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Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet

From Dr. Joachim Neudert <neudert@5sl.org>
Newsgroups ger.ct
Subject Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet
Date 2025-03-29 10:27 +0000
Message-ID <vs8hu7$h21q$1@solani.org> (permalink)
References (11 earlier) <vs67mg$g2se$1@solani.org> <if8jblxaef.ln2@diedrich.ddnssec.de> <m4og94Ft1vnU1@mid.individual.net> <9t67e7a9c6i359e31n3e8%sfroehli@Froehlich.Priv.at> <m4pq0tF4l7qU1@mid.individual.net>

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Michael Bode <m.g.bode@web.de> wrote:
> Stefan+Usenet@Froehlich.Priv.at (Stefan Froehlich) writes:
> 
>> On Fri, 28 Mar 2025 21:48:35 Michael Bode wrote:
>>> Fest steht, dass höchstrichterlich festgestellt wurde, dass wir
>>> weiter für die Ossis blechen dürfen. Womit das wohl zum
>>> schlechtesten Immobiliendeal aller Zeiten wurde. Wenn Putin den
>>> Haufen zurück haben möchte, meinetwegen kann er ihn mit
>>> Schleifchen drum haben.
>> 
>> Ich kann das - als Leser dieser Gruppe - emotional durchaus
>> nachvollziehen. Aber andererseits, ist es nicht immer noch besser,
>> eine kleine Pufferzone zu haben, die man ggf. sogar noch als
>> Verhandlungsmasse einsetzen kann? Die Ukraine hängt am Donbas, ihr
>> hättet es da einfacher.
> 
> Kann schon sein. Trump sucht doch einen 51. Bundesstaat. Wir hätten 5 im
> Angebot. Kann er zum Paketpreis bekommen, sagen wir 1 Cybertruck für
> alles zusammen.
> 

Putins Segen hat Trump jedenfalls für die Grönland-Annexion:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/mar/28/putins-endorsement-of-trumps-greenland-takeover-reflects-their-vision-of-a-new-world-order

Eventuell erwartet er im Gegenzug auch etwas Verständnis für russische und
chinesische Erweiterungs-Ambitionen.

Man ist sich einig, wie es aussieht.


Speaking at an Arctic policy forum in the northern Russian city of Murmansk
on Thursday, Putin presented a more comprehensive case than any US official
yet for Donald Trump’s plan to annex Greenland, crafting a historical
argument that sounded suspiciously convenient in terms of Russia’s own
territorial designs on Ukraine.

The US’s plans to take control of Greenland “may surprise someone only at
first glance, and it is a deep mistake to believe that this is some kind of
extravagant talk by the new American administration,” Putin began. “Nothing
of the sort.”

The US had plans to buy Greenland in the 1960s but Congress would not
support the deal, Putin said. It “protected the territory from Nazi
occupation” in the 1940s and made an offer to buy the island that was
rebuffed. Even going back to 1910, the US had designs on Greenland, the
Russian leader noted, calling the US plans “serious” with “longstanding
historical roots”.

Then Putin moved on to Alaska, which was sold by the Russian empire to the
US in 1867 in what has become a national case of seller’s remorse. “Let me
remind you that by 1868, the purchase of Alaska was ridiculed in American
newspapers,” Putin continued. Now, he said, the purchase under president
Andrew Johnson had been vindicated.

In short, Putin concluded, get over it. Big countries have territorial
ambitions. Deals for land and annexations are not just historical relics –
they are a modern reality. And, rejecting generations of international
norms not to take territory by force or through extortion, it is none of
our business what they do over there.

“As for Greenland, this is an issue that concerns two specific states and
has nothing to do with us,” Putin said, while adding that Russia would
continue to defend its interests in the Arctic from “dangerous” powers such
as Finland and Sweden.

It does not take a Kremlinologist to understand why Putin has come out in
support of Trump’s annexation plan. As US power recedes in Europe, the
Kremlin is seizing its chance to establish its long-awaited “multipolar
world” in which it holds dominion over a sphere of influence, particularly
in Ukraine and Belarus. Putin has railed against US hegemony since his
Munich speech of 2007, and he finally has a US president who is just as
derisive of the postwar order as he is.

Putin’s mantra that countries should mind their own business dovetails
closely with Trump’s transactional view of the world, as well as his deep
suspicion of transnational organisations and alliances set up after the
second world war.

Those range from the United Nations, to the international criminal court,
to even foreign economic blocs such as the EU, which he said was “formed in
order to screw the United States”.

“The postwar global order is not just obsolete, it is now a weapon being
used against us,” said Marco Rubio during his Senate confirmation hearing
in January. He is among the more moderate members of Trump’s cabinet. Those
toward the more extreme, including Vance, have elevated “restrainers”
seeking to accelerate the US withdrawal from Europe or even openly
antagonise the US’s erstwhile allies.

But as US power recedes abroad, the White House has declared ambitions
throughout the western hemisphere in a turn that some commentators have
compared to the Monroe doctrine of 1823, under which the US proclaimed
itself the protector of the hemisphere. And with each soundbite declaring
that the US should take back the Panama canal or that Canada should become
the 51st state, Trump will find an enthusiastic ally in the Kremlin who
will see his jaded vision of a new world order reflected in another.



-- 
please forgive my iPhone typos

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Der Niedergang des Usenet Lars Gebauer <lgebauer@live.de> - 2025-03-24 20:49 +0100
  Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Dr. Joachim Neudert <neudert@5sl.org> - 2025-03-24 20:26 +0000
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  Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Andreas Bockelmann <xotzil@gmx.de> - 2025-03-25 09:36 +0100
    Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2025-03-25 17:26 +0100
      Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Lars Gebauer <lgebauer@live.de> - 2025-03-25 18:14 +0100
        Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Dr. Joachim Neudert <neudert@5sl.org> - 2025-03-25 17:25 +0000
        Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Juergen Nieveler <usenet@nieveler.org> - 2025-03-26 15:59 +0000
          Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Lars Gebauer <lgebauer@live.de> - 2025-03-26 17:27 +0100
      Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Ulf Kutzner <user2991@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2025-03-26 14:58 +0000
        Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Lars Gebauer <lgebauer@live.de> - 2025-03-26 17:10 +0100
          Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Ulf Kutzner <user2991@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2025-03-27 07:43 +0000
            Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Lars Gebauer <lgebauer@live.de> - 2025-03-27 09:09 +0100
            Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2025-03-27 09:10 +0100
              Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Lars Gebauer <lgebauer@live.de> - 2025-03-27 10:17 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2025-03-27 10:24 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Ulf Kutzner <user2991@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2025-03-27 09:46 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2025-03-27 10:51 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2025-03-27 10:53 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Peter McD <peter.posts@gmx.net> - 2025-03-27 11:30 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Lars Gebauer <lgebauer@live.de> - 2025-03-27 14:44 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Peter Veith <veith@snafu.de> - 2025-03-27 16:18 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Fidel Sebastián Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse_Lara@b.maus.de> - 2025-03-27 19:23 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Stefan+Usenet@Froehlich.Priv.at (Stefan Froehlich) - 2025-03-27 13:07 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Dietz Proepper <dietz.usenet@rotfl.franken.de> - 2025-03-27 19:56 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Stefan+Usenet@Froehlich.Priv.at (Stefan Froehlich) - 2025-03-27 19:59 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Walter Brill <WalterBrill@t-online.de> - 2025-03-28 13:53 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Dr. Joachim Neudert <neudert@5sl.org> - 2025-03-28 13:20 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Diedrich Ehlerding <diedrich.ehlerding@t-online.de> - 2025-03-28 20:04 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Michael Bode <m.g.bode@web.de> - 2025-03-28 21:48 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Ulf Kutzner <user2991@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2025-03-29 07:27 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Stefan+Usenet@Froehlich.Priv.at (Stefan Froehlich) - 2025-03-29 08:06 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Michael Bode <m.g.bode@web.de> - 2025-03-29 09:41 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Ulf Kutzner <user2991@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2025-03-29 08:48 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Dr. Joachim Neudert <neudert@5sl.org> - 2025-03-29 10:27 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Peter Veith <veith@snafu.de> - 2025-03-29 12:27 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Hermann Riemann <nospam.ng@hermann-riemann.de> - 2025-03-29 14:11 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Peter Veith <veith@snafu.de> - 2025-03-30 11:07 +0200
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Fidel Sebastián Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse_Lara@b.maus.de> - 2025-03-29 12:57 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Hermann Riemann <nospam.ng@hermann-riemann.de> - 2025-03-29 14:17 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Martin Ebert <mx300@gmx.net> - 2025-03-29 23:00 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Stefan+Usenet@Froehlich.Priv.at (Stefan Froehlich) - 2025-03-30 09:59 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Peter Veith <veith@snafu.de> - 2025-03-29 09:11 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Andreas Bockelmann <xotzil@gmx.de> - 2025-03-29 20:10 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Martin Ebert <mx300@gmx.net> - 2025-03-29 22:58 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Dietz Proepper <dietz.usenet@rotfl.franken.de> - 2025-03-29 23:00 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Wolfgang  Εnzinger <we_usenet@nurfuerspam.de> - 2025-03-30 01:28 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Gunter Kühne <kuehne-g@freenet.de> - 2025-03-30 09:58 +0200
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Hermann Riemann <nospam.ng@hermann-riemann.de> - 2025-03-31 10:23 +0200
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Michael Bode <m.g.bode@web.de> - 2025-03-30 00:20 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Martin Ebert <mx300@gmx.net> - 2025-03-30 01:19 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Michael Bode <m.g.bode@web.de> - 2025-03-30 09:59 +0200
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Dr. Joachim Neudert <neudert@5sl.org> - 2025-03-28 21:22 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Lars Gebauer <lgebauer@live.de> - 2025-03-27 10:55 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Michael Bode <m.g.bode@web.de> - 2025-03-27 12:29 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Ulf Kutzner <user2991@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2025-03-27 11:35 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Fidel Sebastián Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse_Lara@b.maus.de> - 2025-03-27 19:04 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Goetz Schultz <ng.expire1225@goetz.co.uk> - 2025-03-27 18:14 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2025-03-27 19:45 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Goetz Schultz <ng.expire1225@goetz.co.uk> - 2025-03-27 21:34 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Fidel Sebastián Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse_Lara@b.maus.de> - 2025-03-28 07:56 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2025-03-28 08:34 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Fidel Sebastián Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse_Lara@b.maus.de> - 2025-03-28 10:54 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Goetz Schultz <ng.expire1225@goetz.co.uk> - 2025-03-28 09:20 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Fidel Sebastián Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse_Lara@b.maus.de> - 2025-03-28 11:05 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Fidel Sebastián Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse_Lara@b.maus.de> - 2025-03-27 19:49 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Goetz Schultz <ng.expire1225@goetz.co.uk> - 2025-03-27 21:28 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Fidel Sebastián Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse_Lara@b.maus.de> - 2025-03-28 07:56 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Goetz Schultz <ng.expire1225@goetz.co.uk> - 2025-03-28 09:21 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Ulf Kutzner <user2991@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2025-03-28 08:04 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Andreas Bockelmann <xotzil@gmx.de> - 2025-03-29 20:19 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Fidel Sebastián Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse_Lara@b.maus.de> - 2025-03-29 22:02 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Fidel Sebastián Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse_Lara@b.maus.de> - 2025-03-29 22:22 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Dietz Proepper <dietz.usenet@rotfl.franken.de> - 2025-03-28 10:15 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Goetz Schultz <ng.expire1225@goetz.co.uk> - 2025-03-28 09:26 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Dietz Proepper <dietz.usenet@rotfl.franken.de> - 2025-03-28 10:33 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Ulf Kutzner <user2991@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2025-03-28 09:41 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Goetz Schultz <ng.expire1225@goetz.co.uk> - 2025-03-28 09:46 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Fidel Sebastián Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse_Lara@b.maus.de> - 2025-03-28 11:19 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Andreas Bockelmann <xotzil@gmx.de> - 2025-03-29 20:25 +0100
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Goetz Schultz <ng.expire1225@goetz.co.uk> - 2025-03-29 20:58 +0000
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Andreas Bockelmann <xotzil@gmx.de> - 2025-03-30 14:40 +0200
                Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Dr. Joachim Neudert <neudert@5sl.org> - 2025-03-30 14:07 +0000
              Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Hermann Riemann <nospam.ng@hermann-riemann.de> - 2025-03-27 10:55 +0100
      Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Walter Brill <WalterBrill@t-online.de> - 2025-03-27 13:50 +0100
      Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Andreas Bockelmann <xotzil@gmx.de> - 2025-03-29 20:02 +0100
  Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet "F. W." <me@home.invalid> - 2025-04-02 16:10 +0200
    Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Dr. Joachim Neudert <neudert@5sl.org> - 2025-04-02 14:14 +0000
      Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet Ruediger Lahl <ruediger.lahl@gmx.de> - 2025-04-02 16:27 +0200
      Re: Der Niedergang des Usenet "F. W." <me@home.invalid> - 2025-04-03 14:12 +0200

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