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| From | Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | comp.lang.c |
| Subject | Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" |
| Date | 2014-12-15 02:39 +0000 |
| Organization | A noiseless patient Spider |
| Message-ID | <87vbld7i22.fsf@bsb.me.uk> (permalink) |
| References | (5 earlier) <c0a85583-af12-465b-96d2-81295345e964@googlegroups.com> <87mw6r5l2u.fsf@bsb.me.uk> <Q8gjw.62172$Uc3.21312@fx33.am4> <87tx0x4ztv.fsf@bsb.me.uk> <ITqjw.48167$7u3.15234@fx47.am4> |
BartC <bc@freeuk.com> writes: > On 14/12/2014 22:43, Ben Bacarisse wrote: >> BartC <bc@freeuk.com> writes: > >>> It forms a big chunk of it though. Think about writing a word >>> processor, where most of it is concerned with user interfaces, >>> displays, file formats and implementing 1001 different commands. >>> >>> It's more about routine engineering rather than neat little >>> mathematical functions. >> >> I think you've fallen for Malcolm McLean's interpretation of what I >> mean. > > No, I tried hard not to! I understand that working with mathemetical > content is little to do with using a mathematical style of > programming. OK. Your reference to "neat little mathematical functions" made me think otherwise. >> I am talking about applying mathematical thinking to almost every >> function -- even the ones that don't do anything "mathematical". I put >> that in quotes because it is my contention that programming *is* >> mathematical, even when it doesn't look like it. A function that moves >> the editor's internal position to the end of the current line is a piece >> of mathematics that can (and should) be reasoned about -- even if only >> for a few seconds. > > Maybe. Fortunately such simple tasks can be done with pretty much any > language, with any mathematical reasoning done in the programmer's > head. Yes, where else would it be done? I suspect there been some crossing of wires here... >> I don't think my point hinges on the proportion of code that is genuine >> boiler-plate. Boiler pate is code that needs almost no thought at all, >> and if you are fortunate enough that 99% of some program is like that, >> all it means is that yo are writing, in effect, a small program. > > With a largish application, there's a bit more to it than even the > actual coding. The overall design for example. Working out exactly how > to do it. Choosing the languages, perhaps even having to design one or > two as part of the application (so that users can extend the > application themselves). In fact like any kind of project, whether > programming related or not. Sure. I don't want to get tied up with what exactly is programming or coding or design etc. What people-like-us-do (whatever you call it) is a complex, multifaceted activity. My point is that one part of it -- the details of how an abstract language of loops and variable and functions and so on is used to achieve some effect or other -- is a mathematical activity, and therefore mathematical methods can be applied to it (if only informally most of the time). And I go a bit further and say that they should be applied more often than I think they are (thought I admit to being rather out of touch these days so it all may be much better than I remember it being). > Tell someone who's been doing any kind of job for a while that they > should have been been using a mathematically-minded approach all > along, they might be sceptical too! I'm sure. Being sceptical is a good starting position to adopt. -- Ben.
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"Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Lynn McGuire <lmc@winsim.com> - 2014-12-10 18:17 -0600
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" G G <gdotone@gmail.com> - 2014-12-10 22:55 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-11 09:01 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-16 02:41 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-16 11:08 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-16 13:06 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-16 13:14 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2014-12-16 07:29 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-16 16:23 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-16 17:23 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2014-12-16 18:06 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-17 07:35 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-17 16:01 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-18 10:30 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2014-12-20 18:45 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-20 11:58 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Thomas Jahns <jahns@idontlikespam.dkrz.de> - 2014-12-12 11:15 +0100
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2014-12-11 04:11 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" "ocq (an evil corporate man)" <ocq@maili.ng> - 2014-12-11 17:36 +0100
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2014-12-11 08:44 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" "ocq (an evil corporate man)" <ocq@maili.ng> - 2014-12-11 17:53 +0100
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2014-12-11 09:57 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-11 15:21 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" "ocq (an evil corporate man)" <ocq@maili.ng> - 2014-12-12 11:14 +0100
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-11 05:06 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2014-12-11 05:48 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2014-12-11 06:17 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" JohnF <john@please.see.sig.for.email.com> - 2014-12-13 10:22 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2014-12-13 10:34 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-13 14:04 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-13 07:42 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-13 20:52 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-14 00:23 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-14 12:07 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2014-12-14 13:20 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-14 22:43 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2014-12-15 01:33 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-15 02:39 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-15 03:16 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-15 17:24 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-15 18:01 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2014-12-15 14:25 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2014-12-16 08:46 -0500
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2014-12-16 05:59 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2014-12-17 08:21 -0500
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-17 07:27 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-16 14:29 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2014-12-16 08:51 -0500
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-16 14:30 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-15 10:02 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2014-12-14 00:36 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-14 01:22 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2014-12-14 07:35 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2014-12-14 04:39 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2014-12-14 08:14 -0500
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-14 08:02 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-16 04:52 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com - 2014-12-13 06:39 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com> - 2014-12-13 15:57 -0600
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2014-12-15 09:51 -0600
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2014-12-15 20:30 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-15 21:29 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2014-12-15 21:23 -0600
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2014-12-16 04:14 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2014-12-16 09:11 -0600
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2014-12-16 13:13 -0600
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2014-12-16 19:27 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2014-12-16 16:11 -0600
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-16 14:39 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2014-12-16 18:25 -0600
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-16 05:13 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2014-12-11 07:28 -0800
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2014-12-11 17:29 +0100
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Jens Stuckelberger <Jens_Stuckelberger@nowhere.net> - 2014-12-11 17:59 +0000
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2014-12-11 19:05 +0100
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-12-12 11:37 +0100
Re: "Is C Still Relevant in the 21st Century?" John Bode <jfbode1029@gmail.com> - 2014-12-15 10:49 -0800
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