22 07:55 -0700
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-22 20:43 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-23 15:19 -0400
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-22 07:11 -0500
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-22 20:50 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2025-04-23 07:06 -0400
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-23 09:24 -0500
Re: Trumpcession AlleyCat <al@aohello.con> - 2025-04-23 10:18 -0700
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-23 21:01 -0500
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-24 06:50 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2025-04-24 06:31 -0700
Re: Trumpcession J Carlson <j_carlson@gmx.com> - 2025-04-23 08:29 -0700
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-15 00:29 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-15 00:26 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-15 07:05 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-15 07:04 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2025-04-15 04:18 -0700
Re: Trumpcession Mitchell Holman <noemail@aol.com> - 2025-04-13 18:16 +0000
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-13 14:57 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Mitchell Holman <noemail@aol.com> - 2025-04-13 18:14 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-14 02:19 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Michael A Terrell <mike.am.surreal@earthlink.nut> - 2025-04-13 11:13 -0700
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-13 13:41 -0600
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-15 17:24 +0000
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-20 12:46 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2025-04-20 10:28 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-20 22:01 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-20 20:20 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-21 07:01 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-20 20:16 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-21 07:00 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-22 03:10 +0000
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-22 06:55 -0400
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-22 07:17 -0500
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-22 21:26 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2025-04-23 07:09 -0400
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-23 09:29 -0500
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-23 09:35 -0500
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-23 15:22 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Gary Roselles <Yeowrghis@Jurgis.net> - 2025-04-22 09:37 -0700
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-23 07:07 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-24 12:17 +0000
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-29 20:43 +0000
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-30 12:41 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Creon <creon@creon.earth> - 2025-04-30 15:28 +0000
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-05-01 11:37 +0000
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-05-01 13:06 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Mitchell Holman <noemail@aol.com> - 2025-05-01 13:28 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-05-01 11:02 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Creon <creon@creon.earth> - 2025-05-01 15:57 +0000
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-05-05 14:29 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Mitchell Holman <noemail@aol.com> - 2025-05-05 17:58 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-05-05 12:00 -0600
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-05-05 22:15 +0000
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-05-07 13:10 +0000
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-05-13 12:46 +0000
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-05-15 07:19 -0400
Re: Trumpcession c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-05-16 19:22 -0400
Re: Trumpcession "b20e327l39p7315he9845gor@rog5489eh5137p93l723302b.org.invalid" <leck-mich.am@arsch.invalid> - 2025-05-17 09:25 +1000
Re: Trumpcession c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-05-17 23:14 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-05-18 22:55 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Gronk <invalide@invalid.invalid> - 2025-05-25 00:27 -0600
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-05-26 17:55 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-05-28 14:49 +0000
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-06-02 13:04 +0000
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-06-03 07:18 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-06-03 11:32 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2025-06-03 12:26 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-06-04 07:16 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-06-04 07:16 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-06-04 13:07 +0000
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-06-05 07:03 -0400
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-06-04 13:42 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Fred J McCall <fjmc_call@gmail.com> - 2025-06-04 11:25 -0700
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-06-04 21:17 +0000
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-06-05 07:05 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-06-06 07:20 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2025-04-22 07:08 -0400
Re: Trumpcession bks@panix.com (Bradley K. Sherman) - 2025-04-22 12:42 +0000
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-22 21:32 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-22 21:09 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-22 06:57 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-12 14:55 -0600
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-12 09:14 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-12 10:14 -0400
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-12 14:17 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-12 14:54 -0600
Re: Trumpcession Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2025-04-11 17:52 -0700
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-12 10:08 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-11 15:42 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-09 09:38 -0400
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-09 13:47 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-09 12:00 -0600
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-09 14:27 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-09 12:32 -0600
Re: Trumpcession -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> - 2025-04-09 15:24 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Skeeter OG <invalid@none.com> - 2025-04-09 15:41 -0600
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-10 00:17 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2025-04-09 21:50 -0700
Re: Trumpcession Blue Lives Matter <Iron_White@Systemic_Patrriotism.org> - 2025-04-09 16:25 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Duane D La Motte <another.wieber.loser@arent.they.all> - 2025-04-09 14:52 -0700
Re: Trumpcession Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2025-04-09 18:29 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2025-04-09 18:16 -0700
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-10 00:14 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-09 09:37 -0400
Re: Trumpcession NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> - 2025-04-10 11:42 -0400
Re: Trumpcession Governor Swill <governor.swill@gmail.com> - 2025-04-04 01:41 -0400
csiph-web