Groups | Search | Server Info | Keyboard shortcuts | Login | Register [http] [https] [nntp] [nntps]

Groups > sci.physics > #697321

Re: We don't know what we don't know

Show all headers | View raw

On 8/6/2018 4:07 PM, Sergio wrote:
> On 8/6/2018 10:26 AM, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>> <alal65536@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Monday, August 6, 2018 at 7:29:30 PM UTC+5:30, Sergio wrote:
>>>> On 8/6/2018 6:44 AM, alal65536@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>> My quest for truth is to understand myself and the world better.
>>>>> Scientists search for simple laws that describe the natural world.
>>>>> With classical physics, scientist felt they had discovered almost
>>>>> everything and the process was ending.  Then came relativity and
>>>>> quantum mechanics.  The end is but the beginning.
>>>>>
>>>>> The famous quote about unknown unknowns is from Donald Rumsfeld, a US
>>>>> Congressman.  But does it also apply to physics?
>>>>>
>>>>> Mathematics hates contradictions.
>>>>
>>>> no so, they are very useful.
>>>>
>>>>> And physics can be said to be empirical with theory of applied
>>>>> mathematics.  But even in physics there is contradiction.  Wave
>>>>> particle duality is considered by some to be a contradiction.
>>>>>
>>>>> According to arxiv.org, in "Types of paradoxes in physics", 'axioms of
>>>>> a formal system allow for the possibility of contradiction'.  And
>>>>> physics is somewhat a formal system.
>>>>
>>>> not sure what you mean by "formal system", as physics is disparate
>>>> collection.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> We will never discover everything, I suspect.  But we can continue to
>>>>> have a better understanding of ourselves and the world.  Understanding
>>>>> ourselves is just as important as understanding the rest of the world.
>>>>> Biology is just as important as physics.  But what are the limits to our understanding?
>>>>>
>>>>> I only read that one paper on arxiv.org, but I need to understand more
>>>>> about how much a thing (human, in this case) can understand itself, and
>>>>> how biased our physics is because it was discovered/created by humans.
>>>>
>>>> physics is not biased.
>>>
>>> Is the human mind, connected to the human senses like vision and hearing,
>>> specific to humans and other earth species.  Might aliens in other world
>>> have different kind of minds and sense organs, perceiving the world
>>> differently.  So is our physics biased based on our specific type of mind and body?
>>>
>>> Abhinav Lal
>>
>> I think you should first of all be clear that most of the work that is done
>> in physics today does not involve sensory data collection. Most
>> experimental observation now involves the design of instruments and
>> detectors that are sensitive to phenomena wholly outside our sensory
>> domain, and the output of those instruments and detectors is almost
>> entirely processed and analyzed using digital algorithms on computers.
> 
> "Physics" is huge, many subjects, many approches.
> 
> but take cosmic ray characterization,
> the "Flys Eye" array, consisted of hundreds of PMTs with filters, with
> amplifiers, adjustable gain, looking at mirrors, aimed at sectors of the
> night sky, to detect faint light in the atmosphere (located in very dark
> place), timestamp and corrolate data, build 3D model from data to
> determine direction, then ID source in sky (very difficult)
> 
> Just think how poorly Aliens would do if they could read each others
> minds, disagree, and argue quietly all the time with each other, if you
> had 10 Aliens, there would be 55 arguments going on (10*11/2).  Who says
> all aliens would agree like in our hollywood movies?
\

Odd says the answer to getting agreement is to live in a collective.

Resistance is futile.




>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Let me close this discussion with some quotes.
>>>>>
>>>>> "The more I know, the less I know"
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> the huge # of problems are not solvable with math, anything over 5
>>>> dimensions or 5 degrees of freedom typically.
>>>>
>>>> a complex move by a hand on a robot, must be taught to it, as the
>>>> optimum path is not solvable by math.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Abhinav Lal
>>>>> Writer & Investor
>>>>>
>>>>> "I am a contradiction,
>>>>> There is no logical solution"
>>>>
>>>> too general.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
> 

Back to sci.physics | Previous | Next — Previous in thread | Next in thread | Find similar | Unroll thread

Thread

We don't know what we don't know alal65536@gmail.com - 2018-08-06 04:44 -0700
  Re: We don't know what we don't know Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-06 12:11 +0000
    Re: We don't know what we don't know alal65536@gmail.com - 2018-08-06 05:55 -0700
    Re: We don't know what we don't know alal65536@gmail.com - 2018-08-06 07:34 -0700
      Re: We don't know what we don't know Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2018-08-06 10:21 -0500
        Re: We don't know what we don't know benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-06 14:21 -0400
      Re: We don't know what we don't know Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-06 15:21 +0000
        Re: We don't know what we don't know benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-06 14:05 -0400
      The uncaused cause. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-08-12 17:11 -0700
    Re: We don't know what we don't know benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-06 14:03 -0400
    Re: We don't know what we don't know john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-08 07:17 -0700
      Re: We don't know what we don't know benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-08 11:22 -0400
  Re: We don't know what we don't know Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2018-08-06 08:59 -0500
    Re: We don't know what we don't know alal65536@gmail.com - 2018-08-06 07:42 -0700
      Re: We don't know what we don't know Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2018-08-06 10:20 -0500
      Re: We don't know what we don't know Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-06 15:26 +0000
        Re: We don't know what we don't know alal65536@gmail.com - 2018-08-06 09:29 -0700
          Re: We don't know what we don't know Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-06 16:43 +0000
            Re: We don't know what we don't know benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-06 14:23 -0400
          Re: We don't know what we don't know "Chris M. Thomasson" <invalid_chris_thomasson@invalid.invalid> - 2018-08-06 14:45 -0700
            Re: We don't know what we don't know Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2018-08-06 16:57 -0500
              Re: We don't know what we don't know "Chris M. Thomasson" <invalid_chris_thomasson@invalid.invalid> - 2018-08-08 23:39 -0700
          Re: We don't know what we don't know Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-06 17:10 -0700
        Re: We don't know what we don't know benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-06 14:08 -0400
        Re: We don't know what we don't know Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2018-08-06 15:07 -0500
          Re: We don't know what we don't know benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-06 17:27 -0400
            Re: We don't know what we don't know Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2018-08-06 16:35 -0500
    Re: We don't know what we don't know poraty149@gmail.com - 2018-08-13 15:59 -0700
  Re: We don't know what we don't know Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-06 16:59 -0700
  We're ten times more retarded than we can imagine. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-08-12 16:53 -0700
    Re: We're ten times more retarded than we can imagine. Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2018-08-12 22:59 -0500
      Re: We're ten times more retarded than we can imagine. benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-13 11:42 -0400
    Re: We're ten times more retarded than we can imagine. Double-A <double-a3@hush.com> - 2018-08-13 13:42 -0700

csiph-web