Re: Aether, the playdough of God

From	benj <benj.fake@gmail.com>
Newsgroups	sci.physics
Subject	Re: Aether, the playdough of God
Date	2019-02-14 16:22 -0500
Organization	Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID	<q44m5t$jo0$1@gioia.aioe.org> (permalink)
References	<9c5a3904-7b67-49ee-b850-8b682f69f9b6@googlegroups.com> <gck378F38oiU1@mid.individual.net> <q436i3$1k6p$1@gioia.aioe.org> <gckol1F7jp6U1@mid.individual.net>

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On 2/14/2019 3:53 AM, Sylvia Else wrote:
> On 14/02/2019 6:49 pm, benj wrote:
>> On 2/13/2019 9:48 PM, Sylvia Else wrote:
>>> On 14/02/2019 12:39 pm, Arindam Banerjee wrote:
>>>> Aether is infinitely fine, infinitely elastic solid MATTER 
>>>> permeating the entire universe. Aether is so fine that atoms glide 
>>>> through it. It fills up interatomic space. Aether conceals into what 
>>>> we call mass as two opposite charges. Aether supplies the mass for 
>>>> the growth of life forms. Death and decay cause return of that mass 
>>>> to aether.
>>>>
>>>> Aether is the playdough of God.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Arindam Banerjee
>>>>
>>>
>>> If only things were that simple. The existence of the Aether raised 
>>> all sorts of problems, which the bright minds of the century before 
>>> last were unable to solve to their own satisfaction. Then Einstein 
>>> showed that it's not needed, and most people were happy as a result.
>>>
>>> Sylvia.
>>
>> So you think science is determined by a majority vote just like 
>> climate science? While it's true all the problems with aether were not 
>> solved by the brightest minds, they did make a pretty good start on it.
> 
> They ended up with the Lorentz transform, which still bears his name. 
> Though it was still ostensibly Aether based, it contained no reference 
> to the Aether in the math. It amounted to saying that the Aether could 
> be ignored, because it had no measurable effect on anything. By that 
> time, nothing remained of the kind of Aether that present day relativity 
> deniers favour, because the time dilation and length contraction effects 
> were already there, as were the lack of simultaneity and the velocity 
> composition rule, even if people hadn't necessarily realised the latter 
> points the time.

Generally relativity deniers also deny that the fact that no aether 
drift was found. This is of course science nonsense. Saying that aether 
can be ignored in math for certain calculations if far from saying it 
has no measurable effect. That is a nonsense statement requiring super 
powers (you must look at ALL possible effects and then show aether has 
nothing to do with any of them.

> Einstein showed that you didn't need to start with an Aether, and then 
> give it increasingly improbable attributes. All you needed to do was 
> start with a couple of basic ideas, and you would arrive directly at the 
> Lorentz transform.

However he was also smart enough not to buy into illogical nonsense like 
saying there is no aether when clearly empty space has properties and 
other mental trash like waves do not need a medium.

> If you mysteriously delete Einstein from history, and assume that no one 
> else did the same work, then you lose E=mc^2, and general relativity, 
> but the other mathematical consequences of special relativity remain, 
> because the Lorentz transform already existed.

I"m not all that versed in history of science but I believe E=mc^2 would 
actually not be lost (can be shown from Maxwell and Lorentz transforms) 
and of course general relativity is really just a gravity theory that 
explains very little more than Newton's theory. The role of aether in 
gravity is not known, but that does not prove there is no aether.

> If you try to restore a denier's view of the world, you're just going 
> back to a situation that those earlier minds spent so much effort trying 
> explain.

Relativity denying denies facts. In science facts are the ONLY thing 
that matters. Aether deniers do likewise. They take fantasy for reality 
and build a case that fantasy is science and facts don't matter. In 
other words totally anti-science.

Thread

Aether, the playdough of God Arindam Banerjee <banerjeeadda1234@gmail.com> - 2019-02-13 17:39 -0800
  Re: Aether, the playdough of God Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> - 2019-02-14 13:48 +1100
    Re: Aether, the playdough of God Arindam Banerjee <banerjeeadda1234@gmail.com> - 2019-02-13 21:06 -0800
      Re: Aether, the playdough of God Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> - 2019-02-14 16:31 +1100
        Re: Aether, the playdough of God Arindam Banerjee <banerjeeadda1234@gmail.com> - 2019-02-13 21:53 -0800
          Re: Aether, the playdough of God Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> - 2019-02-14 17:25 +1100
            Re: Aether, the playdough of God Arindam Banerjee <banerjeeadda1234@gmail.com> - 2019-02-13 23:47 -0800
              Re: Aether, the playdough of God Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> - 2019-02-14 19:56 +1100
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Arindam Banerjee <banerjeeadda1234@gmail.com> - 2019-02-14 23:28 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2019-02-15 16:49 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2019-02-15 17:43 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2019-02-16 07:34 -0500
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Mahipal <mahipal7638@gmail.com> - 2019-02-16 12:38 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2019-02-16 17:46 -0500
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Mahipal <mahipal7638@gmail.com> - 2019-02-16 16:52 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2019-02-17 06:19 -0500
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Mahipal <mahipal7638@gmail.com> - 2019-02-17 17:56 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Buck Futter <DognPolisher@hotmail.com> - 2019-02-17 19:38 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2019-02-18 07:43 -0500
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Mahipal <mahipal7638@gmail.com> - 2019-02-18 15:39 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2019-02-18 20:07 -0500
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Buck Futter <DognPolisher@hotmail.com> - 2019-02-16 16:44 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Arindam Banerjee <banerjeeadda1234@gmail.com> - 2019-02-19 01:55 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2019-02-15 17:40 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Arindam Banerjee <banerjeeadda1234@gmail.com> - 2019-02-15 23:25 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2019-02-16 15:32 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Arindam Banerjee <banerjeeadda1234@gmail.com> - 2019-02-17 19:32 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2019-02-18 09:47 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Arindam Banerjee <banerjeeadda1234@gmail.com> - 2019-02-18 13:25 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2019-02-16 10:13 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2019-02-16 15:37 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2019-02-17 06:51 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> - 2019-02-16 19:42 +1100
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2019-02-16 07:42 -0500
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Arindam Banerjee <banerjeeadda1234@gmail.com> - 2019-02-19 01:55 -0800
                Re: Aether, the playdough of God Arindam Banerjee <banerjeeadda1234@gmail.com> - 2019-02-19 01:48 -0800
    Re: Aether, the playdough of God benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2019-02-14 02:49 -0500
      Re: Aether, the playdough of God Arindam Banerjee <banerjeeadda1234@gmail.com> - 2019-02-13 23:59 -0800
      Re: Aether, the playdough of God Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> - 2019-02-14 19:53 +1100
        Re: Aether, the playdough of God benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2019-02-14 16:22 -0500
          Re: Aether, the playdough of God Serg Io <invvalid@invalid.com> - 2019-02-14 18:07 -0600
            Re: Aether, the playdough of God mitchrae3323@gmail.com - 2019-02-14 19:59 -0800
            Re: Aether, the playdough of God Mahipal <mahipal7638@gmail.com> - 2019-02-15 15:10 -0800
          Re: Aether, the playdough of God Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2019-02-15 17:36 -0800
      Re: Aether, the playdough of God Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2019-02-15 17:30 -0800
  Re: Aether, the playdough of God mitchrae3323@gmail.com - 2019-02-13 20:02 -0800
  Re: Aether, the playdough of God kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2019-02-16 09:47 -0800
    Re: Aether, the playdough of God Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2019-02-16 15:34 -0800
  Re: Aether, the playdough of God "Chris M. Thomasson" <invalid_chris_thomasson_invalid@invalid.com> - 2019-02-16 14:11 -0800
    Re: Aether, the playdough of God "Chris M. Thomasson" <invalid_chris_thomasson_invalid@invalid.com> - 2019-02-16 14:13 -0800

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