Re: Differences between C and C++

From	Paavo Helde <eesnimi@osa.pri.ee>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.c++
Subject	Re: Differences between C and C++
Date	2022-07-29 12:03 +0300
Organization	A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID	<tc07oh$3f6d6$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References	(3 earlier) <xuuEK.570267$J0r9.138756@fx11.iad> <jkffqcFbbplU1@mid.individual.net> <tbu8us$t6b$1@gioia.aioe.org> <tbufhe$36veg$1@dont-email.me> <tc03ru$1ld7$1@gioia.aioe.org>

Show all headers | View raw

29.07.2022 10:56 Juha Nieminen kirjutas:
> Paavo Helde <eesnimi@osa.pri.ee> wrote:
>> Why on earth are you using char* in a C++ program? The only thing they
>> bring is problems and slowdowns (because string length needs to be
>> re-calculated all the time).
> 
> Incorrect. In many situations using char* "strings" is more efficient than
> using std::string because of the elided dynamic memory allocation. Also,
> not in all situations is the length of the string needed to be separately
> calculated in order to operate with the string, as many operations do not
> need to know the length in advance, and can just stop when they encounter
> the null byte. (For example printing a char* string doesn't need to know
> its length in advance. Many other operations likewise.)

Yes, in some situations char* strings can be more efficient. But these 
situations are pretty rare, and in order to outweigh the drawbacks the 
performance benefits must be pretty large. Plus, on that level of 
performance tuning, one needs to really know what one is doing, which Mr 
Muttley quite clearly does not.

> 
> If you have some function void foo(const std::string&), and you wanted
> to call that function by giving it a string literal, how is that going
> to be more (or even equally) efficient than if it were foo(const char*)?
> The string literal would be needlessly copied into a dynamically
> allocated memory block (and immediately deleted after the function returns).

First, if I have a std::string literal and pass it to foo(const 
std::string&), then there is no copies, just a reference is passed. If I 
have a char* literal, then there is indeed strlen+copy, that's what I 
was talking about. I think your example actually proves my point.

Second, for such functions it would be more appropriate to declare them 
as taking a std::string_view parameter. For a string_view, you can also 
pass either a std::string or a char* literal, and there will be no 
copies made, just an extra strlen() in case of char* literal.

> 
> There are also some situations where, for example, a class needs a small
> string as a member variable (which maximum length, or even outright length,
> is fixed and very small). Using a char array is usually much more efficient
> for this than a std::string, and operating on this small string will be
> more efficient with a char* than creating a std::string every time.
> (If in this example the length of the string would vary and there are
> tons of situations where the length is needed, you could simply add
> a length member variable and use that. Still a lot more efficient than
> using std::string because you are not dynamically allocating memory.)

Nowadays std::string is typically using small string optimization, 
meaning that for sufficiently short strings there is no dynamic 
allocation either.

Thread

Differences between C and C++ Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-07-25 13:14 +0000
  Re: Differences between C and C++ "Alf P. Steinbach" <alf.p.steinbach@gmail.com> - 2022-07-25 16:18 +0200
  Re: Differences between C and C++ Paavo Helde <eesnimi@osa.pri.ee> - 2022-07-25 18:47 +0300
    Re: Differences between C and C++ Paavo Helde <eesnimi@osa.pri.ee> - 2022-07-25 19:49 +0300
      Re: Differences between C and C++ Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-07-25 19:38 +0100
  Re: Differences between C and C++ Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-07-25 08:51 -0700
  Re: Differences between C and C++ Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-07-25 17:14 +0100
    Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-25 16:19 +0000
      Re: Differences between C and C++ Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-07-25 19:28 +0100
      Re: Differences between C and C++ Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2022-07-25 12:21 -0700
        Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-26 07:54 +0000
          Re: Differences between C and C++ Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-07-26 08:00 +0000
            Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-26 08:09 +0000
              Re: Differences between C and C++ Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-07-26 02:42 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-26 15:29 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2022-07-26 16:30 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2022-07-26 11:59 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-27 07:52 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-07-27 01:56 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-27 14:51 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2022-07-27 11:11 -0700
    Re: Differences between C and C++ Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-07-26 06:09 +0000
      Re: Differences between C and C++ Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-07-27 17:33 +0100
  Re: Differences between C and C++ Chris Vine <chris@cvine--nospam--.freeserve.co.uk> - 2022-07-25 17:45 +0100
  Re: Differences between C and C++ Paul N <gw7rib@aol.com> - 2022-07-27 10:09 -0700
    Re: Differences between C and C++ Bo Persson <bo@bo-persson.se> - 2022-07-27 19:28 +0200
      Re: Differences between C and C++ Paul N <gw7rib@aol.com> - 2022-07-27 11:43 -0700
        Re: Differences between C and C++ David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-07-29 18:04 +0200
          Re: Differences between C and C++ Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2022-07-29 18:47 -0400
            Re: Differences between C and C++ David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-07-30 14:08 +0200
      Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-28 08:03 +0000
        Re: Differences between C and C++ Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-07-28 01:57 -0700
          Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-28 09:04 +0000
    Re: Differences between C and C++ Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-07-28 06:53 +0000
      Re: Differences between C and C++ Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2022-07-28 07:33 -0400
        Re: Differences between C and C++ Bo Persson <bo@bo-persson.se> - 2022-07-28 15:04 +0200
          Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-28 15:11 +0000
            Re: Differences between C and C++ Paavo Helde <eesnimi@osa.pri.ee> - 2022-07-28 20:03 +0300
              Re: Differences between C and C++ Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-07-29 07:56 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Paavo Helde <eesnimi@osa.pri.ee> - 2022-07-29 12:03 +0300
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-29 09:28 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-07-29 12:27 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-07-29 05:43 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-29 14:14 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-07-29 08:25 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-29 15:48 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-07-29 13:12 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-30 09:28 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-07-30 03:39 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-30 14:23 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-07-30 19:07 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-31 07:22 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-07-31 06:07 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-31 16:36 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-08-01 01:12 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-07-29 22:47 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-07-30 03:48 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-07-29 05:16 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Manfred <noname@add.invalid> - 2022-07-30 02:14 +0200
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-07-31 14:39 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@KVI.nl> - 2022-07-31 18:49 +0200
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2022-07-31 14:49 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2022-07-31 17:03 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2022-08-01 00:16 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Ike Naar <ike@sdf.org> - 2022-08-01 07:27 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Paavo Helde <eesnimi@osa.pri.ee> - 2022-08-01 10:47 +0300
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Paavo Helde <eesnimi@osa.pri.ee> - 2022-08-01 10:34 +0300
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Manfred <noname@add.invalid> - 2022-08-03 01:20 +0200
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-08-03 07:59 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Bo Persson <bo@bo-persson.se> - 2022-08-03 12:45 +0200
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-08-03 10:53 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2022-08-03 03:58 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Paavo Helde <eesnimi@osa.pri.ee> - 2022-08-03 14:49 +0300
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2022-08-03 23:31 -0700
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-08-01 11:29 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Bo Persson <bo@bo-persson.se> - 2022-08-01 14:39 +0200
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Juha Nieminen <nospam@thanks.invalid> - 2022-08-02 05:43 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Manfred <noname@add.invalid> - 2022-08-03 01:13 +0200
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Paavo Helde <eesnimi@osa.pri.ee> - 2022-08-03 09:34 +0300
              Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-29 09:22 +0000
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Paavo Helde <eesnimi@osa.pri.ee> - 2022-07-29 13:53 +0300
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Paavo Helde <eesnimi@osa.pri.ee> - 2022-07-29 14:13 +0300
                Re: Differences between C and C++ Muttley@dastardlyhq.com - 2022-07-29 14:11 +0000
        Re: Differences between C and C++ Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2022-07-28 06:16 -0700

csiph-web