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Re: There gos the political correctness...

From Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de>
Newsgroups ger.ct
Subject Re: There gos the political correctness...
Date 2016-12-07 17:52 +0100
Organization clonix & klauknowhowtechnologies
Message-ID <1495440.P4AWVS1vDL@rotfl.franken.de> (permalink)
References (9 earlier) <slrno38evu.3m0.lars.gebauer@yenni.elke-albrecht.com> <e9j2nqFg2taU1@mid.individual.net> <pdl83cph8b4gbf0nd0vb25cd6rontd0mr3@4ax.com> <e9j4k3Fgi5pU1@mid.individual.net> <o29d73$q5b$1@news.albasani.net>

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Dr. Joachim Neudert wrote:

> Am 22.11.16 um 15:56 schrieb Hanno Foest:
> 
>> Ja klar, aber das ist Schrödingers Kriminalitätsrate: Ohne sie zu messen
>> ist sie unbekannt, und das Ergebnis hat was mit der Art der Messung zu tun.
>> 
> 
>> Hanno
> 
> 
> Gerade bricht ein neuer Bann der Political correctness.

Was hat das mit PC zu tun?

> Heiko Maas
> erwägt etwa ganz Unkorrektes:
> 
> http://www.faz.net/aktuell/politik/nach-frauenmord-in-freiburg-maas-fuer-debatte-ueber-dna-analyse-14562085.html
> 
> "Bundesjustizminister Heiko Maas (SPD) hat sich dafür ausgesprochen, auf
> der Justizministerkonferenz im Frühjahr zu beraten, ob der Polizei eine
> umfassendere Nutzung von DNA-Spuren erlaubt werden sollte. Bislang
> können Ermittler das Geschlecht ermitteln sowie unterschiedliche
> DNA-Spuren abgleichen. Maas verwies auf einen Referentenentwurf in
> seinem Ministerium, es müssten künftig vielleicht auch Erkenntnisse über
> ein mögliches Verwandtschaftsverhältnis zwischen Täter und Opfer
> ausgewertet werden dürfen.

Äh, das habe ich jetzt nicht verstanden. Was hätte das in Freiburg genutzt? 
Und auch so erschließt sich mir der Nutzen nicht so ohne Weiteres. Wenn z.B. 
nur die DNA eins Verwandten eines Täters bekannt ist, dann sollte bei einem 
Abgleich der Verwandte auch als "sehr ähnlich" auftauchen. Ich bilde mir ein, 
sowas wird ermittlungstechnisch durchaus auch genutzt.

> Dazu müsste die Strafprozessordnung geändert werden, bislang heißt es
> darin: „Bei der Untersuchung dürfen andere Feststellungen als
> diejenigen, die zur Ermittlung des DNA-Identifizierungsmusters sowie des
> Geschlechts erforderlich sind, nicht getroffen werden.“

Mein Kenntnisstand ist, dass sich Sachen, die darüber hinaus gehen zumindest 
vor einiger Zeit noch aus dem Genom nicht besonders zuverlässig ableiten 
ließen.

> Eine Änderung der Strafprozessordnung hatte zuerst der
> baden-württembergische Justizminister Guido Wolf (CDU) angeregt. Er
> will, dass die Polizei per DNA-Analyse künftig Erkenntnisse über Haar-,
> Haut- und Augenfarbe gewinnen kann. Zudem wäre es technisch sogar
> möglich, das biologische Alter und die „biogeographische Herkunft“
> verdächtiger Personen zu bestimmen."

Wenn das so ist - ok, dann kann man sicherlich darüber nachdenken. Aber schon 
die "biogeographische Herkunft" dünkt mir ein wenig spanisch. Das Kind eines 
Afrikaners und einer Europäerin ist dann irgendwo im südlichen Mittelmeer zu 
verorten? ;-)

Aber das geht eher in Dein Fachgebiet, insofern ...

> Nachdem anstelle von Vorurteilen nun zunehmend realistische authentische
> Erfahrungen treten

Welche die Vorurteile allerdings beim besten Willen nicht bestätigen.

> und das Meinungsbild der Öffentlichkeit beeinflussen,
> sieht er sich wohl unter Druck  dazu genötigt?

Wenn die Technik entsprechende Merkmalsextraktion *zuverlässig* erlaubt, dann 
kann man natürlich darüber nachdenken. Bis Fingerabdrücke allgemein akzeptiert 
waren hat es ja auch ein wenig gedauert.

> Damit bin ich aus der Diskussion die hier gerade läuft und die ich
> bewußt gemieden habe, hiermit aber gerade streife, auch schon wieder
> heraus.

Viel Feind, viel Ehr'.

> Aber ich halte es für einen massiven Richtungswechsel, der sich da
> ankündigt.

Naja, man kann immer alles an der Tagespolitik aufhängen. Wenn es denn so sein 
sollte, dass sich die Technik da soweit fortentwickelt hat, dass entsprechende 
Erkenntnisse *zuverlässig* gewonnen werden können dann spricht gegen eine 
Diskussion, ob man diese verwenden soll erstmal wenig.

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Thread

There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-17 10:13 +0100
  Re: There gos the political correctness... Hanno Foest <hurga-news2@tigress.com> - 2016-11-17 10:33 +0100
    Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-17 11:11 +0100
      Re: There gos the political correctness... Hanno Foest <hurga-news2@tigress.com> - 2016-11-17 11:31 +0100
        Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-17 11:40 +0100
          Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-17 03:38 -0800
          Re: There gos the political correctness... Frank Graf <f.graf@firemail.de> - 2016-11-17 17:33 +0000
            Re: There gos the political correctness... Ruediger Lahl <ruediger.lahl@gmx.de> - 2016-11-18 08:05 +0100
              Re: There gos the political correctness... Jörg Tewes <jogi1964@gmx.net> - 2016-11-18 13:14 +0100
            Re: There gos the political correctness... Frank Hucklenbroich <Hucklenbroich01@aol.com> - 2016-11-18 09:06 +0100
              Re: There gos the political correctness... Ruediger Lahl <ruediger.lahl@gmx.de> - 2016-11-18 10:22 +0100
          Re: There gos the political correctness... Herwig AQSR <herwig.huener@t-online.de> - 2016-11-17 23:14 -0800
      Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-17 03:06 -0800
        Re: There gos the political correctness... Andreas Quast <bu3ro.kratz@fr33n3t.de> - 2016-11-19 13:37 +0000
          Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-19 14:39 +0100
  Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-17 01:41 -0800
  Re: There gos the political correctness... Frank Hucklenbroich <Hucklenbroich01@aol.com> - 2016-11-17 16:35 +0100
  Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-17 16:01 +0000
    Re: There gos the political correctness... Jörg Tewes <jogi1964@gmx.net> - 2016-11-17 23:09 +0100
    Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-18 09:11 +0100
      Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-18 01:44 -0800
        Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-18 14:51 +0100
          Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-18 05:58 -0800
          Re: There gos the political correctness... Martin Gerdes <martin.gerdes@gmx.de> - 2016-11-19 13:04 +0100
        Re: There gos the political correctness... Peter Mc Donough <mcd-mail-lists@gmx.net> - 2016-11-18 22:31 +0100
      Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-18 11:05 +0000
        Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-18 12:25 +0100
          Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-21 11:03 +0100
            Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-21 11:23 +0100
              Re: There gos the political correctness... Dr. Joachim Neudert <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-21 12:33 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Juergen P. Meier" <nospam-1984@jors.net> - 2016-11-21 12:49 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-21 14:19 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-21 14:27 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-21 15:34 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Hanno Foest <hurga-news2@tigress.com> - 2016-11-21 15:46 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Juergen P. Meier" <nospam-1984@jors.net> - 2016-11-21 15:46 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-21 07:58 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-21 16:06 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-21 19:27 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Juergen P. Meier" <nospam-1984@jors.net> - 2016-11-22 05:36 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Hanno Foest <hurga-news2@tigress.com> - 2016-11-21 15:27 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-21 15:40 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Hanno Foest <hurga-news2@tigress.com> - 2016-11-21 15:54 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-21 19:28 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-21 19:49 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-21 14:44 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Hanno Foest <hurga-news2@tigress.com> - 2016-11-21 15:48 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-21 14:51 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-21 19:29 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-21 18:51 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 10:06 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Hanno Foest <hurga-news2@tigress.com> - 2016-11-21 20:28 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-21 16:05 +0100
              Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-21 14:16 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-21 16:07 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-21 16:26 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-21 19:33 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-22 08:32 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-22 09:31 +0100
              Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-21 19:25 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-21 18:55 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-21 13:00 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-21 22:23 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-22 00:04 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-22 09:32 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-22 00:05 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-22 09:35 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-22 00:56 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-22 08:34 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-22 09:41 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 10:13 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-22 13:37 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-22 16:15 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-22 18:26 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-22 12:17 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-22 13:51 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-22 16:17 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-22 07:42 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... g.kuehne <kuehne123@front.ru> - 2016-11-22 17:32 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-22 18:47 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-22 09:59 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-22 19:06 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-22 10:08 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Sepp Neuper <Sepp_Neuper@web.de> - 2016-11-23 03:17 +0100
                Re: There goes the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-22 10:03 -0800
                Re: There goes the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-23 08:07 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... g.kuehne <kuehne123@front.ru> - 2016-11-22 19:12 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-22 18:37 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... g.kuehne <kuehne123@front.ru> - 2016-11-22 17:31 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-22 19:00 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-23 08:09 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... g.kuehne <kuehne123@front.ru> - 2016-11-23 16:59 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Sepp Neuper <Sepp_Neuper@web.de> - 2016-11-23 03:17 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 09:13 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 09:08 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 10:52 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-23 11:03 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 11:31 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 13:41 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 14:20 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 16:15 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-24 10:09 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-24 13:03 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-24 14:35 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 16:12 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-24 10:02 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 16:17 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-24 10:09 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Holger Marzen <holger@marzen.de> - 2016-11-24 09:34 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... g.kuehne <kuehne123@front.ru> - 2016-11-24 17:02 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... g.kuehne <kuehne123@front.ru> - 2016-11-24 17:18 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 16:07 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 16:18 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 16:18 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-24 10:11 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-22 07:30 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 10:10 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Florian Maier <holeinone5@gmx.net> - 2016-11-22 21:11 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dr. Joachim Neudert <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-22 21:33 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-23 09:42 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-24 09:48 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-24 11:01 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-24 12:00 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-24 12:21 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-24 11:53 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-24 12:32 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-24 14:52 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-24 14:35 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-24 16:18 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-24 14:40 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... g.kuehne <kuehne123@front.ru> - 2016-11-22 21:37 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Florian Maier <holeinone5@gmx.net> - 2016-11-21 21:09 +0100
          Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-21 19:22 +0100
            Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-21 18:47 +0000
              Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-22 08:36 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Florian Maier <holeinone5@gmx.net> - 2016-11-22 09:29 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-22 09:56 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-22 01:08 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Florian Maier <holeinone5@gmx.net> - 2016-11-22 11:20 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-22 11:54 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-22 03:06 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 11:25 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 11:51 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 12:27 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 12:36 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-22 15:30 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-22 15:32 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 15:12 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 15:51 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-22 19:34 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-23 08:12 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 14:59 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-22 16:20 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 09:25 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-23 11:05 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 13:42 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-24 15:14 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-24 16:22 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-24 17:11 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-24 08:26 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-24 17:48 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-24 08:55 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Holger Marzen <holger@marzen.de> - 2016-11-24 16:59 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-24 18:52 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-24 12:00 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Hanno Foest <hurga-news2@tigress.com> - 2016-11-25 12:56 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-24 19:07 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dieter Sporer <dieter.sp@gmx.de> - 2016-11-24 12:48 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-25 07:25 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Holger Marzen <holger@marzen.de> - 2016-11-25 07:15 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-25 08:37 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-24 23:45 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-25 11:15 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-25 11:13 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-25 11:11 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Matthias Eißing <meissing@gmx.de> - 2016-11-25 11:24 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-25 12:25 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Matthias Eißing <meissing@gmx.de> - 2016-11-25 12:29 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-25 12:47 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... g.kuehne <kuehne123@front.ru> - 2016-11-25 15:27 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-24 19:15 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-24 21:01 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Hanno Foest <hurga-news2@tigress.com> - 2016-11-25 12:49 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dieter Sporer <dieter.sp@gmx.de> - 2016-11-24 12:32 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 09:28 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 13:46 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 16:20 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 16:21 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-23 18:53 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-12-07 17:26 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-12-07 17:52 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-12-07 09:41 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Hanno Foest <hurga-news2@tigress.com> - 2016-12-07 17:56 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-12-07 18:10 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-12-07 18:12 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-12-07 09:21 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-12-07 13:56 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-12-08 10:16 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-12-08 02:22 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-12-08 13:07 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-12-08 04:38 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Wolfgang Kynast <wky@gmx.de> - 2016-12-08 13:48 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Hartmut Ott <hottm@arcor.de> - 2016-12-08 15:51 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Florian Maier <holeinone5@gmx.net> - 2016-12-07 18:33 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Hartmut Ott <hottm@arcor.de> - 2016-12-08 15:54 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Goetz Schultz <ng-delete-mailer@goetz.co.uk> - 2016-12-07 22:33 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 14:47 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 15:03 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 15:31 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-22 16:04 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 15:18 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 15:48 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Günter Frenz <usenet-01@guefz.de> - 2016-11-22 18:01 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Günter Frenz <usenet-01@guefz.de> - 2016-11-22 21:10 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-22 19:26 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-22 15:03 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-22 15:51 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-22 19:53 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 12:25 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 12:29 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 13:33 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 15:57 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 18:39 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 19:18 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-23 09:45 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-22 19:57 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-22 20:12 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Stefan+Usenet@Froehlich.Priv.at (Stefan Froehlich) - 2016-11-22 10:50 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-22 02:58 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 11:36 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 11:01 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-22 09:44 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-22 10:12 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 10:43 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Florian Maier <holeinone5@gmx.net> - 2016-11-22 12:02 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-22 12:16 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Florian Maier <holeinone5@gmx.net> - 2016-11-22 21:38 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 11:34 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-22 12:20 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Florian Maier <holeinone5@gmx.net> - 2016-11-22 10:19 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Hanno Foest <hurga-news2@tigress.com> - 2016-11-22 11:27 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 10:49 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-22 11:57 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 12:16 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 18:47 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-22 15:07 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 19:13 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-23 09:35 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-23 10:26 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 09:30 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-22 09:54 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-22 13:39 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 09:33 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-23 09:53 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-23 10:05 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Dr. Joachim Neudert" <neudert@5sl.org> - 2016-11-23 11:36 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Dietz Pröpper <dietz-news@rotfl.franken.de> - 2016-11-23 11:09 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Florian Maier <holeinone5@gmx.net> - 2016-11-23 11:43 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... "Ralph A. Schmid, dk5ras" <ralph@schmid.xxx> - 2016-11-23 12:19 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-23 03:26 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lothar Frings <Lothar.Frings@gmx.de> - 2016-11-23 06:20 -0800
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 10:32 +0000
              Re: There gos the political correctness... Thomas Heuving <heuving@gmx.de> - 2016-11-22 10:06 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Gunter Kühne <kuehne123@front.ru> - 2016-11-22 10:16 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Thomas Heuving <heuving@gmx.de> - 2016-11-22 10:31 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Gunter Kühne <kuehne123@front.ru> - 2016-11-22 11:11 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 11:20 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Gunter Kühne <kuehne123@front.ru> - 2016-11-22 12:36 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 12:21 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... g.kuehne <kuehne123@front.ru> - 2016-11-22 17:28 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-22 21:04 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... g.kuehne <kuehne123@front.ru> - 2016-11-22 21:35 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Fidel-Sebastian Hunrichse-Lara <Fidel-Sebastian_Hunrichse-Lara@b.maus.de> - 2016-11-22 20:51 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... g.kuehne <kuehne123@front.ru> - 2016-11-22 21:33 +0100
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 11:09 +0000
                Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 12:46 +0000
              Re: There gos the political correctness... Lars Gebauer <lars.gebauer@yahoo.de> - 2016-11-22 10:29 +0000
      Re: There gos the political correctness... Martin Gerdes <martin.gerdes@gmx.de> - 2016-11-20 01:07 +0100
  Re: There gos the political correctness... Martin Gerdes <martin.gerdes@gmx.de> - 2016-11-19 13:04 +0100

csiph-web