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Groups > alt.comp.os.windows-11 > #32405

Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I.

From Paul <nospam@needed.invalid>
Newsgroups alt.comp.os.windows-11
Subject Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I.
Date 2026-06-16 16:35 -0400
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <110sc20$1da7v$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References <110k0h2$327l4$1@toylet.eternal-september.org> <OaFXR.66965$WQ_e.2290@fx14.iad> <2r603l96mqhqn1k49l589062p70f1iloec@4ax.com> <n9b25tF2h21U2@mid.individual.net>

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On Mon, 6/15/2026 3:30 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> On 2026-06-15 17:35, croy wrote:
>> On Sun, 14 Jun 2026 14:37:49 -0700, a425couple <a425couple@hotmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 6/13/26 09:29, Mr. Man-wai Chang wrote:
>>>>
>>>> HAL 9000: "I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that" - YouTube
>>>> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARJ8cAGm6JE>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Dave did not act mad.
>>> He just did what he needed to do.
>>> And about a hour later he started disconnecting circuit boards,
>>> in effect performing a prefrontal lobotomy.
>>
>> It seems to me that it would have been much easier and much quicker to
>> simply kill the power to the computer.
> 
> A computer that was not designed to have power cut ever. An integral part of the ship design. 
> A procedure that was not described in the documentation.
> 
> And parts of the computer functions had to be kept running.
> 

The design of the ship, is pure poetic license.

The thought that goes into designing space projects, gives some
idea "who is in control" and "how much trust we have in the hardware"

   https://increment.com/software-architecture/in-space-no-one-can-hear-you-kernel-panic/

Even back in that day, they knew about what architectures
would be needed for reliable space flight. But then, you
would not have much of a movie, if the thing was lashed
down properly :-)

That's the same flaw the Forbin Project makes. The idea is
all wrong, after about the first five minutes of the movie.
But it is what it is.

Even without knowing what kind of AI that HAL9000 was,
it's still a non-deterministic design where you can't
add your hardware analysis to detect faults. If you were
putting a HAL9000 on a real space ship, it would be air gapped
and it definitely would not get to steer anything (directly).
It would be, in effect, a hand calculator... that you could
switch off. And the "real/procedural/dumb" 1+1 computers
would do the real work.

As an example of a "violation-of-principle", one of the
Musk ships has totally autonomous docking at the ISS. You're
not supposed to do that. But we'll find out some day. The hard way.
If NASA designed the thing, it would not do that. You would be
able to switch off the autonomy, grab the 3D controls and finish
the job manually. If you noticed it was going wrong. Any time there
are issues with thrusters as a ship approaches the ISS, it is blocked
from approaching the ISS any closer.

While you can have hand-wavey scifi doo dads, the real
world is boring... and hard work for somebody. And yes, it
has A/B buses, breakers and switches.

What's the thing you fear most in space flight ? It's
the same thing as onboard a naval vessel. It's a fire on board.
You have electricals ? Then you have breakers and switches
to shut that off. If HAL9000 had caught fire, then there
have to be protective devices to help subdue the fire. The
design of spaceships, is just like the design of submarines.
Bulkheads. Air-tight doors. Isolate the chamber with the problem.

   Paul

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Thread

2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-14 00:29 +0800
  Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "David B." <boaterdave@hotmail.co.uk> - 2026-06-14 07:16 +0100
    Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-14 18:12 +0800
      Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "David B." <boaterdave@hotmail.co.uk> - 2026-06-14 23:32 +0100
        Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-15 13:41 +0800
          Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-06-15 20:57 +1000
            Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-15 19:33 +0800
          Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2026-06-15 12:31 +0000
            Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-15 22:24 +0800
              Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2026-06-16 14:11 +0000
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-16 22:16 +0800
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2026-06-17 07:06 +0000
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-17 21:49 +0800
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2026-06-17 17:08 +0000
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-06-17 19:03 -0400
                [OT] Short attention span? "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-18 11:39 +0800
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "....winston" <winstonmvp@gmail.com> - 2026-06-18 02:20 -0400
                Re: Attention span? <-- BANG!! BANG!! "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-18 17:53 +0800
            [OT] Re: attention span and anti-curse protection "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-15 22:44 +0800
    Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2026-06-14 11:28 +0000
      Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-06-14 22:00 +1000
        Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2026-06-14 17:21 +0000
          Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-06-15 21:13 +1000
        Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "David B." <boaterdave@hotmail.co.uk> - 2026-06-14 23:41 +0100
          Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-06-15 08:38 -0400
            Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. David B. <boaterdave@hotmail.co.uk> - 2026-06-16 09:04 +0000
              Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-06-16 15:29 +0200
              Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-06-16 10:35 -0400
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> - 2026-06-16 20:53 +0000
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-06-18 01:51 +0200
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-18 11:41 +0800
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-06-18 08:47 +0200
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey ... old machines "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-18 17:55 +0800
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey ... old machines "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-06-18 14:23 +0200
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey ... old machines & 3d printing "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-18 21:50 +0800
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-17 11:54 +0800
      Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "David B." <boaterdave@hotmail.co.uk> - 2026-06-14 23:35 +0100
    Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-06-14 08:20 -0400
      Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-16 17:55 +0800
        Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-06-16 15:30 +0200
          Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-16 21:51 +0800
            Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2026-06-16 14:28 +0000
              Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-16 22:57 +0800
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-06-16 20:27 +0200
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-17 11:05 +0800
          Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Tim Slattery <TimSlattery@utexas.edu> - 2026-06-17 10:08 -0400
            Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2026-06-17 17:05 +0000
            Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-06-18 01:53 +0200
              Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-18 11:51 +0800
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-18 11:54 +0800
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-06-18 08:48 +0200
                Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey... prayer answered? Wish fulfilled? "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-18 17:56 +0800
  Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. a425couple <a425couple@hotmail.com> - 2026-06-14 14:37 -0700
    Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. croy <croy@spam.invalid.net> - 2026-06-15 08:35 -0700
      Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2026-06-15 16:42 +0000
      Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-06-15 21:30 +0200
        Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-06-16 16:35 -0400
          Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-06-16 22:54 +0200
    Re: 2001:A Space Odyssey, SpaceX, A.I. "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2026-06-16 17:56 +0800

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