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Groups > comp.lang.fortran > #126461

Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile"

From Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com>
Newsgroups comp.lang.fortran, comp.lang.c, comp.lang.c++
Subject Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile"
Date 2026-01-30 14:37 +0100
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <10lic71$1b3n6$6@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References (1 earlier) <10l5ivf$1qmik$1@dont-email.me> <10l61gp$2055l$1@dont-email.me> <10l6gqn$2504g$1@dont-email.me> <10l77c7$2as3t$1@dont-email.me> <10li9q4$23nes$1@dont-email.me>

Cross-posted to 3 groups.

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On 2026-01-30 13:56, Paavo Helde wrote:
> 
> Locales are only useful when displaying info directly for the user to 
> view.

Right. And also for entering data through the UI.

> Alas, most C++ projects are not GUI, but much lower level libraries

Probably.

> where there is no connection between the current machine 
> locale and the locale of the human viewer

Sensibly so.

The system wide setting can be a default (but need not be). Similar
with user specific locale settings.

> who might eventually view the produced data.

As you say initially, it's a feature for the UI. You should separate
the internal data model from the UI data representation level.

> Moreover, most produced text data is consumed by other 
> software nowadays,

This may or may not be true. (But as argument it's anyway irrelevant.)

> not humans, and having to deal with varying locales 
> just breaks or at least complicates the things here.

No. Nothing is broken if designed sensibly. If the software supports
internal communication interfaces these should be specified and used
on both communication sides as defined. If you use (or misuse) the
standard UI for tools' access the tools may and (if necessary) should
control the locale setting on that level to conform to the definition.

> So locale-dependent 
> behavior should not be the default, but rather something to be ordered 
> explicitly and used rarely.

Wrong conclusion based on wrong assumptions or wrong use (or design).

If your software doesn't support locales it's anyway pointless. And
if your software sensibly supports it you typically have control over
it. (Can't tell about Windows, the initially discussed platform, but
I'd doubt that it's broken by design; or is it?)

Janis

> [...]

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Thread

"Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-01-23 21:35 -0600
  Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-24 04:46 +0000
    Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Gary Scott <garylscott@sbcglobal.net> - 2026-01-24 10:11 -0600
  Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-01-25 17:13 +0000
    Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-01-25 15:21 -0600
      Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-01-26 01:00 +0100
        Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-26 15:04 +0000
      Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-26 01:42 +0000
        Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-01-26 00:45 -0600
          Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-01-26 14:17 +0200
            Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-01-26 16:50 -0600
        Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-01-26 09:07 +0100
          Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Paavo Helde <eesnimi@osa.pri.ee> - 2026-01-30 14:56 +0200
            Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-01-30 14:37 +0100
          Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-01-30 20:28 +0000
            Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-01-31 12:50 +0100
              Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" G <g@nowhere.invalid> - 2026-01-31 18:50 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Gary Scott <garylscott@sbcglobal.net> - 2026-01-31 16:10 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" ImperiusDamian <dgwrightauthor@gmail.com> - 2026-01-31 21:08 -0500
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-01 09:06 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2026-02-02 11:18 +0100
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-02 21:23 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2026-02-03 10:33 +0100
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-03 21:29 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-02-01 11:18 +0100
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Gary Scott <garylscott@sbcglobal.net> - 2026-02-01 08:28 -0600
              Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-02-01 09:42 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-02-01 11:35 +0100
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2026-02-01 12:21 -0500
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-02-01 23:01 +0100
      Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-01-26 22:47 +0000
        Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-01-26 16:51 -0600
        Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-27 05:17 +0000
          Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-01-27 06:45 +0000
            Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-01-27 01:46 -0600
              Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-01-27 00:14 -0800
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-27 15:22 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-01-27 12:33 -0800
              Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-01-27 11:04 +0200
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Gary Scott <garylscott@sbcglobal.net> - 2026-01-27 08:35 -0600
          Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-27 15:21 +0000
  Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" 🇵🇱Jacek Marcin Jaworski🇵🇱 <jmj@energokod.gda.pl> - 2026-02-02 21:02 +0100
    Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" 🇵🇱Jacek Marcin Jaworski🇵🇱 <jmj@energokod.gda.pl> - 2026-02-02 21:13 +0100
    Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-02 21:25 +0000
    Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-02-03 10:54 +0200
      Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" 🇵🇱Jacek Marcin Jaworski🇵🇱 <jmj@energokod.gda.pl> - 2026-02-03 10:44 +0100
        Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-02-03 09:47 -0500
          Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" 🇵🇱Jacek Marcin Jaworski🇵🇱 <jmj@energokod.gda.pl> - 2026-02-03 16:02 +0100
            Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-02-04 08:45 -0500
        Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-03 21:32 +0000
          Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" 🇵🇱Jacek Marcin Jaworski🇵🇱 <jmj@energokod.gda.pl> - 2026-02-03 22:56 +0100
            Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-04 00:15 +0000
              Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" 🇵🇱Jacek Marcin Jaworski🇵🇱 <jmj@energokod.gda.pl> - 2026-02-04 09:37 +0100
      Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-03 17:28 -0600
        Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-04 00:14 +0000
          Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-03 20:17 -0600
            Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-04 04:57 +0000
              Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-02-04 08:54 -0500
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-04 16:43 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-05 09:09 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-05 15:47 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-05 22:35 +0000
          Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-02-04 15:44 +0000
            Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-04 16:53 -0600
              Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-05 09:10 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-02-05 12:10 +0200
              Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-02-07 09:23 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-09 15:25 -0600
        Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-02-04 14:24 +0200
          Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" 🇵🇱Jacek Marcin Jaworski🇵🇱 <jmj@energokod.gda.pl> - 2026-02-04 16:57 +0100
          Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" 🇵🇱Jacek Marcin Jaworski🇵🇱 <jmj@energokod.gda.pl> - 2026-02-04 17:16 +0100
            Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-04 16:57 -0600
              Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-05 09:11 +0000
          Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-04 16:55 -0600
            Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-02-05 12:24 +0200
        Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-02-04 19:20 +0000
          Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-04 17:07 -0600
            Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-02-05 07:23 +0000
              Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-05 09:14 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-05 16:01 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-05 22:30 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-05 20:22 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-06 04:50 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-05 23:52 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Harold Stevens <wookie@aspen.localdomain> - 2026-02-06 04:24 -0600
              Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-02-05 12:02 +0200
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-02-05 18:38 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-02-05 21:07 +0200
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-02-05 19:36 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" "Steven G. Kargl" <sgk@REMOVEtroutmask.apl.washington.edu> - 2026-02-05 22:01 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Radey Shouman <shouman@comcast.net> - 2026-02-06 11:29 -0500
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Gary Scott <garylscott@sbcglobal.net> - 2026-02-06 13:20 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-02-06 19:43 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" "David Jones" <dajhawk18xx@@nowhere.com> - 2026-02-06 20:48 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-13 17:20 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-13 17:21 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" "Steven G. Kargl" <sgk@REMOVEtroutmask.apl.washington.edu> - 2026-02-06 21:41 +0000
              Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-02-05 11:13 +0100
              Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-05 15:58 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-02-07 19:15 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-07 20:34 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-02-08 08:58 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2026-02-08 04:07 -0800
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-02-08 15:39 +0200
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-08 23:35 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-09 15:33 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-10 20:55 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-10 18:57 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-11 05:57 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-02-11 14:32 +0100
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-02-11 20:46 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-09 15:29 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-02-10 06:10 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-09 15:32 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-02-10 06:07 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-10 20:17 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-10 20:07 -0600
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-02-11 05:54 +0000
                Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-02-11 14:42 +0100
    Re: "Internationalis(z)ing Code - Computerphile" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2026-02-03 17:32 -0600

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