Groups | Search | Server Info | Keyboard shortcuts | Login | Register [http] [https] [nntp] [nntps]
Groups > sci.physics.relativity > #395526
| Newsgroups | sci.physics.relativity |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-10-12 18:11 -0700 |
| References | (1 earlier) <e661ogFg5emU1@mid.individual.net> <3e326693-344a-4116-9356-5c4cba2fb64a@googlegroups.com> <e668pnFhor0U1@mid.individual.net> <8714ffa4-aa9a-4fb6-8a49-c2496479389a@googlegroups.com> <e66dbuFiterU1@mid.individual.net> |
| Message-ID | <2febe131-e476-4577-bfe2-da975496358b@googlegroups.com> (permalink) |
| Subject | Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt |
| From | Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> |
On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 5:16:49 PM UTC+8, Sylvia Else wrote: > If the mirror is parallel to AD, then the only way the angle of > incidence can equal the angle of reflection is if B lies on the > perpendicular midway between A and C. > > Sylvia. We can argue forever but I only consider facts: 1. Michelson used a logic which assumed unequal lightpaths over the perpendicular and parallel arms. 2. His logic led to a null result and he claimed the aether nonexistent. 3. Lorentz tried to rescue the aether and suggested with Fitzgerald that the parallel arm contracted proportional to v. 4. The contraction could not be verified as real. 5. SR changed Lorentz' contraction from physically real to observed by a non-comoving observer. 6. I demonstrated that the lightpaths of the perpendicular and parallel arms of the interferometer are equal by a mathematical formula. Michelson light ray on the perpendicular arm traveled aba1 in his 1881 and 1887 papers but the adjusted path is ab1a1. 7. My logic is consistent with the outcome of MMX and does not need a length contraction. Michelson's logic is not valid and cannot be corrected by Lorentz' length contraction. SR still uses a theoretical length contraction.
Back to sci.physics.relativity | Previous | Next — Previous in thread | Next in thread | Find similar | Unroll thread
On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-04 22:35 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2016-10-05 07:52 +0200
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-04 23:12 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2016-10-05 10:42 +0200
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2016-10-05 02:04 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2016-10-05 15:35 -0700
Cretin P G Riedt at work "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-06 08:11 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-06 16:32 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-06 18:21 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-07 04:32 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-07 18:10 -0700
Cretin P G Riedt perseveres "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-07 18:27 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-10-07 21:12 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-07 19:52 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt jaymoseley@hotmail.com - 2016-10-16 06:30 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt ScottPN <Scott@oe0vgk3s.info> - 2016-10-16 18:29 +0000
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt alsor@interia.pl - 2016-10-16 12:34 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-10-17 11:46 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-08 11:03 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-08 16:50 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-08 17:22 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-08 17:29 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-08 17:38 -0700
Imbecile P G Riedt persists "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-08 19:22 -0700
Re: Imbecile P G Riedt persists Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-08 20:28 -0700
Re: Imbecile P G Riedt persists "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-08 20:33 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2016-10-09 09:20 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-09 18:27 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-09 19:53 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-10 00:53 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2016-10-10 04:45 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-10 05:13 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2016-10-10 06:03 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-10 06:13 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2016-10-10 06:20 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2016-10-10 07:20 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2016-10-10 23:25 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-10 18:16 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-10 23:07 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2016-10-11 05:19 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2016-10-11 05:39 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt paparios <paparios@gmail.com> - 2016-10-11 05:56 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Scott <Scott@oe0vgk3s.info> - 2016-10-11 20:45 +0000
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-11 18:05 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2016-10-11 20:24 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-11 22:06 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2016-10-12 05:00 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-12 16:47 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2016-10-12 20:02 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt alsor@interia.pl - 2016-10-12 08:45 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2016-10-10 07:31 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2016-10-10 05:37 -0700
Cretin P G Riedt inserts foot in mouth "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-10 07:00 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-10-17 15:35 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-10-24 07:22 +0100
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-10-24 08:33 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-10-24 17:27 +0100
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-10-25 07:46 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2016-10-25 18:44 -0400
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-10-26 09:18 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2016-10-31 14:19 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-31 16:50 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-10-31 18:14 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2016-10-31 18:57 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-31 19:39 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2016-11-01 08:48 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2016-11-02 08:36 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-11-02 09:12 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Nick <nick@nick.nick> - 2016-11-02 16:24 +0000
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2016-11-01 12:53 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2016-10-24 06:56 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Edgar König <edgko@edgarkoenig.info> - 2016-10-24 15:48 +0000
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Edgar König <edgko@edgarkoenig.info> - 2016-10-24 15:54 +0000
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2016-10-10 05:35 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2016-10-10 07:26 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-10-17 14:56 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2016-10-18 07:59 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-10-18 10:46 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Jim Barthel <jimbart@portlanportal.info> - 2016-10-18 17:01 +0000
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2016-10-18 12:10 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-10-19 07:34 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2016-10-19 06:53 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-10-19 09:07 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt alsor@interia.pl - 2016-10-11 09:30 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2016-10-11 14:55 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Scott <Scott@oe0vgk3s.info> - 2016-10-11 20:38 +0000
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt alsor@interia.pl - 2016-10-11 15:57 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2016-10-11 23:27 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2016-10-14 06:16 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2016-10-12 16:58 +1100
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-11 23:25 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2016-10-12 18:58 +1100
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-12 01:32 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2016-10-12 20:16 +1100
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-12 18:11 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2016-10-13 12:28 +1100
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-12 18:40 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-13 17:05 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-13 20:38 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-14 04:28 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-14 05:15 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-14 06:52 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-14 07:35 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-14 07:57 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-14 09:14 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-14 11:52 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-14 22:36 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-15 02:52 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-15 06:04 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-15 06:50 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-15 06:58 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-15 08:15 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-15 07:13 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-15 08:17 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-15 08:47 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-17 03:26 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2016-10-17 10:08 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-17 09:57 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-17 17:42 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-17 19:16 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-17 19:56 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-18 08:19 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Peter Riedt <riedt1@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-10-18 18:19 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-18 19:12 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt alsor@interia.pl - 2016-10-18 10:25 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Jim Barthel <jimbart@portlanportal.info> - 2016-10-18 18:34 +0000
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt alsor@interia.pl - 2016-10-18 12:42 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Jim Barthel <jimbart@portlanportal.info> - 2016-10-18 19:51 +0000
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt alsor@interia.pl - 2016-10-18 14:00 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Jim Barthel <jimbart@portlanportal.info> - 2016-10-18 22:39 +0000
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-14 06:44 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2016-10-14 07:16 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2016-10-14 07:33 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2016-10-13 10:59 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt alsor@interia.pl - 2016-10-12 08:51 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2016-10-13 20:46 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2016-10-14 14:51 +1100
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Dirk Van de moortel <dirkvandemoortel@hotspam.not> - 2016-10-16 22:45 +0200
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2016-10-16 19:21 -0500
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt ScottPN <Scott@oe0vgk3s.info> - 2016-10-17 09:57 +0000
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Dirk Van de moortel <dirkvandemoortel@hotspam.not> - 2016-10-17 17:02 +0200
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Scott <scott@oe0vgk3s.info> - 2016-10-17 15:33 +0000
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2016-10-17 12:25 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt Dirk Van de moortel <dirkvandemoortel@hotspam.not> - 2016-10-17 22:20 +0200
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt alsor@interia.pl - 2016-10-17 10:27 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt alsor@interia.pl - 2016-10-17 10:29 -0700
Re: On the Electrodynamics of moving Bodies by P G Riedt ScottPN <Scott@oe0vgk3s.info> - 2016-10-17 09:53 +0000
csiph-web