Re: Counted strings

From	Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.c
Subject	Re: Counted strings
Date	2016-12-05 16:56 +0100
Organization	albasani.net
Message-ID	<20161205165601.0e6ec5e0@maxa-pc> (permalink)
References	(6 earlier) <1e048fa0-7c91-430e-8332-f07e2495812d@googlegroups.com> <o23cj0$9l8$1@dont-email.me> <2cdca7c0-657d-4d61-8457-94ef01f3f4cf@googlegroups.com> <o23vu2$eaq$1@dont-email.me> <7520b145-f095-473c-a117-d89ef8feb590@googlegroups.com>

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On Mon, 5 Dec 2016 07:38:21 -0800 (PST)
"Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Monday, December 5, 2016 at 10:10:17 AM UTC-5, David Brown wrote:
 > 
> > In the PC world, there are many types of application where speed
> > makes a noticeable effect - but also many where everything is "fast
> > enough" already.  
> 
> I know of none.  Every app I use today is not only usable, but fast,
> and typically much faster than I can navigate through the UI, which
> makes me the slowest component of it.
> 
> Email programs, word processors, spreadsheets, web browsers, and most
> of the tools I use for development.

Well, today, I had heavy lag because of badly written javascript (or
so) on some banking page... also LibreOffice tend to open big document
long time. Also text editor gedit is slow opening big texts.
Game Stellaris has heavy lag at end of game. And I have 3.6GHz CPU with
32GB of RAM... mails are small so not a big problem. But usenet readers
can show. etc...

> 
> Only compilation is slow (on the order of less than 10 seconds per
> full compile, and typically less than 5 seconds on debug builds).
> That pause is very annoying actually because it's the thing that
> delays me in the midst of my thought processes.

How often you compile?

> 
> I honestly can't think of another application I use in Linux or on
> Windows where I think it is slow.  I will note that sometimes on
> Windows the installers are slow.  And launch time is slow.  But once
> things are loaded, they are typically fast.

Today, almost everything is slow and bloated.... eg KDE indexer is
tremendously slow and hogs system... on Windows, I have it in VM it
runs constantly something. Whenever I fire up VM it writes several
gigabytes of data to disk...

> 
> I don't see what you see, David.  So, we live in different machine use
> worlds.  I see every computer since about the year 2000 as being more
> than fast enough.

Bullshit. Try to surf on flash heavy pages on some laptop 10 years
ago...

> 
> > And the places where C is often used are at the lower levels
> > and the shared library code, where speed /is/ important.  After
> > all, if you don't need efficient code, why bother with C in the
> > first place?  

C does not guarantees efficient code. Take for example Qt and GTK+.
Qt5(C++) is much more lightweight then GTK3(C).
> 
> Capability.  In C you can do anything, and it is inherently efficient
> because it operates very closely to your source code form.

How so? My first version of assembler nbody benchmark was slower then
Java ;)

> 
> > Use a higher level language that gives you a lot more functionality
> > for less development time - at the cost of run-time efficiency.
> >  
> > > In those few cases where performance is affected notably, it
> > > might be worth taking the extra time to make the code a little
> > > more obscure to gain the performance benefits.  But in all other
> > > cases, the needs of ease of development and maintenance far and
> > > away exceed the need for optimization.
> > > 
> > > And, of course, all of the above must preclude sloppiness.  Things
> > > should still always be done in proper accord even if the CPU is
> > > so fast and power efficient that it wouldn't matter how
> > > inefficient the code is because it goes still so fast ... things
> > > still have a proper form they should exist in, and be pursued in
> > > those regards.  
> 
> My view is simple:  C is efficient as it is.  Writing code in a
> readable fashion in C is more desirable than dipping into more
> confusing syntaxes to squeeze out a few more milliseconds of compute
> savings ... except for where it truly makes a difference.

What you mean by this: care to show example?




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Thread

Counted strings jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2016-12-03 23:58 +0100
  Re: Counted strings supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-03 15:40 -0800
  Counted stringsl Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2016-12-03 15:40 -0800
  Re: Counted strings BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-04 00:20 +0000
  Re: Counted strings Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2016-12-03 21:26 -0500
    Re: Counted strings jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2016-12-04 18:11 +0100
    Re: Counted strings Mark Storkamp <mstorkamp@yahoo.com> - 2016-12-04 19:25 -0600
  Re: Counted strings Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-03 18:57 -0800
  Re: Counted strings David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-04 16:33 +0100
    Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-04 07:52 -0800
      Re: Counted strings David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-04 17:10 +0100
        Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-04 10:14 -0800
          Re: Counted strings David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-04 20:20 +0100
            Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-04 16:49 -0800
              Re: Counted strings David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-05 10:40 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 05:51 -0800
                Re: Counted strings David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-05 16:10 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 07:38 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2016-12-05 16:56 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 08:04 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2016-12-05 17:16 +0100
                Re: Counted strings Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-12-05 16:12 -0500
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 13:24 -0800
                Re: Counted strings David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-06 10:53 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 03:52 -0800
                Re: Counted strings David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-06 13:32 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 04:48 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Robert Spanjaard <spamtrap@arumes.com> - 2016-12-06 13:42 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 05:16 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Robert Spanjaard <spamtrap@arumes.com> - 2016-12-06 14:39 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 05:24 -0800
                Re: Counted strings fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 05:41 -0800
                Re: Counted strings fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 05:47 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Robert Spanjaard <spamtrap@arumes.com> - 2016-12-06 14:48 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 05:54 -0800
                Re: Counted strings fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 06:21 -0800
                Re: Counted strings fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 06:24 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Robert Spanjaard <spamtrap@arumes.com> - 2016-12-06 18:06 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 10:19 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Robert Spanjaard <spamtrap@arumes.com> - 2016-12-06 19:45 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 11:10 -0800
                Re: Counted strings fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 12:58 -0800
                Re: Counted strings fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 14:08 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-06 11:25 -0800
                Re: Counted strings fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 05:28 -0800
                Re: Counted strings David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-06 16:21 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 07:29 -0800
                Re: Counted strings fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 07:39 -0800
                Re: Counted strings fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 08:32 -0800
                Re: Counted strings fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 08:32 -0800
                Re: Counted strings BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-05 16:28 +0000
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 08:34 -0800
                Re: Counted strings BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-05 18:27 +0000
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 10:36 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-06 08:19 +1300
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 11:22 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-06 08:26 +1300
                Re: Counted strings BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-05 19:36 +0000
                Re: Counted strings Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-06 08:41 +1300
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 11:48 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 11:59 -0800
                Re: Counted strings jameskuyper@verizon.net - 2016-12-05 12:12 -0800
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 12:18 -0800
                Re: Counted strings jameskuyper@verizon.net - 2016-12-05 13:17 -0800
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 13:29 -0800
                Re: Counted strings jameskuyper@verizon.net - 2016-12-05 15:37 -0800
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 15:43 -0800
                Re: Counted strings David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-06 13:40 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "James R. Kuyper" <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2016-12-06 12:00 -0500
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 10:09 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2016-12-06 13:33 -0500
                Re: Counted strings David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-06 21:24 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-06 12:56 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-05 12:22 -0800
                Re: Counted strings supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-05 08:36 -0800
                Re: Counted strings BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-05 17:31 +0000
                Re: Counted strings David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-05 22:07 +0100
                Re: Counted strings Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-06 10:14 +1300
                Re: Counted strings Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-12-05 22:11 +0000
                Re: Counted strings BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-06 02:13 +0000
                Re: Counted strings David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-05 21:57 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 13:01 -0800
                Re: Counted strings BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-05 21:22 +0000
                Re: Counted strings Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-06 10:25 +1300
                Re: Counted strings BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-05 21:36 +0000
                Re: Counted strings jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2016-12-05 22:33 +0100
                Re: Counted strings "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 17:03 -0500
    Re: Counted strings supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-04 08:57 -0800
    Re: Counted strings Robert Spanjaard <spamtrap@arumes.com> - 2016-12-04 20:19 +0100
      Re: Counted strings David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-04 20:24 +0100
        Re: Counted strings Robert Spanjaard <spamtrap@arumes.com> - 2016-12-04 20:37 +0100
          Re: Counted strings David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-04 21:04 +0100
            Re: Counted strings Robert Spanjaard <spamtrap@arumes.com> - 2016-12-04 21:22 +0100
              Re: Counted strings BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-04 22:37 +0000
              Re: Counted strings David Thompson <dave.thompson2@verizon.net> - 2016-12-10 22:42 -0500
                Re: Counted strings Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-12-10 23:17 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-12-11 11:48 +0000
                Re: Counted strings Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-12-11 04:40 -0800
                Re: Counted strings Robert Spanjaard <spamtrap@arumes.com> - 2016-12-11 10:56 +0100
      Re: Counted strings Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2016-12-05 15:47 -0600
        Re: Counted strings Gareth Owen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2016-12-05 22:01 +0000
          Re: Counted strings Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2016-12-05 22:28 -0600
        Re: Counted strings "Chris M. Thomasson" <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2016-12-05 20:18 -0800
        Re: Counted strings Robert Spanjaard <spamtrap@arumes.com> - 2016-12-06 11:05 +0100
  Re: Counted strings luser droog <luser.droog@gmail.com> - 2016-12-04 13:13 -0800
  Re: Counted strings Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-12-05 09:30 -0800
    Re: Counted strings Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-05 09:41 -0800
      Re: Counted strings Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-12-06 11:19 -0800
        Re: Counted strings Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-06 11:44 -0800
  Re: Counted strings Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2016-12-10 10:29 -0800
    Re: Counted strings supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-10 11:08 -0800

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