NACK retransmission might double Manhattan Distance (Re: NPUs doing 2d chess comms)

From	Mild Shock <janburse@fastmail.fm>
Newsgroups	sci.logic, comp.lang.prolog, sci.physics
Subject	NACK retransmission might double Manhattan Distance (Re: NPUs doing 2d chess comms)
Date	2026-08-01 14:24 +0200
Message-ID	<114kohb$pkdq$3@solani.org> (permalink)
References	<113r42n$8g50$2@solani.org> <114cmmv$jmhc$2@solani.org> <114kh7q$ovdp$5@solani.org> <114knri$pjus$3@solani.org>

Cross-posted to 3 groups.

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Hi,

As easy as queues and FIFO objects might
sound. They don't like congestion. NACK for
retransmission might double the Manhattan Distance:

You have not only start
S to end E communication:

+----E
|
|
S

You might also have ACK or NACK
from E or midpoints back to S:

    S'
   +
  +
E'

Ok, I made that up, I have no idea what a flit is,
when the author wrote this here:

"Packet flits are held in the FIFO which can
be used to determine back pressure. Dropping flits
in a NoC may not be possible since these
architectures may not provide an end-to-end
protocol for retransmission."

Routing Algorithms for 2D NoC Architectures
http://cva.stanford.edu/classes/ee382c/research/2DRouting.pdf

Bye

Mild Shock schrieb:
> Hi,
> 
> Looking at the floor plan of a NPU:
> 
> Getting peak TOPS on a Ryzen AI 7 350 NPU
> https://destevez.net/2026/05/getting-peak-tops-on-a-ryzen-ai-7-350-npu/
> 
> It seems to me comms between tiles takes
> at least Manhattan Distance or L1 Norm time,
> if there is no comms congestion
> 
> But how does a packet travel? This way:
> 
> +----E
> |
> |
> S
> 
> Or this way, from start S to end E:
> 
>     +-E
>    +
>   +
> S
> 
> And what does the chip do if there is
> traffic congestion? Some papers are
> here, possibly an old problem giving
> 
> that processor "cubes" are nothing new.
> But a "cube" would be 3D and not 2D.
> This paper is old from 2007 or so:
> 
> Routing Algorithms for 2D NoC Architectures
> http://cva.stanford.edu/classes/ee382c/research/2DRouting.pdf
> 
> Bye

Thread

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