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Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language

From David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Newsgroups comp.lang.c
Subject Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language
Date 2016-07-28 14:03 +0200
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <nncsau$bbp$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References <nnb615$1h2k$1@gioia.aioe.org> <373211b1-a3c7-4b42-85d7-0862cc962b08@googlegroups.com> <nnbh76$kc$1@gioia.aioe.org> <20006afa-360c-4642-90d1-82f54ab020c2@googlegroups.com> <d1efdc92-0b98-4e49-baaa-821d1cf81815@googlegroups.com>

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On 28/07/16 03:03, Rick C. Hodgin wrote:
> On Wednesday, July 27, 2016 at 8:20:42 PM UTC-4, supe...@casperkitty.com wrote:
>> On Wednesday, July 27, 2016 at 6:48:00 PM UTC-5, jacob navia wrote:
>>> Le 28/07/2016 à 01:42, supercat écrit :
>>>> On Wednesday, July 27, 2016 at 3:37:07 PM UTC-5, jacob navia wrote:
>>>>> After two years in second place, C has finally edged out Java for the
>>>>> top spot. Staying in the top five, Python has swapped places with C++ to
>>>>> take the No. 3 position, and C# has fallen out of the top five to be
>>>>> replaced with R
>>>>
>>>> I wonder how that breaks down into the dialect favored by gcc, clang, et al.
>>>> versus dialects that support pointer-based type punning,
>>>
>>> ??? What's that???
>>>
>>> "pointer-based type punning (prunning maybe) ????
>>
>> On many historical or embedded compilers, if one has a pointer to an array
>> of uint8_t which is known to be 32-bit aligned, one can cast the pointer
>> to uint32_t* and then process elements four at a time and achieve a 4x
>> speed boost; on platforms which support uint64_t, if the array is known to
>> be 64-bit aligned, casting to uint64_t* and processing elements eight at a
>> time may offer an additional speed boost.
>>
>> Such code is not supported by gcc, however,
> 
> How is this not supported by gcc?  Or any C compiler through the cast?  

What he means is that in C, casting a uint16_t pointer to a uint32_t
pointer and using that to access the data is undefined behaviour
(assuming uint16_t is not the same type as unsigned char).  For some
reason, known only to himself, Supercat believes that older C standards
(pre C89, I think) /did/ allow this sort of thing.  He also believes
that many older compilers and embedded compilers also allow it.

As has been pointed out to him endless times, C has never defined this
behaviour.  Later C standards have clarified the situation a little, but
not changed it.

And while it is certainly true that many compilers will implement such
casts and accesses in the way that seems obvious, I don't know of any
that guarantee such behaviour.  Since it is something outside the C
standards, it would need a written note in the compiler's documentation
before you could be sure that it work.  I have read many compiler
reference manuals through the years, but don't remember ever having seen
such a statement.  Of course, a compiler can happily generate "obvious"
code for such casts without documenting it - but you should not rely on
that.


C provides methods for safely converting between pointer types, or
accessing data in different ways and of different sizes.  You can use
unions, memcpy, access through char pointers, volatile pointers, etc.
You can also simply the data in the original (known safe) size and hope
the compiler will optimise the code well enough (it is more important
that the code is correct than efficient).  And compilers may have
extensions that will help.

Unfortunately, there is no simple method that will generate the desired
effect and efficient code on a wide variety of compilers, targets, and
compiler options.  It would be nice if the standards provided a solution
here (such as a type qualifier "may_alias" allowing the creation of
special uint16_t or uint32_t pointers that can alias data of any type).
 But the standards don't have a solution here, and they never have had.


> And, even if the target address isnot 32-bit aligned, you can still
> access the data in 32-bit or 64-bit chunks (incurring the extra read 
> and write penalties associated if they are unaligned).

That /may/ be the case - but it may not be.  On many processors,
misaligned accesses cause hardware fault traps - they are simply not
supported.  On some, such as the x86, they are allowed for some
instructions but not others (in particular, some SIMD instructions
require aligned accesses).  And on many, the misaligned accesses can be
significantly slower than multiple explicit smaller accesses.

> 
> Algorithms like memcpy() and memmove() use a solution which moves the lead-
> in portion, the body, and the lead-out portion separately, so as to deal
> with fully aligned data for the bulk of the copy/move, and unaligned data
> movements only on the head and tail portions, and only if it's already not
> aligned.

That is often the case - but it depends on the implementation of these
functions.  These features make the functions faster for large copies,
but slower for small copies.  And compilers will sometimes inline a
locally generated version, especially if it knows the alignment and the
size of the copy.

> 
> Any algorithm written in C can exploit this ... so I must not be understanding
> your point above.
> 

Don't worry - you are not the only one who has trouble understanding
some of Supercat's points (or why he feels they need to be brought up in
every single thread).

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Thread

IEEE: C is the first programming language jacob navia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2016-07-27 22:36 +0200
  Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-27 16:42 -0700
    Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language jacob navia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2016-07-28 01:47 +0200
      Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-27 17:20 -0700
        Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-27 18:03 -0700
          Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-07-28 00:43 -0700
            Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-28 05:12 -0700
              Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-07-28 05:41 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-28 06:02 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-07-28 06:26 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-28 06:45 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-07-28 09:11 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-28 09:30 -0700
          Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-07-28 14:03 +0200
            Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-28 05:24 -0700
              Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-07-29 01:14 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-28 18:27 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-07-29 12:08 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-07-29 11:37 +0100
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-07-29 12:51 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2016-07-29 08:36 -0600
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-29 05:32 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-07-29 14:42 +0100
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-29 06:59 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-07-29 16:08 +0100
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-07-29 09:16 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-29 09:21 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-07-29 17:55 +0100
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-29 11:00 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-29 11:48 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-07-29 21:12 +0100
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-29 19:39 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language luser droog <luser.droog@gmail.com> - 2016-07-29 14:56 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-29 08:54 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-01 10:30 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-29 08:13 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2016-07-31 12:18 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-29 07:34 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-29 14:10 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-07-29 23:36 +0100
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-29 16:04 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-07-30 11:22 +1200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-07-30 01:09 +0100
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-01 08:08 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-08-01 21:16 +0100
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-01 22:13 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-08-02 13:33 +0100
            Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-28 08:11 -0700
          Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-28 07:36 -0700
            Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-28 07:51 -0700
              Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-28 08:19 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-28 10:18 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-28 11:16 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-28 11:49 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-28 12:37 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-28 13:15 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-28 14:05 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-07-28 15:53 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-28 18:03 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-29 10:50 -0700
      Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2016-07-28 10:50 +0200
        Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2016-07-28 08:11 -0500
        Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-28 07:46 -0700
          Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2016-07-28 16:50 +0200
            Re: Setting architectural features in stone Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2016-08-01 11:18 +0200
              Re: Setting architectural features in stone supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-01 05:37 -0700
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-08-01 14:02 +0100
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-01 07:05 -0700
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-08-01 16:04 +0100
              Re: Setting architectural features in stone Ivan Godard <ivan@millcomputing.com> - 2016-08-01 09:26 -0700
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-01 10:12 -0700
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-08-01 10:21 -0700
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-01 11:01 -0700
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-08-01 11:44 -0700
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2016-08-02 12:05 +0200
              Re: Setting architectural features in stone anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-08-01 15:48 +0000
              Re: Setting architectural features in stone Walter Banks <walter@bytecraft.com> - 2016-08-02 20:09 -0400
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-08-03 06:42 +0000
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-08-03 11:02 +0100
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone Ivan Godard <ivan@millcomputing.com> - 2016-08-03 03:15 -0700
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-08-03 11:53 +0000
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-03 08:57 -0700
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2016-08-03 10:52 +0200
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-08-03 11:09 +0100
                Re: Setting architectural features in stone Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-08-03 08:51 -0700
          Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-08-01 10:51 +0100
            Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2016-08-01 13:13 +0200
            Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-01 05:27 -0700
          Setting architectural features in stone Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2016-08-01 10:00 -0700
            Re: Setting architectural features in stone anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-08-02 10:29 +0000
          Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-01 16:29 -0400
            Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-01 15:53 -0700
              Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-04 16:37 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-04 16:07 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-04 20:38 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-08-04 23:52 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-05 13:00 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-08-06 03:12 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-06 21:48 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-08-06 20:07 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-07 10:03 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-05 13:09 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-05 13:38 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-05 11:24 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-05 15:28 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-08-06 08:25 +1200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-05 16:36 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-08-06 08:41 +1200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-05 16:45 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-08-06 09:41 +1200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-05 19:45 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-08-06 09:47 +1200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Gareth Owen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2016-08-06 16:11 +0100
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-06 21:50 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-08-06 19:12 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-06 22:38 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Gareth Owen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2016-08-07 14:06 +0100
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-07 10:04 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-07 17:27 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Gareth Owen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2016-08-07 20:24 +0100
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-07 21:30 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-07 17:03 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-07 21:36 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-08-08 15:11 +1200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-08 09:02 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-08-09 07:35 +1200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "James R. Kuyper" <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2016-08-08 16:00 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-08-09 08:07 +1200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Gareth Owen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2016-08-08 21:22 +0100
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-09 11:08 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language jameskuyper@verizon.net - 2016-08-08 13:39 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-09 11:54 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-09 08:50 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-09 15:19 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language already5chosen@yahoo.com - 2016-08-09 09:14 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-09 19:22 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2016-08-09 11:12 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2016-08-09 15:25 +0000
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-09 19:50 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-08 16:44 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-08-09 17:38 +1200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-09 08:51 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-09 20:06 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-09 11:57 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-09 08:51 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-08 12:15 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-08-08 11:57 +0100
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-08-08 23:04 +1200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-08 15:20 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-08 09:27 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-08 09:21 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-08 17:33 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-08 14:35 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-08-05 14:06 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-05 14:37 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-07 13:53 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Gareth Owen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2016-08-07 14:09 +0100
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-07 10:08 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-07 17:34 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-07 21:37 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-08-07 19:18 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-08-08 12:31 +0200
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-08-08 03:55 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-08 08:28 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-08-08 09:44 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-08 10:13 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-05 07:51 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-05 13:39 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-05 11:27 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-05 15:29 -0400
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-05 08:38 -0700
                Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-08-05 13:40 -0400
        Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2016-07-28 21:27 +0200
          Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-07-29 00:19 +0200
          Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2016-08-01 11:49 +0200
      Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2016-07-28 10:01 +0000
    Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com> - 2016-07-28 01:57 -0500
      Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-28 07:27 -0700
        Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-07-28 09:06 -0700
          Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-07-28 09:39 -0700
            Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-07-28 11:56 -0700
              Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Lew Pitcher <lew.pitcher@digitalfreehold.ca> - 2016-07-28 15:19 -0400
        Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2016-07-31 12:15 -0700
          Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-01 05:25 -0700
            Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2016-08-01 07:37 -0700
              Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-01 08:21 -0700
  Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-07-27 17:17 -0700
  Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2016-07-28 14:17 +0200
    Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2016-07-28 18:43 +0200
      Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2016-07-28 18:58 +0200
  Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2016-07-31 21:46 +0200
    Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-08-01 16:37 +1200
    Re: IEEE: C is the first programming language supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-08-01 07:20 -0700

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