Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It?

From	Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid>
Newsgroups	comp.arch
Subject	Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It?
Date	2025-05-29 20:25 -0700
Organization	A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID	<101b8ei$a20i$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References	(12 earlier) <100vm4s$16av3$1@paganini.bofh.team> <100vq44$1h5c4$1@dont-email.me> <1012euo$1fclb$1@paganini.bofh.team> <1012lf9$23l9t$2@dont-email.me> <101b2dk$4vts$2@dont-email.me>

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On 5/29/2025 6:42 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> On Mon, 26 May 2025 14:12:09 -0700, Stephen Fuld wrote:
> 
>> That makes sense, but even if the advantage is small, the cost is
>> essentially zero, so why not do it.
> 
> Additional complexity, leading to additional points of failure.

I was too flip in my answer, so here is, I think, a better one.  The 
"it" to which we are referring here is caching of write data.

So let's look at a possible scenario.  Let's say the heads are at 
cylinder 100.  A write comes in for data that is at cylinder 300. 
Without write caching, the disk will move the heads to cylinder 300. 
Now lets say the next request is a read for data at cylinder 150.  If 
the write had been cached, the disk can handle the read with only a 50 
cylinder move, then the write with a 150 cylinder move for a total of 
200 cylinders.  Without write caching, the first move is 200 cylinders 
for the write, followed by 150 back for the read for a total of 350. 
Thus the read data, which is presumably more time critical, is delayed.

Overall, write caching improves performance, but if you don't want it, 
then you can essentially not use it, either by forcing the writes to go 
to the media, or not using command queuing at all.

-- 
  - Stephen Fuld
(e-mail address disguised to prevent spam)

Thread

Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2025-05-10 11:38 +0000
  Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? mitchalsup@aol.com (MitchAlsup1) - 2025-05-11 00:04 +0000
    Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2025-05-11 13:59 +0000
      Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Al Kossow <aek@bitsavers.org> - 2025-05-11 07:47 -0700
        Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-11 23:46 +0000
          Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? mitchalsup@aol.com (MitchAlsup1) - 2025-05-12 00:30 +0000
            Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-12 01:19 +0000
              Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? mitchalsup@aol.com (MitchAlsup1) - 2025-05-12 02:03 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-12 22:34 +0000
              Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2025-05-12 08:05 +0200
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2025-05-12 08:41 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-12 22:39 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-12 17:14 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-12 22:35 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2025-05-12 21:50 -0400
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-13 03:03 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2025-05-12 23:25 -0400
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-13 08:39 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? EricP <ThatWouldBeTelling@thevillage.com> - 2025-05-13 12:55 -0400
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2025-05-13 07:40 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-13 08:12 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-13 08:33 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-14 00:18 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-13 17:49 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-18 01:35 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2025-05-18 14:10 -1000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-18 18:41 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> - 2025-05-19 21:46 +0100
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-19 14:58 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> - 2025-05-20 11:22 +0100
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2025-05-20 16:38 -1000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-20 20:49 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? mitchalsup@aol.com (MitchAlsup1) - 2025-05-19 00:18 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-19 01:13 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? mitchalsup@aol.com (MitchAlsup1) - 2025-05-19 23:33 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-20 00:36 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2025-05-20 00:16 -0500
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                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2025-05-20 12:42 -0500
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-20 11:35 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-21 00:29 +0000
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                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? EricP <ThatWouldBeTelling@thevillage.com> - 2025-05-21 12:47 -0400
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2025-05-21 17:19 +0000
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                Re: fuzzy disks, Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-28 09:20 -0700
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                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2025-05-25 23:58 -0400
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2025-05-26 15:36 -1000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lars Poulsen <lars@cleo.beagle-ears.com> - 2025-05-26 20:14 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-26 07:13 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-26 07:31 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2025-05-26 19:20 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-26 14:12 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-30 01:42 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-29 20:25 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-30 05:53 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2025-05-31 12:53 -1000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2025-06-02 18:04 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-06-03 07:14 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2025-05-25 15:21 -0500
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2025-05-26 06:46 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2025-05-26 16:06 +0300
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2025-05-26 16:30 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-26 13:00 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-26 13:04 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-26 14:15 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-26 15:20 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-26 15:40 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-26 16:02 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-26 16:07 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Brett <ggtgp@yahoo.com> - 2025-05-27 18:40 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-27 12:28 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-27 12:42 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Brett <ggtgp@yahoo.com> - 2025-05-29 05:10 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-29 15:31 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Brett <ggtgp@yahoo.com> - 2025-05-30 01:17 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-29 15:33 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-27 12:28 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? mitchalsup@aol.com (MitchAlsup1) - 2025-05-26 23:12 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2025-05-26 23:32 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2025-05-26 19:00 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2025-05-27 09:43 +0200
                Drive Caches (Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, ...) Lars Poulsen <lars@cleo.beagle-ears.com> - 2025-05-25 20:55 +0000
                Re: Drive Caches (Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, ...) Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2025-05-26 00:07 -0400
                Re: Drive Caches (Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, ...) BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2025-05-26 00:59 -0500
                Re: Drive Caches (Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, ...) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2025-05-26 07:13 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-23 22:19 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? EricP <ThatWouldBeTelling@thevillage.com> - 2025-05-23 20:51 -0400
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-17 23:57 +0000
  Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? quadibloc <quadibloc@gmail.com> - 2025-05-19 21:33 +0000
    Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-20 00:43 +0000
      Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2025-05-20 13:53 +0000
        Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2025-05-20 13:19 -0500
          Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2025-05-20 16:06 -0400
            Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? mitchalsup@aol.com (MitchAlsup1) - 2025-05-20 22:11 +0000
              Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? David Schultz <david.schultz@earthlink.net> - 2025-05-20 19:34 -0500
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-21 01:00 +0000
              Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-21 00:34 +0000
              Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2025-05-20 21:30 -0400
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-20 18:39 -0700
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-21 03:41 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2025-05-21 12:09 -0400
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2025-05-21 15:30 -0400
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-22 02:45 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2025-05-21 07:06 -1000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? jseigh <jseigh_es00@xemaps.com> - 2025-05-21 17:32 -0400
              Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2025-05-21 07:05 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-22 02:48 +0000
              Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2025-05-21 08:23 -0400
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? mitchalsup@aol.com (MitchAlsup1) - 2025-05-21 14:08 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-22 02:49 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? mitchalsup@aol.com (MitchAlsup1) - 2025-05-22 17:34 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2025-05-22 17:42 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? mitchalsup@aol.com (MitchAlsup1) - 2025-05-23 01:54 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-22 22:42 +0000
                Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2025-05-22 23:47 -0400
            Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-05-21 00:32 +0000
              Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-20 18:29 -0700
          Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-20 18:04 -0700
            Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-22 16:49 -0700
              Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-22 18:04 -0700
  Re: Is Parallel Programming Hard, And, If So, What Can You Do About It? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-05-20 18:31 -0700

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