Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!)

From	Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.c
Subject	Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!)
Date	2012-06-13 17:45 -0500
Organization	A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID	<jrb513$l2p$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References	(3 earlier) <jr5brl$i6r$1@dont-email.me> <jr879k$5re$1@reader1.panix.com> <17727bd2-6115-4844-8ebc-5079fac79b17@googlegroups.com> <jrajii$tan$5@dont-email.me> <4FD8D940.7010700@verizon.net>

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James Kuyper wrote:
> On 06/13/2012 01:47 PM, Les Cargill wrote:
>> nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, June 12, 2012 9:03:00 PM UTC+1, Joe keane wrote:
>>>> In article <jr5brl$i6r$1@dont-email.me>, BartC <bc@freeuk.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Have a look at the OP's original code: the one with gotos, and the one
>>>>> without. The latter especially is quite long-winded, and likely to be more
>>>>> error-prone that something a lot shorter.
>>>>
>>>> I think we're violently in agreement here: trying to make code
>>>> goto-free, because 'all gotos are evil', results in code that is more
>>>> bulky and more error-prone.
>>>
>>> you may be in agreement but many posters on this thread are not.
>>> (just when did "evil" become a fashionable word to use in programming? And why?)
>>>
>>
>> When people stopped thinking about it. Any use of the word "evil" is a
>> signal that the speaker has stopped thinking about it.
>
> You just used that word. :-)
>

AHHHHH! OH NOOOOOOO! :) < falls off the Bridge of Death >

> There's nothing wrong with stopping thinking about something, so long as
> you've completed your thinking about it, and have moved on to thinking
> about something else. I think perhaps you intended to say something like
> "... has not given sufficient thought to it."

Probably. I meant more like "let's just round it up to evil". Either
that, or I wanted it to be one of those pithy Malcolm Gladwell style
aphorisms.

> If so, I would disagree - I think it's perfectly possible to give
> sufficient thought to something, and come to the conclusion that it can
> be described as "evil". It's a normative judgement, and as such
> inherently subjective, but no more or less so than "good".
>

Anything that is commonly described as evil usually has a more or less
reasonable explanation behind it. Simply declaring it beyond 
understanding is, in my opinion, just not wanting to do your homework.

Granted, sometimes the homework is simply insurmountable. But it would
be, in my opinion, more honest to just say that.

If I had to just mark, say, the Dred Scott decision as simply
evil, I'd lose out on a lot of detail.

So it's a useful rule of thumb to me anyway.

--
Les Cargill

Thread

Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-29 22:44 -0700
  Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Ike Naar <ike@sverige.freeshell.org> - 2012-05-30 06:38 +0000
  Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Nils M Holm <news2009@t3x.org> - 2012-05-30 06:57 +0000
  Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2012-05-30 00:52 -0700
    Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-30 01:50 -0700
  Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. MarkBluemel <mark_bluemel@pobox.com> - 2012-05-30 09:55 +0100
    Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Willem <willem@toad.stack.nl> - 2012-05-30 09:18 +0000
      Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. tom st denis <tom@iahu.ca> - 2012-05-30 05:16 -0700
        Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Willem <willem@toad.stack.nl> - 2012-05-30 16:26 +0000
          Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. tom st denis <tom@iahu.ca> - 2012-06-01 08:05 -0700
            Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Willem <willem@toad.stack.nl> - 2012-06-03 11:24 +0000
          Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. jgk@panix.com (Joe keane) - 2012-06-02 13:54 +0000
            Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Jean-Christophe <5.d@free.fr> - 2012-06-02 07:24 -0700
              Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. jgk@panix.com (Joe keane) - 2012-06-02 16:37 +0000
                Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Jean-Christophe <5.d@free.fr> - 2012-06-02 12:46 -0700
            Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-06-02 15:42 +0100
              Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. jgk@panix.com (Joe keane) - 2012-06-02 19:35 +0000
                Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-06-03 03:53 +0100
                Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Phil Carmody <thefatphil_demunged@yahoo.co.uk> - 2012-06-11 18:10 +0300
                Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-06-11 16:19 +0100
            Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Martin Shobe <martin.shobe@yahoo.com> - 2012-06-02 19:27 +0000
              Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. jgk@panix.com (Joe keane) - 2012-06-03 23:48 +0000
                Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2012-06-04 11:53 +1200
                Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Martin Shobe <martin.shobe@yahoo.com> - 2012-06-04 03:32 +0000
    Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com - 2012-05-30 07:25 -0700
    Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. falk@rahul.net (Edward A. Falk) - 2012-06-05 07:20 +0000
  Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2012-05-30 21:50 +1200
    Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2012-05-30 03:34 -0700
      Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2012-05-30 22:57 +1200
      Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Willem <willem@toad.stack.nl> - 2012-05-30 11:04 +0000
      Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com - 2012-05-30 04:53 -0700
  Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2012-05-30 13:28 +0100
    Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-30 13:57 -0700
  Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2012-05-30 15:19 +0200
    Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Mark Bluemel <mark.bluemel@googlemail.com> - 2012-05-31 01:10 -0700
    Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2012-06-02 17:34 +0200
      Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2012-06-03 10:33 +0200
  Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Ike Naar <ike@iceland.freeshell.org> - 2012-05-30 13:56 +0000
    Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Kulin <remailer@reece.net.au> - 2012-05-30 17:29 +0000
  Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. ImpalerCore <jadill33@gmail.com> - 2012-05-30 07:13 -0700
    Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Thad Smith <ThadSmith@acm.org> - 2012-06-02 07:20 -0600
  Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-05-30 16:37 +0100
  Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Johann Klammer <klammerj@NOSPAM.a1.net> - 2012-05-30 19:05 +0200
  Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2012-05-31 13:19 -0700
    Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-31 13:49 -0700
      Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2012-05-31 22:08 +0100
        Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-31 16:08 -0700
      Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2012-05-31 17:34 -0700
      Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. Willem <willem@toad.stack.nl> - 2012-06-01 07:40 +0000
  GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-31 16:39 -0700
    Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-06-01 03:21 +0100
      Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-06-01 03:49 -0700
        Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-06-02 02:15 +0100
          Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-06-01 19:45 -0700
            Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-06-02 15:00 +0100
              Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-06-02 16:44 -0700
                Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-06-03 03:51 +0100
      Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! "Aaron W.  Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-06-01 12:06 -0400
        Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-06-02 02:01 +0100
          Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-06-01 19:46 -0700
            Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-06-01 21:19 -0700
              Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! blmblm@myrealbox.com <blmblm.myrealbox@gmail.com> - 2012-06-02 16:35 +0000
            Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-06-02 14:50 +0100
            Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2012-06-02 07:04 -0700
          Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! "Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-06-02 04:37 -0500
            Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-06-02 03:40 -0700
              Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-06-02 14:46 +0100
                Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2012-06-02 17:10 +0100
                Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2012-06-02 11:35 -0500
    Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2012-06-02 09:46 +0100
      Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2012-06-03 10:43 +0200
        Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2012-06-03 10:58 +0100
          Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2012-06-03 17:18 +0200
          Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) jgk@panix.com (Joe keane) - 2012-06-04 20:40 +0000
            Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) jgk@panix.com (Joe keane) - 2012-06-05 01:03 +0000
              Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2012-06-04 21:36 -0600
                Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! jgk@panix.com (Joe keane) - 2012-06-05 15:13 +0000
              Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) Ike Naar <ike@sverige.freeshell.org> - 2012-06-05 08:12 +0000
                Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-06-05 06:00 -0400
            Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) jgk@panix.com (Joe keane) - 2012-06-05 02:05 +0000
              Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) Martin Shobe <martin.shobe@yahoo.com> - 2012-06-05 03:16 +0000
        Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2012-06-03 17:30 +0200
          Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) Jean-Christophe <5.d@free.fr> - 2012-06-03 09:02 -0700
            Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-06-03 22:37 +0100
              Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) Ike Naar <ike@iceland.freeshell.org> - 2012-06-04 07:28 +0000
              Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program! (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2012-06-08 01:28 -0700
    Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-06-06 02:54 -0700
      Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-06-06 13:14 +0100
        Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) pete <pfiland@mindspring.com> - 2012-06-06 09:22 -0400
          Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Willem <willem@toad.stack.nl> - 2012-06-06 13:49 +0000
            Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-06-06 14:56 +0100
            Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-06-06 10:17 -0400
      Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Angel <angel+news@spamcop.net> - 2012-06-06 13:06 +0000
        Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-06-07 16:26 -0700
          Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Angel <angel+news@spamcop.net> - 2012-06-08 14:26 +0000
            Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-06-08 15:19 -0700
              Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Angel <angel+news@spamcop.net> - 2012-06-08 23:32 +0000
              Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2012-06-09 01:14 +0100
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Jean-Christophe <5.d@free.fr> - 2012-06-09 04:36 -0700
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2012-06-09 05:54 -0700
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2012-06-09 16:12 +0100
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2012-06-09 08:44 -0700
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2012-06-10 18:23 +0200
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2012-06-10 19:42 +0200
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2012-06-14 18:00 +0200
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com - 2012-06-11 01:14 -0700
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2012-06-12 08:01 +0200
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com - 2012-06-12 05:27 -0700
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2012-06-12 08:44 +0200
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) jgk@panix.com (Joe keane) - 2012-06-11 17:24 +0000
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2012-06-11 19:02 +0100
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) jgk@panix.com (Joe keane) - 2012-06-12 20:03 +0000
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com - 2012-06-13 00:58 -0700
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-06-13 06:37 -0400
                Evil in Programming   Was: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com - 2012-06-13 04:50 -0700
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) gwowen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2012-06-13 07:02 -0700
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com> - 2012-06-13 12:47 -0500
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-06-13 14:17 -0400
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Willem <willem@toad.stack.nl> - 2012-06-13 19:44 +0000
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-06-13 15:52 -0400
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com> - 2012-06-13 17:45 -0500
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-06-13 19:07 -0400
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) jgk@panix.com (Joe keane) - 2012-06-14 23:03 +0000
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2012-06-14 23:25 +0000
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com> - 2012-06-14 19:25 -0500
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) 88888 Dihedral <dihedral88888@googlemail.com> - 2012-06-17 20:32 -0700
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com - 2012-06-18 01:30 -0700
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com> - 2012-06-18 07:06 -0500
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? Gareth Owen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2012-06-13 19:57 +0100
                Re: Why was there a GOTO? (was Re: GOTOs discovered in "real world" program!) jgk@panix.com (Joe keane) - 2012-06-10 16:56 +0000
  Another problem (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) mike3 <mike4ty4@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-31 16:46 -0700
    Re: Another problem (was Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc.) Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2012-06-01 15:55 +1200
  Re: Error returns and repeated code, GOTOs, etc. gwowen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2012-06-06 08:12 -0700

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