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| From | jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | comp.lang.c |
| Subject | Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development |
| Date | 2011-12-11 01:57 +0100 |
| Organization | lccwin |
| Message-ID | <jc0v5h$5ae$1@speranza.aioe.org> (permalink) |
| References | (3 earlier) <4932c22a-41ad-4a4e-89dc-19adb2999327@g7g2000vbd.googlegroups.com> <slrnjbv2be.24po.usenet-nospam@guild.seebs.net> <4837eb1a-f82a-4c69-832d-d09ac24468c7@z17g2000vbe.googlegroups.com> <slrnje7ikc.2dt8.usenet-nospam@guild.seebs.net> <ef80b479-2bc5-4221-9045-10acb6a07070@c18g2000yqj.googlegroups.com> |
Le 11/12/11 00:10, James Harris a écrit :
>
> I have an answer to the original question: despite some negatives such
> as its size gcc appears to be the closest fit to what I was looking
> for. However, I have found that trying to work with it tends to
> constrain the design. I keep finding I am making the design fit the
> compiler. So for the time being I am sticking with assembler. Once the
> design is stable I will look at interfacing to HLLs and compilers.
Gcc is too big for what you want. You need a compiler that you can
possibly understand or have someone that can help you out with a
question, etc.
There are (maybe) 10-20 people in the world that have a very detailed
knowledge of gcc in all its complexity.
Once I needed to interface my code with gcc, and needed to know
how the exception handling is implemented in gcc, specially in
C++/Linux.
It took me 5-6 MONTHS.
o Wrong documentation or inexsiting documentation. I used the
specs of the ABI only to find out that gcc doesn't implement
all of it and "enhances" most of the implementation. When
asking questions I always got the same answer:
You have the source!
Huge files implement that part, without a single comment in them
besides the GNU copyright stuff. Yes; just understand something
in there.
o I asked the guy that knew the stuff (working at RedHat). He told
me I would have to buy a RedHat maintenance contract for support
for a year: US$ 25,000.
o Bad design. For instance, you write in the assembler
.byte 0x38
and expect (naively) that the corresponding value will
appear in the object file. No, it doesn't.
When I filed a bug report, they told me that for certain
sections, the assembler "optimizes" the writing of the
values and ignores some. Great.
o There is NO WAY you will be able to understand gcc enough
to make any modifications to it unless you spend several
years working. You understimate badly the problem.
I tried to fix a bug, some time ago. Floating point stdcall
functions under windows would crash... bad code was generated.
I worked for 2 weeks before giving up. Try understanding their
"RTL" then the different structures and hacks, etc. You will
get nowhere, and you will never be able to modify anything.
You can verify this. Just TRY to modify a minimal thing.
Of course I am biased. But you will be able to verify all I am saying.
Just try to make a trivial modification within gcc, say for instance
you want to use in your os always a stdcall calling convention and
instead of returning with
ret
you always
ret $n
where n is the number of words in the stack pushed by the caller.
Have fun!
jacob
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Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-11-12 01:22 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-11-12 10:36 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-11-12 02:09 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-11-12 11:37 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-11-12 08:02 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Borax Man <rotflol2@hotmail.com> - 2011-11-13 10:24 +1100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-11-13 10:29 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2011-11-12 15:06 -0700
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development "ankh" <star67@venus.gov> - 2011-11-12 22:43 -0600
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-11-14 21:57 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2011-11-15 10:16 +1300
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development "Jo" <none@none.none> - 2011-11-19 22:59 -0600
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-11-20 12:58 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Fritz Wuehler <fritz@spamexpire-201111.rodent.frell.theremailer.net> - 2011-11-21 07:30 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development "Jo" <none@none.none> - 2011-11-21 01:01 -0600
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development "Jo" <none@none.none> - 2011-11-21 00:51 -0600
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Brian <nospam@nospam.com> - 2011-11-22 16:47 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-11-22 12:10 -0500
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-11-22 20:24 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Richard Sanders <lnr729@gmail.com> - 2011-11-22 10:58 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2011-11-24 00:27 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-11-22 20:13 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-11-23 23:13 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Friedrich Dominicus <just-for-news-frido@q-software-solutions.de> - 2011-11-23 06:28 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2011-11-23 02:45 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Willem <willem@toad.stack.nl> - 2011-11-23 10:57 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2011-11-24 01:31 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-11-23 10:58 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2011-11-24 00:26 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2011-11-14 01:33 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-11-14 17:13 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Joe Wright <joewwright@comcast.net> - 2011-11-14 14:36 -0500
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2011-11-15 00:56 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Nobody <nobody@nowhere.com> - 2011-11-13 02:59 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Joe Wright <joewwright@comcast.net> - 2011-11-12 22:13 -0500
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development "ankh" <star67@venus.gov> - 2011-11-13 00:03 -0600
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-11-14 21:55 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2011-11-15 00:56 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development ImpalerCore <jadill33@gmail.com> - 2011-11-15 07:05 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-11-15 14:42 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-11-16 00:17 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development ImpalerCore <jadill33@gmail.com> - 2011-11-15 17:50 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2011-11-12 20:38 -0700
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-11-13 00:00 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2011-11-13 01:23 -0700
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-11-13 09:10 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-11-13 10:33 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2011-11-13 23:03 +1300
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-11-13 11:17 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-10 11:29 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2011-12-11 09:57 +1300
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-10 14:26 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2011-12-11 11:38 +1300
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-10 16:01 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2011-12-11 13:18 +1300
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2011-12-10 22:50 -0600
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-12 11:25 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-12-11 03:45 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-12 12:06 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-12-12 20:02 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development John Tsiombikas <nuclear@member.fsf.org> - 2011-12-13 06:28 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2011-12-13 00:32 -0600
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-12-13 10:57 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-12-10 23:20 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-12 12:38 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-12-12 20:15 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-12 13:51 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-12-12 22:32 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development John Tsiombikas <nuclear@member.fsf.org> - 2011-12-13 06:40 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-12-13 09:19 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-17 00:52 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-14 13:00 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-12-14 21:53 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2011-12-15 11:18 +1300
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-15 11:16 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-12-15 19:35 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-15 13:03 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2011-12-16 03:55 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-12-16 19:50 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2011-12-12 16:54 -0600
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2011-12-13 12:03 +1300
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2011-12-12 17:19 -0600
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-15 11:52 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-12-12 18:34 -0500
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-12-13 09:43 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-15 11:33 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-12-10 21:13 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-10 15:10 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-12-10 23:31 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-12-11 01:57 +0100
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-12 11:46 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-12-12 15:23 -0500
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-12-12 20:02 +0000
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-12 14:00 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-12-12 17:24 -0500
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2011-12-12 17:06 -0600
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-12-12 18:16 -0500
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-12-11 09:03 -0500
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development 88888 Dihedral <dihedral88888@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-11 08:57 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-12 12:11 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-12-12 14:25 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development James Harris <james.harris.1@googlemail.com> - 2011-12-14 13:44 -0800
Re: Which lean C compiler for 32-bit OS development "ankh" <star67@venus.gov> - 2011-11-12 22:42 -0600
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