Re: Life on Europa in scifi?

From	David Johnston <davidjohnston29@yahoo.com>
Newsgroups	rec.arts.sf.movies, rec.arts.sf.science, rec.arts.sf.written
Subject	Re: Life on Europa in scifi?
Date	2018-05-03 15:17 -0600
Organization	Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID	<pcfu9l$1pvi$1@gioia.aioe.org> (permalink)
References	<pbucl6$2ar$1@newsreader5.netcologne.de> <pce9qp$v18$1@gioia.aioe.org> <pcfdej$kn5$3@dont-email.me> <pcfter$1on2$1@gioia.aioe.org>

Cross-posted to 3 groups.

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On 2018-05-03 3:03 PM, Your Name wrote:
> On 2018-05-03 16:30:14 +0000, Dimensional Traveler said:
>> On 5/2/2018 11:22 PM, Your Name wrote:
>>> On 2018-05-02 23:16:37 +0000, J. Clarke said:
>>>> On Wed, 2 May 2018 07:45:32 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
>>>> <dtravel@sonic.net> wrote:
>>>>> On 5/1/2018 11:21 PM, Your Name wrote:
>>>>>> On 2018-05-01 22:30:24 +0000, Dimensional Traveler said:
>>>>>>> On 5/1/2018 11:18 AM, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
>>>>>>>> Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> wrote in
>>>>>>>> news:88bhed578t3ec2ujs5ajnsgdk85tabsr48@4ax.com:
>>>>>>>>> On Mon, 30 Apr 2018 20:48:49 -0400, J. Clarke
>>>>>>>>> <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, 30 Apr 2018 11:29:59 -0700, Gene Wirchenko
>>>>>>>>>> <genew@telus.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Sun, 29 Apr 2018 18:57:24 -0500, Cryptoengineer
>>>>>>>>>>> <treifamily@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> We have limited resources for searching. We do know one type
>>>>>>>>>>>> of environment where life can arise, and its not a rare one.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Can you present an argument for looking elsewhere, and suggest
>>>>>>>>>>>> what we should look for?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> We already know about that one.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Thinking about how *else* life could arise can help us
>>>>>>>>>>> understand
>>>>>>>>>>> our case.  (Just as knowing more than one language helps one
>>>>>>>>>>> understand one's own language better.)
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> One idea of mine is to look for systems that have
>>>>>>>>>>> chemicals
>>>>>>>>>>> converting back and forth.  (As with the oxygen - carbon
>>>>>>>>>>> dioxide cycle in Earth's biosphere.)  This is, of course, no
>>>>>>>>>>> guarantee of life, but it is a start.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Do you know of a method that will let us tell that "chemicals
>>>>>>>>>> are converting back and forth" at interstellar distances?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Of course not.  I am no expert in the area.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And yet, you criticize those who are for doing it wrong.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think you are conflating Gene with 'Your Name' who has been 
>>>>>>> bitching
>>>>>>> about scientists spending money on stupid things and why are they 
>>>>>>> only
>>>>>>> looking for life like us.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's what some scientists are paid to do ... I'm not. The fact 
>>>>>> that they
>>>>>> lazily take the easiest route isn't my fault.
>>>>>
>>>>> And you still haven't made ANY kind of suggestion for how to look for
>>>>> other life with the technology and knowledge we have.
>>>>
>>>> He's one of those idiots to whom any job that they don't know how to
>>>> do is trivially easy.
>>>
>>> It's amazing how many morons on the internet have reading 
>>> comprehension issues. :-\
>>>
>>> I never ever said that it was "easy".
>>>
>>> I never ever said I know how to do it ... I'm not being paid to come 
>>> up with such ideas, the scientists in that specific area are.
>>>
>>> Simply a plain and simple *fact* that looking for life ONLY where 
>>> water is, or thinking life can ONLY exist where water is, or 
>>> believing all life in the universe is the same chemistry / structure 
>>> / requirements / etc. as life on Earth is stupidly blinkered.
>>
>> What makes you think all scientists involved in the search for life 
>> think only water-based life is possible?  Or that they wouldn't look 
>> for other types of life if they could?
> 
> 
> Why do we look for water when searching for extraterrestrial life?
> <https://io9.gizmodo.com/5728932/why-do-we-look-for-water-when-searching-for-extraterrestrial-life> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why do scientists look for things like water and oxygen when they talk 
> about life on a different planet?
> <https://www.quora.com/Why-do-scientists-look-for-things-like-water-and-oxygen-when-they-talk-about-life-on-a-different-planet> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jupiter's Icy Moon Europa: Best Bet for Alien Life?
> https://www.space.com/26905-jupiter-moon-europa-alien-life.html
> 
> 
> Why is water vital to life?
> https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/earth/geophysics/water-vital-to-life.htm 
> 
> 
> 
> The list is near endless.

Too bad it's not a list of articles in which the possibility of 
non-water life actually is ruled out.  Did you actually read more than 
the first paragraph of any of them?

Thread

Life on Europa in scifi? "Robert Clark" <rgregoryclark@gmSPAMBLOCKail.com> - 2018-04-25 07:29 -0400
  Re: Life on Europa in scifi? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2018-04-25 13:44 +0000
  Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2018-04-25 14:34 -0500
    Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2018-04-26 01:03 +0000
    Re: Life on Europa in scifi? "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <seawasp@sgeinc.invalid.com> - 2018-04-25 21:22 -0400
  Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Steve Dodds <sdodds@nova-optical.com> - 2018-04-25 16:04 -0600
  Re: Life on Europa in scifi? William Elliot <marsh@panix.com> - 2018-04-25 21:22 -0700
    Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-04-26 18:27 +1200
      Re: Life on Europa in scifi? David Johnston <davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2018-04-26 08:56 -0600
      Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2018-04-27 05:32 +0000
        Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-04-27 18:40 +1200
          Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2018-04-27 08:04 -0700
            Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Robert Woodward <robertaw@drizzle.com> - 2018-04-27 09:48 -0700
              Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2018-04-27 12:52 -0500
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2018-04-27 11:02 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2018-04-27 22:11 -0400
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2018-04-30 09:22 -0700
              Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2018-04-27 11:01 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2018-04-27 11:48 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2018-04-27 12:45 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2018-04-27 13:06 -0700
              Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-04-28 09:37 +1200
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2018-04-27 15:17 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2018-04-27 22:12 -0400
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2018-04-28 05:47 +0000
          Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Paul Colquhoun <newsposter@andor.dropbear.id.au> - 2018-04-27 18:01 +1000
            Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-04-28 12:32 +1200
              Re: Life on Europa in scifi? David Johnston <davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2018-04-27 20:06 -0600
              Re: Life on Europa in scifi? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2018-04-27 22:07 -0400
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-04-28 14:26 +1200
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2018-04-28 00:49 -0400
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2018-04-29 04:01 -0500
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2018-04-29 09:16 -0400
          Re: Life on Europa in scifi? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2018-04-27 22:05 -0400
            Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-04-28 14:28 +1200
              Re: Life on Europa in scifi? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2018-04-28 00:50 -0400
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-04-28 18:37 +1200
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? David Johnston <davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2018-04-28 01:05 -0600
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2018-04-28 09:25 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2018-04-28 19:13 +0000
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Paul Colquhoun <newsposter@andor.dropbear.id.au> - 2018-04-29 11:18 +1000
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-04-29 17:04 +1200
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2018-04-28 23:24 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-04-29 19:20 +1200
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? David Johnston <davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2018-04-29 01:43 -0600
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2018-04-29 10:21 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2018-04-29 18:11 +0000
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Cryptoengineer <treifamily@gmail.com> - 2018-04-29 18:57 -0500
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2018-04-29 20:18 -0400
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-04-30 14:19 +1200
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Paul Colquhoun <newsposter@andor.dropbear.id.au> - 2018-04-30 13:21 +1000
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-04-30 18:15 +1200
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2018-04-29 23:17 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2018-05-01 00:05 +0000
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> - 2018-05-01 15:33 +0000
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? mvp@web1.calweb.com (Mike Van Pelt) - 2018-05-01 19:00 +0000
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> - 2018-05-01 20:09 +0000
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2018-04-30 11:29 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2018-04-30 20:48 -0400
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2018-05-01 11:10 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2018-05-01 11:18 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2018-05-01 15:30 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-05-02 18:21 +1200
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Chris Buckley <alan@sabir.com> - 2018-05-02 12:09 +0000
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2018-05-02 07:45 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2018-05-02 19:16 -0400
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Greg Goss <gossg@gossg.org> - 2018-05-02 19:54 -0600
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2018-05-03 03:24 +0000
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-05-03 18:22 +1200
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2018-05-03 09:30 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-05-04 09:03 +1200
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? David Johnston <davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2018-05-03 15:17 -0600
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2018-05-03 14:52 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Paul Colquhoun <newsposter@andor.dropbear.id.au> - 2018-05-04 08:42 +1000
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2018-05-03 21:09 -0500
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2018-05-03 20:49 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-05-04 18:05 +1200
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2018-05-04 22:06 -0500
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2018-05-04 06:09 +0000
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-05-04 18:39 +1200
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2018-05-04 15:21 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-05-05 11:31 +1200
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? David Johnston <davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2018-05-04 18:56 -0600
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Titus G <noone@nowhere.com> - 2018-05-05 16:01 +1200
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2018-05-01 22:39 -0700
          Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2018-04-29 18:05 +0000
        Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Sjouke Burry <burrynulnulfour@ppllaanneett.nnll> - 2018-04-28 22:14 +0200
  Re: Life on Europa in scifi? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2018-04-29 12:39 -0400
    Re: Life on Europa in scifi? "Robert Clark" <rgregoryclark@gmSPAMBLOCKail.com> - 2018-05-28 07:19 -0400
      Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Fred J. McCall <fjmccall@gmail.com> - 2018-05-28 05:38 -0700
        Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Jeff Findley <jfindley@cinci.nospam.rr.com> - 2018-05-28 10:40 -0400
          Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Fred J. McCall <fjmccall@gmail.com> - 2018-05-28 11:36 -0700
            Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Jeff Findley <jfindley@cinci.nospam.rr.com> - 2018-05-29 06:19 -0400
              Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Fred J. McCall <fjmccall@gmail.com> - 2018-05-30 01:08 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Jeff Findley <jfindley@cinci.nospam.rr.com> - 2018-05-30 06:30 -0400
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Fred J. McCall <fjmccall@gmail.com> - 2018-05-30 15:00 -0700
      Re: Life on Europa in scifi? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2018-05-28 10:27 -0400
        Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Fred J. McCall <fjmccall@gmail.com> - 2018-05-28 11:30 -0700
          Re: Life on Europa in scifi? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2018-05-28 18:00 -0400
            Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Fred J. McCall <fjmccall@gmail.com> - 2018-05-28 23:39 -0700
              Re: Life on Europa in scifi? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2018-05-29 02:59 -0400
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Fred J. McCall <fjmccall@gmail.com> - 2018-05-29 03:07 -0700
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Alain Fournier <alain245@videotron.ca> - 2018-05-29 07:10 -0400
                Re: Life on Europa in scifi? Fred J. McCall <fjmccall@gmail.com> - 2018-05-30 01:11 -0700

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