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Re: Xorg replaces TTY1

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On 11/22/2015 02:56 PM, The Wanderer wrote:
> On 2015-11-22 at 15:24, Brian wrote:
>
>> On Sun 22 Nov 2015 at 14:12:09 -0500, The Wanderer wrote:
>>
>>> On 2015-11-22 at 13:26, Brian wrote:
>>>>    * 10-startx-Under-Linux-start-X-on-the-current-VT.patch,
>>>>      11-startx-Pass-vtX-as-long-as-the-user-did-not-specify-.patch: By default
>>>>      start the server on the current VT, this is necessary to avoid logind to
>>>>      see the startx session as inactive (Closes: #743015 LP: #1247484)
>>> In other words, it's a consequence of logind, which is part of the
>>> systemd suite and is shipped in the systemd package.
>>>
>>> So yes, this change does have to do with systemd - just not with
>>> the binary named systemd, or with the init system which is
>>> (theoretically) contained within that binary.
>> It looks like it is. What functional disadvantage is it to a user of
>> sysvinit or systemd? Starting X on vt7 is not a Law of Nature.
> The loss of the ability to switch to the VT from which I started X, and
> either see the most recent X console output there or (more importantly)
> kill X semi-cleanly via Ctrl-C.
>
> I have needed the latter on multiple occasions, including I think at
> least one where logging in to another VT would not have been a viable
> option (though I forget why, and it's possible that I'm wrong about
> that). I think that's enough to count as a functional disadvantage.
>
> Not to mention, "functional disadvantage" is not the only valid grounds
> on which to object to a change... but if we try to get into that very
> deeply, we'll be at risk of flamewar, of reviving the systemd flap again
> (we're already skirting the edges of it), and of getting offtopic. (In
> order of increasing likelihood.)
>
>>> AFAIK I've yet to restart X since the xinit version in question hit
>>> my system, but if I'm now going to be affected by this behavior
>>> despite not having logind even installed on this machine, I will be
>>> - once more - at least mildly irritated. I don't even see any
>>> indication (in 'man startx', which is the obvious appropriate
>>> place) of how to disable this behavior, either on the startx
>>> command line (which would be unacceptable anyway) or in a config
>>> file...
>>>
>>> (Digging a bit finds what is probably the appropriate command-line
>>> option in 'man Xorg', but still no obvious indication of where to
>>> set it in a config file, given that I have no xorg.conf and
>>> creating one seems undesirable for other reasons.)
>> If the OP (or anyone else) wants X on vt7:
>>
>> startx -- vt7
> That requires specifying it by hand every time startx is run. As I
> indicated, that is unacceptable; I don't have to specify the VT manually
> every time I lanch X now in order to get the current behavior, and I
> shouldn't have to specify it manually at every launch in order get that
> behavior after a change of the default.
>
> Where/how would it be possible to specify this in a config file, so that
> it can be set-and-forget if desired?
>
> (Leaving aside the fact that setting it explicitly in a config file
> wouldn't replicate current behavior in the scenario where multiple
> instances of X are launched on the same machine; I've had X open on vt7
> and vt8 at the same time, previously, with no manual VT specifying
> involved. That's something I do rarely enough that it won't affect me
> personally, however; it's just something whose loss I'd find annoying in
> principle.)
>
My box always has three X sessions going at the same time (still on 
Wheezy).  I use an alias to set the vt.  The value of the alias is 
determined by who is logged on and running startx:

for me:
     alias startx='clear; startx -- :0 vt07'

for my wife:
     alias startx='clear; startx -- :1 vt08'

for my daughter:
     alias startx='clear; startx -- :2 vt09'

I sincerely hope that, if and when I update to Jessie, this behavior 
will still be available as this allows any one of us to sit down at the 
computer and with a fixed keystroke combination get to our own X 
session, while not requiring that we logon to a fixed console.

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Xorg replaces TTY1 berenger.morel@neutralite.org - 2015-11-22 00:40 +0100
  Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Bert Riding <reriding@xmission.com> - 2015-11-22 10:10 +0100
  Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2015-11-22 14:50 +0100
    Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2015-11-22 15:20 +0100
      Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-11-22 19:30 +0100
        Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2015-11-22 20:20 +0100
          Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-11-22 21:30 +0100
            Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2015-11-23 00:00 +0100
              Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Chris Bannister <cbannister@slingshot.co.nz> - 2015-11-23 01:00 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2015-11-23 01:10 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-11-23 01:50 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Vincent Lefevre <vincent@vinc17.net> - 2015-11-24 18:10 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-11-24 19:10 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Michael Biebl <biebl@debian.org> - 2015-11-24 21:20 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-11-24 21:50 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Michael Biebl <biebl@debian.org> - 2015-11-24 22:20 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-11-24 23:40 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Vincent Lefevre <vincent@vinc17.net> - 2015-11-25 09:40 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Vincent Lefevre <vincent@vinc17.net> - 2015-11-25 09:40 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-11-25 14:00 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Vincent Lefevre <vincent@vinc17.net> - 2015-11-25 15:50 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-11-25 19:50 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Chris Bannister <cbannister@slingshot.co.nz> - 2015-11-27 06:30 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-11-27 13:20 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Chris Bannister <cbannister@slingshot.co.nz> - 2015-11-28 09:20 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Vincent Lefevre <vincent@vinc17.net> - 2015-11-28 11:20 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2015-11-28 11:50 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2015-11-28 11:50 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2015-11-28 13:30 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-11-28 14:10 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2015-11-28 16:00 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2015-11-28 11:50 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2015-11-28 11:50 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Random832 <random832@fastmail.com> - 2015-11-30 17:40 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2015-11-30 18:10 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 "Neal P. Murphy" <neal.p.murphy@alum.wpi.edu> - 2015-11-30 19:00 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2015-11-30 19:20 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Chris Bannister <cbannister@slingshot.co.nz> - 2015-11-28 16:30 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-11-28 18:10 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-11-28 18:50 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2015-11-27 15:20 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Vincent Lefevre <vincent@vinc17.net> - 2015-11-27 17:50 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-11-27 19:20 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2015-11-27 21:10 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2015-11-28 10:30 +0100
              Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Marc Shapiro <marcnshap@gmail.com> - 2015-11-24 05:10 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-11-24 15:20 +0100
                Re: Xorg replaces TTY1 Marc Shapiro <marcnshap@gmail.com> - 2015-11-24 16:20 +0100

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