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Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number"

From Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid>
Newsgroups comp.mobile.android, uk.telecom.mobile
Subject Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number"
Date 2025-03-17 18:44 +0000
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <vr9qiq$nfdi$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References (14 earlier) <vr6src$23f7c$1@dont-email.me> <duh*2rC9z@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk> <vr8nul$3mi0m$1@dont-email.me> <vr99gp$8osv$1@dont-email.me> <vr9d22$3mi0m$3@dont-email.me>

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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On 2025-03-17 14:53, Nick Finnigan wrote:
> On 17/03/2025 13:53, Java Jive wrote:
>> On 2025-03-17 08:53, Nick Finnigan wrote:
>>> On 16/03/2025 18:00, Theo wrote:
>>>> In uk.telecom.mobile Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> No, how would he have known the answers to the security questions to
>>>>> enable the SIM swap, and his emails were from Virgin Media, while the
>>>>> SIM was from O2.  Although not initially, my reading of the original
>>>>> article is now unambiguously that the email hack preceded the SIM swap
>>>>> and provided the initial personal information necessary to accomplish
>>>>> everything that followed.
>>>>
>>>> Virgin Media O2 are one company - VM and O2 merged June 2021.  I 
>>>> don't know
>>>> whether they have merged customer accounts such that the same security
>>>> details are used for both.  In which case it may be that one set of 
>>>> details
>>>> gives access to both mobile and emails.
>>>
>>> "If you've linked your Virgin Media and O2 details to create a new 
>>> Virgin Media O2 ID, sign in with it here."
>>>
>>> https://accounts.o2.co.uk/signin
>>
>> But Theo's own transcription of events from the BBC Radio documentary 
>> makes clear that he had not done so (first and last entries from this 
>> excerpt):
> 
>   That does not make it clear to me (he would still have an O2 password 
> as well as a VM/O2 password).

I disagree, your own quote shows that if it was a joint account for 
both, he'd only have needed the one password, whereas the Theo's 
transcription makes it plain that there were two.

>> In brief:
>> - received a text from O2 (mobile operator) saying he'd changed his 
>> password
>> - contacted O2 straight away and told SIM had been swapped
>> - told they'd stop that and send out a new SIM card, emailed to confirm
>> - next morning, email from EDF (energy supplier) asking for feedback 
>> on recent contact with customer services
>> - called EDF, told they'd pass it on to the fraud section and get back 
>> to him
>> - nothing happened for over a week
>> - called O2 again to make sure everything was stopped, put through to 
>> fraud department
>> - just after received an email saying new SIM card had been sent out,
>> connected to a different number.  Queried with fraud department, said 
>> didn't know, need to go to an O2 shop
>> - O2 shop couldn't do much as account had been stopped, couldn't look 
>> at it
>> - told them to check his emails
>> - contacted Virgin Media (ISP, merged with O2), told he'd changed his 
>> password, had to go through changing password back again, told they'd 
>> pass it to the fraud section
>>
>> It's difficult to deduce from this the exact ordering of events ...
>>
>> Because he had to contact VM to find out that he'd changed his email 
> 
>   'his password' may be 'his account password' rather than 'his email 
> app password'.

If it is 'his account password', then that completely supports my 
argument, not yours, and 'his email app password' doesn't make any 
sense, perhaps you mean 'his email password', but, unless he has 
multiple email addresses under a single account with VM, of which there 
is no mention, why would he need a separate email password?

>> password, rather than them contacting him at the time he did so, we 
>> can't tell when his email password was actually changed.  Further, the 
>> scammer could have been reading his emails for a while before actually 
>> deciding that, as unfolding events began to suggest that the scam was 
>> in danger of being closed down, that it was time to change the 
>> password in an attempt to prolong it.  Most probably his email account 
>> would have been compromised around the same time as all the other 
>> stages of the scam, yet "nothing happened for over a week" before he 
>> discovered it, and, in between, he received emails from both EDF and O2.
>>
>> However, I still think that some identifying personal information 
>> would have been necessary to enable the SIM swap, and most probably 
>> this came from the email hack occurring earlier. 
> 

-- 

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website: 
www.macfh.co.uk

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Thread

"'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2025-03-03 12:27 +0000
  Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-03 10:47 -0500
    Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" David Rance <david@SPAMOFF.invalid> - 2025-03-03 17:13 +0000
      Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2025-03-03 17:33 +0000
        Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" David Rance <david@SPAMOFF.invalid> - 2025-03-03 18:20 +0000
  Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk> - 2025-03-03 15:54 +0000
  Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2025-03-03 17:25 +0000
    Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" AJL <noemail@none.com> - 2025-03-03 17:38 +0000
    Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-03 14:04 -0500
      Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2025-03-03 19:28 +0000
        Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-03 21:36 +0100
      Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-03 21:35 +0100
        Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-03 17:35 -0500
          Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-04 02:49 +0100
            Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2025-03-04 08:07 +0000
        Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" AJL <noemail@none.com> - 2025-03-03 22:58 +0000
          Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-04 02:50 +0100
            Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" AJL <noemail@none.com> - 2025-03-03 21:23 -0700
          Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2025-03-04 06:43 +0000
            Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" AJL <noemail@none.com> - 2025-03-04 09:22 -0700
              Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-03-04 16:40 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" AJL <noemail@none.com> - 2025-03-04 10:21 -0700
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-03-04 18:37 +0000
          Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-03-04 14:46 +0000
      Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2025-03-03 21:38 +0000
        Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-03 17:31 -0500
          Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2025-03-04 08:13 +0000
            Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-04 08:09 -0500
              Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-03-04 16:22 +0000
              Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2025-03-04 21:09 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-04 19:43 -0500
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2025-03-05 05:34 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-05 08:22 -0500
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2025-03-05 16:15 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" David Wade <dave@g4ugm.invalid> - 2025-03-05 09:44 +0100
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-05 13:15 +0100
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-05 08:47 -0500
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Abandoned Trolley <that.bloke@microsoft.com> - 2025-03-05 14:27 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-05 10:42 -0500
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-03-05 16:51 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Abandoned Trolley <that.bloke@microsoft.com> - 2025-03-05 17:21 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-05 12:37 -0500
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2025-03-05 18:03 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-05 16:00 -0500
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" David Wade <dave@g4ugm.invalid> - 2025-03-05 22:07 +0100
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-03-06 15:42 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-06 19:28 +0100
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Abandoned Trolley <that.bloke@microsoft.com> - 2025-03-05 18:23 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-05 16:01 -0500
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Abandoned Trolley <that.bloke@microsoft.com> - 2025-03-05 21:03 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-03-05 18:40 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" David Wade <dave@g4ugm.invalid> - 2025-03-05 18:02 +0100
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-05 21:04 +0100
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-05 08:12 -0500
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-03-05 13:29 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" David Wade <dave@g4ugm.invalid> - 2025-03-05 17:38 +0100
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Abandoned Trolley <that.bloke@microsoft.com> - 2025-03-05 17:25 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" David Wade <dave@g4ugm.invalid> - 2025-03-05 21:44 +0100
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-03-05 18:45 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-03-05 13:25 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-03-05 13:25 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-05 14:57 +0100
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2025-03-05 14:10 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2025-03-05 16:26 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-03-05 14:33 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-05 21:08 +0100
    Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2025-03-03 19:25 +0000
      Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2025-03-03 19:43 +0000
        Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-03 21:40 +0100
          Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2025-03-03 21:26 +0000
      Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-03 21:38 +0100
      Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2025-03-03 20:54 +0000
        Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2025-03-04 07:19 +0000
    Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-03 21:31 +0100
  Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Brian Gregory <void-invalid-dead-dontuse@email.invalid> - 2025-03-06 01:56 +0000
    Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2025-03-06 13:54 +0000
      Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> - 2025-03-06 14:57 +0000
      Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-06 11:09 -0500
        Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" AJL <noemail@none.com> - 2025-03-06 11:17 -0700
          Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-07 09:12 -0500
            Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" AJL <noemail@none.com> - 2025-03-07 09:35 -0700
        Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-03-06 18:24 +0000
        Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-06 19:36 +0100
          Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-07 09:17 -0500
            Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-07 16:16 +0100
            Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2025-03-08 10:30 +0000
      Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Brian Gregory <void-invalid-dead-dontuse@email.invalid> - 2025-03-06 16:37 +0000
        Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2025-03-06 19:53 +0000
          Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2025-03-07 07:37 +0000
            Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-07 10:46 +0100
          Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2025-03-07 13:24 +0000
            Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-07 09:38 -0500
              Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk> - 2025-03-07 15:35 +0000
              Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2025-03-07 15:46 +0000
              Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2025-03-14 18:49 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk> - 2025-03-15 09:53 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2025-03-15 11:46 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-15 08:35 -0400
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2025-03-15 17:53 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2025-03-15 19:27 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-15 23:30 -0400
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" AJL <noemail@none.com> - 2025-03-16 05:01 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-16 08:47 -0400
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2025-03-16 13:47 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2025-03-16 15:13 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2025-03-16 16:04 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2025-03-16 18:00 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk> - 2025-03-17 08:53 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2025-03-17 13:53 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk> - 2025-03-17 14:53 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2025-03-17 18:44 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk> - 2025-03-20 10:42 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2025-03-20 12:48 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk> - 2025-03-20 13:18 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2025-03-20 13:27 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk> - 2025-03-20 14:28 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2025-03-20 16:02 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-20 13:00 -0400
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-16 11:54 -0400
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2025-03-16 16:09 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-03-16 19:23 +0000
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-03-16 23:10 +0100
                Re: "'Scammers stole £40k after EDF gave out my number" Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-03-15 08:48 -0400

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