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Groups > comp.theory > #135841
| From | Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | comp.theory |
| Subject | Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings |
| Date | 2025-11-17 10:38 +0200 |
| Organization | - |
| Message-ID | <10femun$neji$1@dont-email.me> (permalink) |
| References | (12 earlier) <10f7fmh$2tdq1$2@dont-email.me> <10f9klg$3ebts$1@dont-email.me> <10fa986$3jtll$1@dont-email.me> <10fc4l6$2073$1@dont-email.me> <10fdp15$gub4$1@dont-email.me> |
On 2025-11-17 00:08:03 +0000, olcott said: > On 11/16/2025 3:14 AM, Mikko wrote: >> On 2025-11-15 16:20:21 +0000, olcott said: >> >>> On 11/15/2025 4:29 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>> On 2025-11-14 14:52:00 +0000, olcott said: >>>> >>>>> On 11/14/2025 3:11 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>>> On 2025-11-13 15:44:26 +0000, olcott said: >>>>>> >>>>>>> On 11/13/2025 2:46 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>>>>> On 2025-11-12 12:59:25 +0000, olcott said: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 11/12/2025 1:20 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>>>>>>> On 2025-11-11 13:06:12 +0000, olcott said: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On 11/11/2025 3:07 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> On 2025-11-10 14:58:39 +0000, olcott said: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On 11/10/2025 3:48 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2025-11-09 12:56:01 +0000, olcott said: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 11/9/2025 4:08 AM, Mikko wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2025-11-08 18:46:03 +0000, olcott said: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ChatGPT 5.0 fully evaluated all of the details of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> how "true on the basis of meaning" can be computed >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from finite strings. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Whether "true on the basis of meaning" is computable depends on very >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> much of the meaning. If the meaning is neither true or false the it >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> does not make much sense to ask and answer whether it is true. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The meaning of a word is the actual meaning of the word, this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is always true. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> For most words the actual meaning is neither 'true' nor 'false'. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Was any evidence of election fraud that could have possibly >>>>>>>>>>>>> changed the outcome of the 2020 presidential election? >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> That is a question. A question is neither true nor false. Instead it >>>>>>>>>>>> is a request for an answer. For that kind of question the requested >>>>>>>>>>>> answer is either "yes" or "no". >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> All we need now is a way to make LLM system completely >>>>>>>>>>>>> reliable. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> The simplest way to achieve that is to restrict their language so that >>>>>>>>>>>> they never claim or assert anything, and never answer questions. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> The LLM systems understand how I can make them reliable. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> You can't make them better. Only their maitainers can do that. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> The architecture that I proposed guarantees correct >>>>>>>>> reasoning. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> You have neither specified in which sense your "correct reasoning" >>>>>>>> is correct nor proven that it is correct in that sense. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Whenever a cycle is detected in the directed graph >>>>>>> of the evaluation sequence of a formal expression >>>>>>> occurs you are too confused to understand what any >>>>>>> of those words mean. >>>>>> >>>>>> Off topic, as is any statement about people. >>>>> >>>>> Within any honest dialogue the prerequisite knowledge >>>>> of the participants is relevant. >>>> >>>> Discussion of the knowledge of participants is off-topic. >>> >>> Then an honest dialogue cannot possibly occur. >> >> Of course it can. A honest dialog is not common but it is possible. >> For example recent dicussions in sci.physics.relativity have been >> quite honest. > > For any honest dialogue to possibly occur all > of the participants must have the required > prerequisite knowledge. For formal discussions > proof of this is required for participation. The discussions in sci.physics.relativity mentioned above show that honest dicussion is possible even when some participants don't have much knowledge. -- Mikko
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Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-08 12:46 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-11-08 21:48 +0000
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-08 16:41 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-11-08 15:23 -0800
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-11-08 15:26 -0800
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2025-11-09 12:08 +0200
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-09 06:56 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2025-11-10 11:48 +0200
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-10 08:58 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2025-11-11 11:07 +0200
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-11 07:06 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-11-11 13:24 -0800
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2025-11-12 09:20 +0200
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-12 06:59 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2025-11-13 10:46 +0200
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-13 09:44 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-11-13 17:50 +0000
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-13 15:13 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings wij <wyniijj5@gmail.com> - 2025-11-14 05:35 +0800
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2025-11-14 11:11 +0200
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-14 08:52 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2025-11-15 12:29 +0200
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-15 10:20 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2025-11-16 11:14 +0200
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-16 18:08 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2025-11-17 10:38 +0200
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-17 07:24 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings --- correction olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-17 07:26 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings --- correction dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-11-17 08:35 -0500
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2025-11-18 12:15 +0200
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-18 10:40 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2025-11-19 12:05 +0200
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-19 07:05 -0600
Re: Making true on the basis of meaning computable from finite strings Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2025-11-20 11:02 +0200
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