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Groups > rec.arts.sf.written > #424668
| From | Wayne Brown <fwbrown@bellsouth.net> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | rec.arts.sf.written |
| Subject | Re: Can anyone remember...? |
| Date | 2015-10-13 16:15 +0000 |
| Organization | A noiseless patient Spider |
| Message-ID | <mvjamg$i1b$1@dont-email.me> (permalink) |
| References | (4 earlier) <nvMpww.L4n@kithrup.com> <XnsA527E5DE3DE18taustingmail@69.16.179.43> <fa2213b2-99a8-4cc3-917c-6fcb1599d6df@googlegroups.com> <mup4hq$n47$1@dont-email.me> <561057da$0$1632$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net> |
On Sat, 03 Oct 2015 17:34:01 in article <561057da$0$1632$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net> Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> wrote:
> On 10/3/2015 10:52 AM, William Vetter wrote:
>> nuny@bid.nes wrote:
>>> On Friday, October 2, 2015 at 10:35:48 PM UTC-7, Gutless Umbrella
>>> Carrying Sissy wrote:
>>>> djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) wrote in
>>>> news:nvMpww.L4n@kithrup.com:
>>>>> In article <mungof$da1$1@dont-email.me>,
>>>>> William Vetter <mdhangton@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>>>>>> In article <XnsA527A3CE39C94taustingmail@69.16.179.43>,
>>>>>>> Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Interesting note: in wargames that involve both civilian and
>>>>>>>> military leadership, in which a political crisis is simulated
>>>>>>>> that could conceivably lead to nuclear war, the military
>>>>>>>> commanders _never_ fire their nukes, even in response to the
>>>>>>>> other side doing so. And the civilian commanders _always_ do
>>>>>>>> so, even with other clear paths to resolve the crisis being
>>>>>>>> available.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Interesting. Considering the one time when nukes might have
>>>>>>> been used after 1945.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It was the Korean War; it wasn't getting anywhere; General
>>>>>>> MacArthur wanted to nuke Beijing. Truman forbade it. MacArthur
>>>>>>> told everyone what a stupid President Truman was, he
>>>>>>> didn't understand military matters. Truman recalled him.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I was in fourth grade, and the teacher told us all to remember
>>>>>>> when "General MacArthur came home. You can say, I was in
>>>>>>> fourth grade."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They made it as easy on him as possible, under the
>>>>>>> circumstances, and he made a speech to Congress: "They say old
>>>>>>> soldiers never die, they just fade away; I am an old soldier,
>>>>>>> and now I shall fade away."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But, in that one instance when nukes *might* have been used,
>>>>>>> it was the military man who wanted to use them, and the
>>>>>>> lifelong civilian who wouldn't let him.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No, there was talk about the US using tacnukes on behalf of the
>>>>>> French at the battle of Dien Bien Phu.
>>>>>
>>>>> There may have been talk. Nobody used them.
>>>>>
>>>>> In similar fashion, poison gas was used in WWI and prepared
>>>>> against during WWII ... but nobody ever actually used it. They
>>>>> had learned that gas had an unpleasant habit of following a
>>>>> change in the wind and poisoning your own troops, not the
>>>>> enemy's.
>>>>>
>>>> And was dangerous to handle when not in actual use, and really pissed
>>>> off the enemy, and a variety of other reasons aginst it.
>>>>
>>>> The Nazis made, literally, tons of chlorine triflouride at one point,
>>>> to use as both a weapon and a rocket fuel. But the stuff is so
>>>> dangerous, and a better oxidizer than pure oxygen[1], that they
>>>> decided that wasn't a good idea.
>>>>
>>>> [1]If you spill it in your lab, whatever you spill it on, including
>>>> the concrete floor, will catch on fire. If you grab your handy bucket
>>>> of sand (no chem lab is complete without several) and dump that on
>>>> it, the sand will catch on fire. If you douse it with water, the
>>>> water will catch on fire. If you scoop it into a vacuum chamber and
>>>> smother it in asbestos, the asbestos will catch on fire _in the
>>>> absence of any atmostphere at all_. There is no known way to
>>>> extinguish it. And the main byproducts of it reacting with stuff is
>>>> chlorine and fluorine gas. (And it's not *nearly* as dangerous as
>>>> dioxygen diflouride, which causes ice to catch on fire at 270 degrees
>>>> below zero.)
>>>
>>> And then there's the appropriately named FOOF. This guy details
>>> those and other truly terrifying chemicals:
>>>
>>> http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/things_i_wont_work_with/
>>>
>>> It's the sort of stuff some hard SF author ought to use, but editors
>>> would probably not believe it.
>>>
>> You can't use something that predetonates as a weapon.
>
> But if the author told the editor it was so explosive that just thinking
> about making it caused the ingredients to detonate, it might work for
> some stories. :)
It worked for Alfred Bester.
--
F. Wayne Brown <fwbrown@bellsouth.net>
ur sag9-ga ur-tur-še3 ba-an-kur9
"A dog that is played with turns into a puppy." (Sumerian proverb)
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Can anyone remember...? Ronald Bruck <rbruck@gmail.com> - 2015-09-29 17:53 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-09-30 01:31 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Adamastor Glace Mortimer <nospam@no.invalid> - 2015-10-02 18:09 +0200
Re: Can anyone remember...? wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2015-10-02 16:24 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? Steve Coltrin <spcoltri@omcl.org> - 2015-10-02 14:43 -0600
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-02 22:17 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <seawasp@sgeinc.invalid.com> - 2015-10-02 18:56 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2015-10-02 20:36 -0500
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2015-10-02 16:06 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-03 02:24 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? William Vetter <mdhangton@gmail.com> - 2015-10-02 23:08 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-03 05:29 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2015-10-02 22:35 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? "nuny@bid.nes" <Alien8752@gmail.com> - 2015-10-02 23:19 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? BCFD36 <bcfd36@cruzio.com> - 2015-10-02 23:38 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Kay Shapero <kay@invalid.net> - 2015-10-03 00:23 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? "Brian M. Scott" <b.scott@csuohio.edu> - 2015-10-03 10:09 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? lal_truckee <lal_truckee@yahoo.com> - 2015-10-03 08:59 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 14:39 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-03 21:49 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? "nuny@bid.nes" <Alien8752@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 22:53 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-04 13:16 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? "nuny@bid.nes" <Alien8752@gmail.com> - 2015-10-04 09:59 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? BCFD36 <bcfd36@cruzio.com> - 2015-10-04 13:30 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-04 21:41 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2015-10-04 15:10 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? "Raymond Daley" <raymond.daley@ntlworld.com> - 2015-10-07 14:50 +0100
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-07 13:58 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? petertrei@gmail.com - 2015-10-07 07:21 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-08 04:36 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? petertrei@gmail.com - 2015-10-08 07:40 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2015-10-07 18:20 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? BCFD36 <bcfd36@cruzio.com> - 2015-10-08 00:22 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> - 2015-10-08 02:55 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? "John F. Eldredge" <john@jfeldredge.com> - 2015-10-09 02:03 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2015-10-09 19:38 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2015-10-10 08:17 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2015-10-07 23:15 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-08 04:41 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? BCFD36 <bcfd36@cruzio.com> - 2015-10-08 00:29 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2015-10-08 08:24 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? petertrei@gmail.com - 2015-10-08 07:31 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? BCFD36 <bcfd36@cruzio.com> - 2015-10-08 00:19 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Walter Bushell <proto@panix.com> - 2015-10-19 18:26 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? William Vetter <mdhangton@gmail.com> - 2015-10-04 16:49 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? "nuny@bid.nes" <Alien8752@gmail.com> - 2015-10-05 13:24 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? William Vetter <mdhangton@gmail.com> - 2015-10-05 17:53 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-04 21:37 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2015-10-04 10:45 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? William Vetter <mdhangton@gmail.com> - 2015-10-05 15:47 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? Walter Bushell <proto@panix.com> - 2015-10-19 17:57 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2015-10-04 06:53 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <seawasp@sgeinc.invalid.com> - 2015-10-04 09:25 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? BCFD36 <bcfd36@cruzio.com> - 2015-10-04 13:32 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2015-10-04 10:52 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? leif.roar@dimnakorr.com - 2015-10-04 21:58 -0500
Re: Can anyone remember...? ted@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan) - 2015-10-05 03:15 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2015-10-05 00:10 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2015-10-05 05:31 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2015-10-06 19:48 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2015-10-06 21:54 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2015-10-07 09:27 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-10-07 11:50 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2015-10-07 13:49 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? William Vetter <mdhangton@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 13:52 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-03 19:10 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2015-10-05 08:14 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 14:41 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Walter Bushell <proto@panix.com> - 2015-10-19 18:37 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2015-10-03 15:34 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? William Vetter <mdhangton@gmail.com> - 2015-10-04 02:38 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2015-10-04 03:38 -0500
Re: Can anyone remember...? wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2015-10-04 06:26 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-04 13:19 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? jgd@cix.co.uk (John Dallman) - 2015-10-04 15:26 +0100
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-04 16:20 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? "Brian M. Scott" <b.scott@csuohio.edu> - 2015-10-04 10:46 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2015-10-05 04:30 -0500
Re: Can anyone remember...? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2015-10-04 08:26 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? "Brian M. Scott" <b.scott@csuohio.edu> - 2015-10-04 12:54 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2015-10-04 13:49 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? BCFD36 <bcfd36@cruzio.com> - 2015-10-04 13:37 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-04 21:43 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2015-10-04 18:12 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-04 22:06 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2015-10-04 15:08 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Steve Coltrin <spcoltri@omcl.org> - 2015-10-05 17:18 -0600
Re: Can anyone remember...? wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2015-10-07 07:53 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2015-10-06 20:11 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Greg Goss <gossg@gossg.org> - 2015-10-07 04:26 -0600
Re: Can anyone remember...? Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> - 2015-10-04 15:38 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Wayne Brown <fwbrown@bellsouth.net> - 2015-10-13 16:15 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 14:38 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <seawasp@sgeinc.invalid.com> - 2015-10-03 09:09 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? William Vetter <mdhangton@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 13:54 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? Don Bruder <dakidd@sonic.net> - 2015-10-03 11:24 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? William Vetter <mdhangton@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 14:35 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 17:27 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2015-10-02 22:28 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-03 14:47 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 14:45 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2015-10-04 07:22 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-04 13:20 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2015-10-04 13:51 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-04 21:54 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? news{@bestley.co.uk (Mark Bestley) - 2015-10-05 11:38 +0100
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-05 11:56 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-05 14:35 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? "Michael R N Dolbear" <me@privacy.net> - 2015-10-05 23:08 +0100
Re: Can anyone remember...? Butch Malahide <fred.galvin@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 01:03 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2015-10-03 09:39 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-03 16:59 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 16:49 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 14:42 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-03 21:51 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2015-10-03 15:32 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? patmpowers@gmail.com - 2015-10-05 08:38 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 16:48 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? ted@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan) - 2015-10-03 22:29 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? patmpowers@gmail.com - 2015-10-03 06:31 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-03 14:57 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Lawrence Watt-Evans <lwe@sff.net> - 2015-10-03 16:19 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 18:50 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 19:14 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? - Slight thread drift BCFD36 <bcfd36@cruzio.com> - 2015-10-04 13:54 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Wayne Brown <fwbrown@bellsouth.net> - 2015-10-13 16:15 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2015-10-13 10:33 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2015-10-13 13:25 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2015-10-13 17:57 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? patmpowers@gmail.com - 2015-10-05 08:45 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-10-05 11:54 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Greg Goss <gossg@gossg.org> - 2015-10-06 01:10 -0600
Re: Can anyone remember...? "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2015-10-02 22:30 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? Kay Shapero <kay@invalid.net> - 2015-10-03 00:30 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2015-10-03 06:53 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> - 2015-10-03 14:37 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2015-10-04 06:34 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? Magewolf <Magewolf@nc.rr.com> - 2015-10-04 15:04 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-04 21:57 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Greg Goss <gossg@gossg.org> - 2015-10-02 23:58 -0600
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-03 15:08 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Greg Goss <gossg@gossg.org> - 2015-10-02 23:52 -0600
Re: Can anyone remember...? djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2015-10-03 15:10 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? patmpowers@gmail.com - 2015-10-05 08:34 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Stumpy <perilmung@spamnet.con> - 2015-09-29 19:07 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Greg Goss <gossg@gossg.org> - 2015-09-30 13:42 -0600
Re: Can anyone remember...? goldfarb@ocf.berkeley.edu (David Goldfarb) - 2015-10-01 03:25 +0000
Re: Can anyone remember...? Butch Malahide <fred.galvin@gmail.com> - 2015-09-29 19:22 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2015-09-29 23:03 -0400
Re: Can anyone remember...? David Johnston <David@block.net> - 2015-09-29 21:15 -0600
Re: Can anyone remember...? Don Bruder <dakidd@sonic.net> - 2015-09-29 22:20 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2015-09-30 13:46 -0700
Re: Can anyone remember...? "John F. Eldredge" <john@jfeldredge.com> - 2015-10-03 16:39 +0000
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