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Groups > comp.lang.forth > #37736
| From | "Rod Pemberton" <bork@lllljunkqwer.cpm> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | comp.lang.forth |
| Subject | Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth |
| Date | 2015-03-29 16:23 -0400 |
| Organization | Aioe.org NNTP Server |
| Message-ID | <op.xv9z9vu6wa0t4m@localhost> (permalink) |
| References | (3 earlier) <med394$e5d$1@dont-email.me> <op.xvp3ihupwa0t4m@localhost> <mee5nb$9t5$1@dont-email.me> <op.xvr8qbmzwa0t4m@localhost> <mehf13$t2r$1@dont-email.me> |
On Fri, 20 Mar 2015 11:41:08 -0400, Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> wrote: > on 20/03/2015 06:09:38, "Rod Pemberton" wrote: >> On Thu, 19 Mar 2015 05:43:57 -0400, Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> > [snip] >> Yes, but the second set is expected to be used far less frequently. >> E.g., look at my post that lists Koopman's and Ertl's data. >> The first 15 or so (from Koopman and Ertl) are found to be much >> more common by both. The second 15 or so (from Ertl) are used far >> less frequently. I.e., with the balance of execution happening >> against the first wordset, the increased overhead is probably not >> as bad as perceived. > > This is a TTC or "token threaded code", which also requires a token for > every word, and that includes user defined words. How do you propose > supporting user defined words in your scheme? What exactly is token TTC here? ... Did you mean the Forths used Ertl's data or Koopman's data are TTC? ... Or, did you mean your mis-perceived understanding of what was said? We were discusing the minimal set of primitives to be used for Forth. ITC, DTC, TTC, and STC, is of no concern in regards to primitives. The primitives (or low-level Forth words) don't constitute the code which is interpreted by the Forth interpreter, where used. I.e., these primitives may appear to you to be tokens, since there is only a small quantity of them, but that doesn't make the Forth used TTC interpreter. The high-level words are what is interpreted by the interpreter, as ITC, DTC, and TTC, but there must still be a method to directly execute compiled assembly or high-level code in a non-Forth language. That's were these primitives come in. >>> Any encoding that uses regular bit patterns, such as the UTF example, >>> can be table decoded at exactly the same cost per nibble or byte. >> >> Is it any easier to implement than detecting one opcode? > > Since it's all done with trivial index table lookups, yes. The only > disadvantge of a UTF type encoding is the encoding overhead for a 4 bit > nibble. Bernd's suggestion of protobuf encoding with 1 bit overhead per > nibble results in a much more compact representation and a reduction in > the decoding overhead since there are fewer nibbles to process. FYI, a lookup takes far more computation and time than a branch. Decoding nybbles requires a small routine, even on x86 which has special instructions which do so. Rod Pemberton
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What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2015-03-17 12:47 -0700
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2015-03-17 22:29 +0100
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2015-03-18 10:59 +0000
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-03-18 12:04 +0100
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2015-03-18 11:19 +0000
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-03-18 12:39 +0100
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-03-18 08:05 -1000
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2015-03-18 18:34 +0000
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-03-18 20:05 +0100
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "Rod Pemberton" <buzz@notnotnontnooatno.cmm> - 2015-03-17 19:11 -0400
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "Rod Pemberton" <bork@lllljunkqwer.cpm> - 2015-03-19 00:28 -0400
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-03-20 01:00 -0400
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-03-18 11:33 +0100
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2015-03-18 22:15 +0100
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-03-19 07:53 +0100
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2015-03-19 17:17 -0700
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-03-20 01:01 -0400
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "Rod Pemberton" <bork@lllljunkqwer.cpm> - 2015-03-18 18:42 -0400
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "Alex McDonald" <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2015-03-18 23:56 +0000
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2015-03-19 02:46 +0100
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "Alex McDonald" <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2015-03-19 09:27 +0000
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "Rod Pemberton" <bork@lllljunkqwer.cpm> - 2015-03-18 22:21 -0400
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "Alex McDonald" <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2015-03-19 09:43 +0000
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "Rod Pemberton" <bork@lllljunkqwer.cpm> - 2015-03-20 02:09 -0400
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "Alex McDonald" <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2015-03-20 15:41 +0000
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "Rod Pemberton" <bork@lllljunkqwer.cpm> - 2015-03-29 16:23 -0400
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-03-29 16:43 -0400
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "Alex McDonald" <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2015-03-29 22:53 +0100
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-03-19 08:00 +0100
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "Rod Pemberton" <bork@lllljunkqwer.cpm> - 2015-03-20 02:09 -0400
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-03-20 14:43 +0100
...Tiny targets Matthias Koch <matthias.koch@hot.uni-hannover.de> - 2015-03-23 15:26 +0100
Re: ...Tiny targets Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-03-23 10:39 -0700
Re: ...Tiny targets JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2015-03-24 01:18 -0700
Re: ...Tiny targets Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-03-24 17:45 -0700
Re: ...Tiny targets JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2015-03-25 00:08 -0700
Re: ...Tiny targets Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-03-25 00:43 -0700
Re: ...Tiny targets Gary Bergstrom <forthprgrmr@gmail.com> - 2015-03-25 07:07 -0700
Re: ...Tiny targets Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-03-25 08:06 -0700
Re: ...Tiny targets rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-03-25 15:19 -0400
Re: ...Tiny targets Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-03-25 12:39 -0700
Re: ...Tiny targets Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2015-03-25 20:42 +0100
Re: ...Tiny targets rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-03-25 16:41 -0400
Re: ...Tiny targets hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2015-03-25 22:32 -0700
Re: ...Tiny targets "Alex McDonald" <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2015-03-26 09:35 +0000
Re: ...Tiny targets Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2015-03-26 14:52 +0200
Re: ...Tiny targets rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-03-27 16:12 -0400
Re: ...Tiny targets albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2015-03-26 13:00 +0000
Re: ...Tiny targets anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2015-03-26 11:58 +0000
Re: ...Tiny targets JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2015-03-25 07:10 -0700
Re: ...Tiny targets JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2015-03-25 07:16 -0700
Re: ...Tiny targets Matthias Koch <matthias.koch@hot.uni-hannover.de> - 2015-03-27 13:01 +0100
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth Gary Bergstrom <forthprgrmr@gmail.com> - 2015-03-18 06:45 -0700
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2015-03-18 08:57 -0700
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-03-18 20:09 +0100
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2015-03-18 08:59 -0700
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2015-03-20 21:47 -0700
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2015-03-21 02:30 -0700
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2015-03-21 17:52 -0700
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2015-03-22 01:27 -0700
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2015-03-22 13:15 -0700
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2015-03-22 13:47 -0700
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-03-22 18:39 -0400
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a (limping) Beginner's ANS Forth hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2015-03-22 16:32 -0700
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a(limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "WJ" <w_a_x_man@yahoo.com> - 2015-03-26 06:35 +0000
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a(limping) Beginner's ANS Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-03-27 15:55 -0400
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a(limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "Rod Pemberton" <bork@lllljunkqwer.cpm> - 2015-03-28 03:36 -0400
Re: What is the minimum Word set you could live with to have a(limping) Beginner's ANS Forth "WJ" <w_a_x_man@yahoo.com> - 2015-03-26 06:34 +0000
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