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Groups > uk.tech.broadcast > #70556 > unrolled thread

Re: OT - TV

Started by"J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk>
First post2026-09-26 19:08 +0100
Last post2026-09-27 13:12 +0200
Articles 20 on this page of 373 — 34 participants

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Contents

  Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-26 19:08 +0100
    Re: OT - TV Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> - 2026-09-26 19:58 +0100
      Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-26 20:30 +0100
        Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-09-27 09:39 +0100
        Re: OT - TV JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-09-28 08:08 +0100
    Re: OT - TV Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2026-09-26 19:10 +0000
      Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-26 21:02 +0100
        Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-26 21:03 +0100
          Re: OT - TV Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2026-09-27 18:20 +0000
            Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-28 16:26 +0100
              Re: OT - TV Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2026-09-28 15:45 +0000
              Re: OT - TV Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-09-28 16:30 +0000
                Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-28 17:46 +0100
                  Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-28 22:25 +0100
                    Re: OT - TV NY <me@privacy.net> - 2026-09-29 16:40 +0100
                      OT - Lehrer (was: Re: OT - TV) "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-29 16:58 +0100
                        Re: OT - Lehrer (was: Re: OT - TV) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-09-29 18:19 +0000
                          Re: OT - Lehrer "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-29 20:57 +0100
                          Re: OT - Lehrer Charles Hope <clh@candehope.me.uk> - 2026-09-29 20:00 +0000
                          Re: OT - Lehrer (was: Re: OT - TV) André Coutanche <acoutanche@gmx.co.uk> - 2026-09-29 21:50 +0100
                            Re: OT - Lehrer NY <me@privacy.net> - 2026-09-29 22:33 +0100
                              Re: OT - Lehrer Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-09-29 22:48 +0000
                                Re: OT - Lehrer "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-30 01:07 +0100
                                  Re: OT - Lehrer John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-09-30 15:51 -0700
                                    Re: OT - Lehrer NY <me@privacy.net> - 2026-10-01 10:57 +0100
                                Re: OT - Lehrer NY <me@privacy.net> - 2026-09-30 08:10 +0100
                              Re: OT - Lehrer "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-30 01:39 +0100
                                Re: OT - Lehrer Roger Blake <rogblake@iname.invalid> - 2026-09-30 00:46 +0000
                        Re: OT - Lehrer NY <me@privacy.net> - 2026-09-29 22:39 +0100
                        Re: OT - Lehrer Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2026-09-30 12:25 +0000
                          Re: OT - Lehrer "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-30 13:34 +0100
                          Re: OT - Lehrer The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-30 14:31 +0100
                            Re: OT - Lehrer NY <me@privacy.net> - 2026-09-30 14:47 +0100
                              Re: OT - Lehrer John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-09-30 14:58 +0100
                                Re: OT - Lehrer "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-01 02:36 +0100
                                  Re: OT - Lehrer NY <me@privacy.net> - 2026-10-01 11:12 +0100
                                    Re: OT - Lehrer Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2026-10-01 14:35 +0000
                                      Re: OT - Lehrer NY <me@privacy.net> - 2026-10-01 16:14 +0100
                                        Re: OT - Lehrer Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2026-10-01 17:35 +0000
                                        Re: OT - Lehrer Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-01 17:53 +0000
                                          Re: OT - Lehrer John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-01 19:03 +0100
                                            Re: OT - Lehrer "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-01 21:50 +0100
                                            Re: OT - Lehrer The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-02 12:25 +0100
                                    Re: OT - Lehrer marika <marika5000@gmail.com> - 2026-10-09 00:03 +0000
                                      Song of the Track/Ceol na Loidhne JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-10-09 15:27 +0100
                                        Re: Song of the Track/Ceol na Loidhne Chris J Dixon <chris@cdixon.me.uk> - 2026-10-10 09:23 +0100
                                          Re: Song of the Track/Ceol na Loidhne John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-10 10:37 +0100
                              Re: OT - Lehrer The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-01 11:13 +0100
                                Re: OT - Lehrer NY <me@privacy.net> - 2026-10-01 11:51 +0100
                            Re: OT - Lehrer John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-09-30 14:55 +0100
                            Re: OT - Lehrer Charles Hope <clh@candehope.me.uk> - 2026-09-30 14:15 +0000
      Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-09-27 19:58 +1000
        Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-27 12:52 +0100
          Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-09-27 22:13 +1000
            Re: OT - TV Rink <rink.hof.haalditmaarweg@planet.nl> - 2026-10-08 21:51 +0200
              Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-12 18:47 +1100
                Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-12 11:47 +0100
                Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-12 11:58 +0100
                  Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-12 22:37 +1100
                    Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-12 13:17 +0100
      [OT] - audio distribution, Rediffusion-style (was: Re: OT - TV) "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-28 16:43 +0100
        Re: [OT] - audio distribution, Rediffusion-style Rink <rink.hof.haalditmaarweg@planet.nl> - 2026-10-08 22:22 +0200
    Re: OT - TV Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> - 2026-09-27 11:44 +0100
      Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-27 16:12 +0100
        Re: OT - TV Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> - 2026-09-27 18:12 +0100
          Re: OT - TV Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-09-27 18:23 +0100
          Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-27 18:34 +0100
            Re: OT - TV Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> - 2026-09-28 14:03 +0100
              Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-09-28 15:56 +0100
              Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-28 16:46 +0100
                Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-09-28 17:16 +0100
                Re: OT - TV Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> - 2026-09-29 12:01 +0100
                  Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-29 13:05 +0100
                    Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-09-29 13:25 +0100
                    Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-29 14:13 +0100
                    Re: OT - TV The Other John <nomail@here.org> - 2026-09-29 16:53 +0100
                      Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-29 17:12 +0100
                        Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-09-30 10:22 +0100
                          Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-30 13:36 +0100
                    Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-30 11:23 +0200
                      Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-30 11:48 +0100
                      Re: OT - TV Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-09-30 07:37 -0400
                        Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-30 14:28 +0100
                          Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 00:35 +0200
                            Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-01 02:15 +0100
                              Re: OT - TV Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-10-01 00:15 -0400
                              Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-01 12:50 +0100
                              Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 14:24 +0200
                                Re: OT - TV Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> - 2026-10-01 17:17 +0100
                            Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-01 12:48 +0100
                              Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-01 13:10 +0100
                                Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-01 13:42 +0100
                            Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-01 13:32 +0100
                            Re: OT - TV Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2026-10-01 14:52 +0000
                              Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-03 21:10 +1000
                                Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-03 13:39 +0200
                                  Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-04 21:26 +1100
                                    Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-04 13:19 +0200
                                      Re: OT - TV Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-10-04 10:36 -0400
                                        Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-04 19:18 +0200
                                Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-03 12:47 +0100
                                Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-03 12:50 +0100
                                  Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-03 13:09 +0100
                                    Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-03 15:59 +0100
                                      Re: OT - TV Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-03 15:56 +0000
                                        Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-03 17:19 +0100
                                          Re: OT - TV Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-04 10:54 +0000
                                            Re: OT - TV c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-05 01:27 -0400
                                              Re: OT - TV Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-05 07:55 +0000
                                                Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-05 14:54 +0200
                                                  Re: OT - TV Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-05 15:17 +0000
                                              Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-05 11:29 +0100
                                                Re: OT - TV Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-10-05 11:46 +0100
                                                  Re: OT - TV JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-10-06 17:51 +0100
                                                    Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-06 18:58 +0100
                                                    Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-06 20:36 +0200
                                                      Re: OT - TV JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-10-07 09:00 +0100
                                                        Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-07 11:04 +0100
                                                          Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-07 12:21 +0200
                                                            Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-07 11:54 +0100
                                                              Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-07 12:37 +0100
                                                                Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-08 13:51 +0200
                                                                  Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-08 13:04 +0100
                                                                    Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-08 22:02 +0100
                                                                      Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-08 22:15 +0100
                                                                        Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-09 22:22 +0200
                                                                          Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-09 22:33 +0100
                                                                            Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-10 19:20 +0200
                                                                    Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-09 22:20 +0200
                                                                      Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-09 22:32 +0100
                                                                        Re: OT - TV Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-09 23:08 +0000
                                                                          Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-10 19:34 +0200
                                                                            Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-11 21:15 +1100
                                                                              Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-11 11:23 +0100
                                                                                Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-11 22:15 +1100
                                                                                  Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-11 14:52 +0100
                                                                                  Re: OT - TV Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-11 15:54 +0000
                                                                                    Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-11 18:35 +0100
                                                                                      Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-11 18:52 +0100
                                                                                        Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-11 20:10 +0100
                                                                                          Re: OT - TV NY <me@privacy.net> - 2026-10-11 20:54 +0100
                                                                                          Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-12 18:11 +1100
                                                                                      Re: OT - TV Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-12 02:24 +0000
                                                                                        Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-12 07:23 +0100
                                                                                          Re: OT - TV c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-12 03:13 -0400
                                                                                          Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-12 21:07 +1100
                                                                                            Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-12 18:21 +0100
                                                                                              Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-13 22:36 +1100
                                                                                        Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-12 18:17 +1100
                                                                                        Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-12 10:55 +0100
                                                                                      Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-12 18:09 +1100
                                                                                    Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-12 17:58 +1100
                                                                              Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-11 15:18 +0200
                                                                                Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-11 14:59 +0100
                                                                                  Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-11 21:29 +0200
                                                                                    Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-11 22:17 +0100
                                                                                    Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-11 23:46 +0100
                                                                                      Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-12 10:48 +0100
                                                                                        Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-12 18:28 +0100
                                                                                          Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-12 19:11 +0100
                                                                                          Re: OT - TV Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-12 22:35 +0000
                                                                                            Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-13 01:26 +0100
                                                                                              Re: OT - TV Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-13 06:16 +0000
                                                                                                Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-13 08:27 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-13 18:40 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-13 20:54 +0200
                                                                                                      Re: OT - TV Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-10-13 19:57 +0100
                                                                                                        Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-13 21:10 +0200
                                                                                                          Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-15 00:06 +1100
                                                                                                      Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-13 20:02 +0100
                                                                                                      Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-13 20:21 +0100
                                                                                                        Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-13 22:09 +0200
                                                                                                          Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-13 22:02 +0100
                                                                                                            Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-15 00:09 +1100
                                                                                                              Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-14 14:31 +0100
                                                                                              Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-13 08:26 +0100
                                                                                                Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-13 17:21 +0000
                                                                                              Re: OT - TV JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-10-13 12:08 +0100
                                                                                                Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-13 13:16 +0200
                                                                                                Re: OT - TV JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-10-13 12:23 +0100
                                                                                                Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-13 18:52 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: OT - TV Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-13 18:16 +0000
                                                                                                    Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-13 19:47 +0100
                                                                                                      Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-13 20:00 +0100
                                                                                                        Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-13 20:28 +0100
                                                                                                          Re: OT - TV c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-13 22:51 -0400
                                                                                                            Re: OT - TV Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-10-14 00:32 -0400
                                                                                                              Re: OT - TV c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-14 01:26 -0400
                                                                                                                Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-14 14:08 +0100
                                                                                                                  Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-14 18:58 +0000
                                                                                                              Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-14 09:07 +0100
                                                                                                                Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-14 18:43 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: OT - TV Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-10-14 08:29 +0100
                                                                                                              Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-14 18:04 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-14 16:21 +0200
                                                                                                              Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-14 18:48 +0000
                                                                                                          Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-14 04:56 +0000
                                                                                                          Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-14 09:09 +0100
                                                                                                        Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-14 04:48 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-14 04:32 +0000
                                                                                                    Re: OT - TV Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-10-13 16:28 -0400
                                                                                                  Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-13 19:36 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-13 20:08 +0100
                                                                                                      Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-14 05:07 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-14 09:09 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-13 20:59 +0200
                                                                                                    Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-13 20:16 +0100
                                                                                                      Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-13 22:16 +0200
                                                                                                        Re: OT - TV Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-10-13 23:15 +0100
                                                                                                          Re: OT - TV Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-13 23:52 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: OT - TV Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-10-13 20:39 -0400
                                                                                                              Re: OT - TV Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-14 03:21 +0000
                                                                                                                Re: OT - TV c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-14 01:18 -0400
                                                                                                              Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-14 12:42 +0200
                                                                                                            Re: OT - TV Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-10-14 08:02 +0100
                                                                                                              Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-14 09:16 +0100
                                                                                                              Re: OT - TV c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-14 04:42 -0400
                                                                                                                Re: OT - TV Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-10-14 14:18 +0100
                                                                                                                Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-14 14:45 +0100
                                                                                                                  Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-14 16:25 +0200
                                                                                                            Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-14 12:34 +0200
                                                                                                          Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-14 12:31 +0200
                                                                                                            Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-14 13:21 +0100
                                                                                                              Re: OT - TV Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-10-14 13:31 +0100
                                                                                                                Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-14 14:48 +0100
                                                                                                              Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-14 18:54 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-14 18:50 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-14 05:14 +0000
                                                                                                    Re: OT - TV JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-10-14 16:09 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: OT - TV Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> - 2026-10-14 11:34 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-14 19:16 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: OT - TV Hank Rogers <Hank@nospam.invalid> - 2026-10-14 16:00 -0500
                                                                                                Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-15 00:19 +1100
                                                                                            Re: OT - TV Spike <aero.spike@mail.com> - 2026-10-13 17:06 +0000
                                                                                          Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-15 00:01 +1100
                                                                                            Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-14 17:26 +0100
                                                                                              Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-14 17:45 +0000
                                                                                            Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-14 17:44 +0000
                                                                                      Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-12 13:25 +0200
                                                                                      Re: OT - TV wolfgang s <see@sig.nature> - 2026-10-13 11:21 +0000
                                                                                        Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-13 14:38 +0100
                                                                                          Re: OT - TV rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-13 16:55 +0000
                                                                                            Re: OT - TV JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-10-14 16:05 +0100
                                                                                          Re: OT - TV wolfgang s <see@sig.nature> - 2026-10-14 09:57 +0000
                                                                                            Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-14 13:16 +0100
                                                                                              Re: OT - TV wolfgang s <see@sig.nature> - 2026-10-14 21:56 +0000
                                                                                              Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-15 12:51 +0100
                                                                                            Re: OT - TV c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-14 23:14 -0400
                                                                                              Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-15 10:26 +0100
                                                                                                Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-15 12:54 +0100
                                                                                              Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-15 15:32 +0200
                                                                                                Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-15 14:57 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-15 16:45 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-15 19:22 +0100
                                                                                              Re: OT - TV Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> - 2026-10-15 17:24 +0100
                                                                                                Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-15 19:26 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: OT - TV Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> - 2026-10-16 14:04 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-16 18:31 +0100
                                                                                                      Re: OT - TV Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> - 2026-10-17 11:53 +0100
                                                                                                        Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-18 17:51 +0100
                                                                                                          Re: OT - TV Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> - 2026-10-18 17:53 +0100
                                                                                                            Re: OT - TV Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> - 2026-10-18 17:55 +0100
                                                                                                              Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-18 18:18 +0100
                                                                                                                Re: OT - TV Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> - 2026-10-19 13:54 +0100
                                                                                                                  Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-19 15:36 +0100
                                                                                                      Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 13:16 +0200
                                                                                                Re: OT - TV richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2026-10-16 13:15 +0000
                                                                                                  Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 15:44 +0100
                                                                                              Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-17 23:09 +1100
                                                                                                Re: OT - TV Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> - 2026-10-18 10:45 +0100
                                                                                    Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-12 10:45 +0100
                                                                                      Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-12 21:14 +1100
                                                                                        Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-12 12:03 +0100
                                                                                        Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-12 12:07 +0100
                                                                                        Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-12 13:27 +0200
                                                                                          Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-12 22:46 +1100
                                                                                            Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-12 13:57 +0200
                                                                                Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-12 21:11 +1100
                                                                                  Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-12 13:26 +0200
                                                                        Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-10 03:38 +0100
                                                                          Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-10 19:35 +0200
                                                                        Re: OT - TV Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-10-10 12:44 +0100
                                                                          Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-10 13:29 +0100
                                                                            Re: OT - TV c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-11 00:01 -0400
                                                                              Re: OT - TV Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-11 05:23 +0000
                                                                                Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-12 21:21 +1100
                                                                              Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-11 09:56 +0100
                                                                              Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-12 21:18 +1100
                                                                            Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-11 09:30 +0100
                                                                              Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-11 10:12 +0100
                                                                                Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-11 10:34 +0100
                                                                              Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-11 18:05 +0100
                                                                                Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-12 21:24 +1100
                                                                        Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-10 19:30 +0200
                                                                          Re: OT - TV JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-10-12 19:26 +0100
                                                                            Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-12 19:40 +0100
                                                                              Re: OT - TV JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-10-13 12:03 +0100
                                                                                Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-13 14:31 +0100
                                                                                Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-13 18:20 +0100
                                                                                Re: OT - TV chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2026-10-16 16:14 -0500
                                                                                  Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-17 01:01 +0100
                                                                            Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-12 19:45 +0100
                                                                              Re: OT - TV Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-10-12 19:54 +0100
                                                                              Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-13 08:19 +0100
                                                                                Re: OT - TV chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2026-10-16 16:13 -0500
                                                                                  Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 13:22 +0200
                                                                              Re: OT - TV JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-10-13 12:05 +0100
                                                                                Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-13 14:34 +0100
                                                                            Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-12 21:56 +0200
                                                                  Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-08 15:44 +0100
                                                                    [OT] hybrids (was: Re: OT - TV) "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-08 22:12 +0100
                                                                      Re: [OT] hybrids liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-08 22:42 +0100
                                                            Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-07 12:00 +0100
                                                        Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-07 12:06 +0200
                                                          Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-07 12:02 +0100
                                                            Re: OT - TV Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> - 2026-10-07 15:29 +0100
                                                              Re: OT - TV Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-10-08 15:49 +0100
                                                                Re: OT - TV Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-10-08 13:12 -0400
                                                                Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-08 22:17 +0100
                                                                  Re: OT - TV Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> - 2026-10-09 08:12 +0100
                                                                    Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-10 04:21 +0100
                                                                      Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-10 08:25 +0100
                                                            Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-08 13:54 +0200
                                                    Re: OT - TV Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-10-06 14:40 -0400
                                                    Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-07 08:02 +0100
                                                Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-05 12:47 +0100
                                              Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-06 00:23 +0100
                                                Re: OT - TV Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2026-10-12 21:59 +1100
                                                  Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-12 18:50 +0100
                                      Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-03 18:41 +0100
                                  Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-03 22:52 +0100
                                    Re: OT - TV Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-10-03 21:24 -0400
                                      Re: OT - TV Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-04 08:08 +0000
                                    Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-04 09:29 +0100
                      Re: OT - TV Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> - 2026-09-30 15:13 +0100
                  Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-09-29 13:16 +0100
                  Re: OT - TV Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-09-29 15:54 +0000
                    Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-29 17:15 +0100
                    Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-30 11:27 +0200
                      Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-09-30 11:13 +0100
                        Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-09-30 11:19 +0100
                          Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-30 11:57 +0100
                            Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-09-30 13:29 +0100
                            Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-09-30 13:54 +0100
                              Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-30 14:34 +0100
                                Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-09-30 18:08 +0100
                                Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-01 02:22 +0100
                                  Re: OT - TV Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-01 06:37 +0000
                                  Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-01 10:32 +0100
                                Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-01 09:41 +0100
                        Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 00:37 +0200
                      Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-30 11:50 +0100
                      Re: OT - TV Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-09-30 13:08 +0000
                        Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 00:50 +0200
                          Re: OT - TV Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-01 06:12 +0000
                            Re: OT - TV c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-01 03:29 -0400
                              Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 14:53 +0200
                            Re: OT - TV Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-10-01 03:32 -0400
                            Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 14:49 +0200
                          Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-01 12:57 +0100
                            Re: OT - TV liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-10-01 13:27 +0100
                            Re: OT - TV "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 15:19 +0200
                            Re: OT - TV Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-01 14:34 +0000
                              Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-01 15:51 +0100
                                Re: OT - TV Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-02 06:52 +0000
                          Re: OT - TV Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-10-04 07:52 +0100
                            Re: OT - TV c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-04 03:15 -0400
                              Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-04 15:51 +0100
                                Re: OT - TV The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-04 18:16 +0100
                                Re: OT - TV Paul Ratcliffe <abuse@orac12.clara34.co56.uk78> - 2026-10-16 18:22 +0000
                                  Re: OT - TV John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2026-10-16 20:32 +0100
                                    Re: OT - TV "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-17 01:55 +0100
    Re: OT - TV "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-27 13:12 +0200

Page 7 of 19 — ← Prev page 1 … 5 6 [7] 8 9 … 19  Next page →


#70749

FromThe Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-10-07 12:37 +0100
Message-ID<11a5at8$2nipf$18@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70746
On 07/10/2026 11:54, John Williamson wrote:
> On 07/10/2026 11:21, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> On 2026-10-07 12:04, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>> On 07/10/2026 09:00, JMB99 wrote:
>>>> On 06/10/2026 19:36, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>>>> Do you consider submarines as "Vehicles"? Because they have been
>>>>> using batteries and continue to do so.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> At least most are 'hybrids'.  The Greenie purists don't like hybrids.
>>>
>>> Of course not. Hybrids actually are practical and mostly work. And
>>> certainly reduce urban emissions mightily
>>>
>>> And you get a good balance between massive acceleration for e,g,
>>> overtaking and having fun, with decent fuel economy in a stop start
>>> scenario, and no worse economy than a similar turbodiesel etc on a
>>> long constant speed run.
>>
>> That's the theory. I have been a fan of hybrids for decades. But they
>> have been perverted: huge cars with tiny batteries that drink gasoline
>> as cossacks, yet get the ECO label.
>>
> Hybrids are intended for use in traffic with frequent stops and starts. 
> The engine only needs enough power to keep it rolling at its maximum 
> speed. The battery only needs to hold enough energy to help accelerate 
> it away to the sped limit from a stop once or twice. As the IC engine is 
> small, it is working at close to its maximum efficiency most of the 
> time, as against the traditional vehicle engine which is pretty close to 
> idling except for a few seconds as you pull away for the lights. This is 
> why the early Toyota Prius taxis could get up to 50 mpg round town and 
> still pull away very quickly. Small engine, big motor and a battery that 
> was almost fully cycled at every junction.
> 
> A well designed hybrid will also recover kinetic energy when you slow down.
> 
> "Plug in" hybrids are, basically, an electric vehicle with a range 
> extender. They use the IC engine at high speed out of town and the 
> electric motor in town to reduce local emissions.
> 
> For long fast trips out of town, you still need a big engine, and the 
> battery is more or less a waste of space. A bus company I used to work 
> for discovered this the expensive way when they bought a batch of hybrid 
> buses for a new inter town route, The engines were over worked when they 
> were out of town so they were using more fuel than the normal ones, and 
> the overload also caused problems witn reliability.

People I know with hybrids say the economy is *no worse* with the hybrid 
on a long trip, at fairly steady legal speeds, than an equivalent 
turbodiesel. It just isn't any *better*.

Where it scores is in town where the regen braking and the ability to 
run off the battery alone for stop start crawl until the battery is 
depleted, when the engine cuts in to recharge the battery.

Typically halving fuel used
Regen braking and no idling is the key

-- 
“The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to 
fill the world with fools.”

Herbert Spencer

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#70762

From"Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2026-10-08 13:51 +0200
Message-ID<nipee4Fla45U2@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#70749
On 2026-10-07 13:37, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 07/10/2026 11:54, John Williamson wrote:
>> On 07/10/2026 11:21, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>> On 2026-10-07 12:04, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>> On 07/10/2026 09:00, JMB99 wrote:
>>>>> On 06/10/2026 19:36, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>>>>> Do you consider submarines as "Vehicles"? Because they have been
>>>>>> using batteries and continue to do so.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> At least most are 'hybrids'.  The Greenie purists don't like hybrids.
>>>>
>>>> Of course not. Hybrids actually are practical and mostly work. And
>>>> certainly reduce urban emissions mightily
>>>>
>>>> And you get a good balance between massive acceleration for e,g,
>>>> overtaking and having fun, with decent fuel economy in a stop start
>>>> scenario, and no worse economy than a similar turbodiesel etc on a
>>>> long constant speed run.
>>>
>>> That's the theory. I have been a fan of hybrids for decades. But they
>>> have been perverted: huge cars with tiny batteries that drink gasoline
>>> as cossacks, yet get the ECO label.
>>>
>> Hybrids are intended for use in traffic with frequent stops and 
>> starts. The engine only needs enough power to keep it rolling at its 
>> maximum speed. The battery only needs to hold enough energy to help 
>> accelerate it away to the sped limit from a stop once or twice. As the 
>> IC engine is small, it is working at close to its maximum efficiency 
>> most of the time, as against the traditional vehicle engine which is 
>> pretty close to idling except for a few seconds as you pull away for 
>> the lights. This is why the early Toyota Prius taxis could get up to 
>> 50 mpg round town and still pull away very quickly. Small engine, big 
>> motor and a battery that was almost fully cycled at every junction.
>>
>> A well designed hybrid will also recover kinetic energy when you slow 
>> down.
>>
>> "Plug in" hybrids are, basically, an electric vehicle with a range 
>> extender. They use the IC engine at high speed out of town and the 
>> electric motor in town to reduce local emissions.
>>
>> For long fast trips out of town, you still need a big engine, and the 
>> battery is more or less a waste of space. A bus company I used to work 
>> for discovered this the expensive way when they bought a batch of 
>> hybrid buses for a new inter town route, The engines were over worked 
>> when they were out of town so they were using more fuel than the 
>> normal ones, and the overload also caused problems witn reliability.
> 
> People I know with hybrids say the economy is *no worse* with the hybrid 
> on a long trip, at fairly steady legal speeds, than an equivalent 
> turbodiesel. It just isn't any *better*.
> 
> Where it scores is in town where the regen braking and the ability to 
> run off the battery alone for stop start crawl until the battery is 
> depleted, when the engine cuts in to recharge the battery.

Some types should do well in hilly country.

> 
> Typically halving fuel used
> Regen braking and no idling is the key
> 


-- 
Cheers,
        Carlos E.R.
        ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.

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#70764

FromThe Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-10-08 13:04 +0100
Message-ID<11a80sh$3pnm3$4@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70762
On 08/10/2026 12:51, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> People I know with hybrids say the economy is *no worse* with the 
>> hybrid on a long trip, at fairly steady legal speeds, than an 
>> equivalent turbodiesel. It just isn't any *better*.
>>
>> Where it scores is in town where the regen braking and the ability to 
>> run off the battery alone for stop start crawl until the battery is 
>> depleted, when the engine cuts in to recharge the battery.
> 
> Some types should do well in hilly country.
> 
Only if you need to use the brakes a lot

>>
>> Typically halving fuel used
>> Regen braking and no idling is the key
>>

-- 
Climate is what you expect but weather is what you get.
Mark Twain

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#70772

From"J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk>
Date2026-10-08 22:02 +0100
Message-ID<11a90dj$7ae1$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70764
On 2026/10/8 13:4:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 08/10/2026 12:51, Carlos E. R. wrote:
[someone else wrote]
>>> Where it scores is in town where the regen braking and the ability to 
>>> run off the battery alone for stop start crawl until the battery is 
>>> depleted, when the engine cuts in to recharge the battery.
>>
>> Some types should do well in hilly country.
>>
> Only if you need to use the brakes a lot
> 
If your journey involves about the same amount of uphill and downhill,
and you're _not_ using the brakes, where is the downhill energy going?
Either engine braking (which is another form of "using the brakes", but
even worse in that it might actually use fuel), or you're accelerating
on the downhill parts and using the speed thus gained to help you on the
uphill - makes you a bit dangerous in the valleys.

>>>
>>> Typically halving fuel used
>>> Regen braking and no idling is the key
>>>
> 

-- 
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()ALIS-Ch++(p)Ar++T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

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#70774

FromThe Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-10-08 22:15 +0100
Message-ID<11a9169$73vs$8@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70772
On 08/10/2026 22:02, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> On 2026/10/8 13:4:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 08/10/2026 12:51, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> [someone else wrote]
>>>> Where it scores is in town where the regen braking and the ability to
>>>> run off the battery alone for stop start crawl until the battery is
>>>> depleted, when the engine cuts in to recharge the battery.
>>>
>>> Some types should do well in hilly country.
>>>
>> Only if you need to use the brakes a lot
>>
> If your journey involves about the same amount of uphill and downhill,
> and you're _not_ using the brakes, where is the downhill energy going?

Do you really not have an answer for that?

You are coasting. The energy goes into the drag just the same as if it 
was an EV

I do it all the time.

> Either engine braking (which is another form of "using the brakes", but
> even worse in that it might actually use fuel), or you're accelerating
> on the downhill parts and using the speed thus gained to help you on the
> uphill - makes you a bit dangerous in the valleys.
> 
No. You are coasting. On a manual in neutral, On an auto, it does it 
'automatically' (sic!)

>>>>
>>>> Typically halving fuel used
>>>> Regen braking and no idling is the key
>>>>
>>
> 

-- 
"If you don’t read the news paper, you are un-informed. If you read the 
news paper, you are mis-informed."

Mark Twain

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#70790

From"Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2026-10-09 22:22 +0200
Message-ID<nit0p0F6jjoU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#70774
On 2026-10-08 23:15, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 08/10/2026 22:02, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
>> On 2026/10/8 13:4:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>> On 08/10/2026 12:51, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> [someone else wrote]
>>>>> Where it scores is in town where the regen braking and the ability to
>>>>> run off the battery alone for stop start crawl until the battery is
>>>>> depleted, when the engine cuts in to recharge the battery.
>>>>
>>>> Some types should do well in hilly country.
>>>>
>>> Only if you need to use the brakes a lot
>>>
>> If your journey involves about the same amount of uphill and downhill,
>> and you're _not_ using the brakes, where is the downhill energy going?
> 
> Do you really not have an answer for that?
> 
> You are coasting. The energy goes into the drag just the same as if it 
> was an EV
> 
> I do it all the time.
> 
>> Either engine braking (which is another form of "using the brakes", but
>> even worse in that it might actually use fuel), or you're accelerating
>> on the downhill parts and using the speed thus gained to help you on the
>> uphill - makes you a bit dangerous in the valleys.
>>
> No. You are coasting. On a manual in neutral, On an auto, it does it 
> 'automatically' (sic!)

Here, if you try to coast, you crash eventually.

Coasting on neutral on down slopes is strongly discouraged in driving 
school. Very, very dangerous.

> 
>>>>>
>>>>> Typically halving fuel used
>>>>> Regen braking and no idling is the key
>>>>>
>>>
>>
> 


-- 
Cheers,
        Carlos E.R.
        ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.

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#70792

FromThe Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-10-09 22:33 +0100
Message-ID<11abmj0$164sk$3@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70790
On 09/10/2026 21:22, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> 
> Here, if you try to coast, you crash eventually.
> 
> Coasting on neutral on down slopes is strongly discouraged in driving 
> school. Very, very dangerous.

Rules are for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men
-- 
In todays liberal progressive conflict-free education system, everyone 
gets full Marx.

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#70804

From"Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2026-10-10 19:20 +0200
Message-ID<in8qpmxbdv.ln2@Telcontar.valinor>
In reply to#70792
On 2026-10-09 23:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 09/10/2026 21:22, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>
>> Here, if you try to coast, you crash eventually.
>>
>> Coasting on neutral on down slopes is strongly discouraged in driving 
>> school. Very, very dangerous.
> 
> Rules are for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men

It was a rule for survival. You are a fool if you break it here.

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.
ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺;

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#70789

From"Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2026-10-09 22:20 +0200
Message-ID<nit0jnF6jjnU3@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#70764
On 2026-10-08 14:04, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 08/10/2026 12:51, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>> People I know with hybrids say the economy is *no worse* with the 
>>> hybrid on a long trip, at fairly steady legal speeds, than an 
>>> equivalent turbodiesel. It just isn't any *better*.
>>>
>>> Where it scores is in town where the regen braking and the ability to 
>>> run off the battery alone for stop start crawl until the battery is 
>>> depleted, when the engine cuts in to recharge the battery.
>>
>> Some types should do well in hilly country.
>>
> Only if you need to use the brakes a lot

No.

In hilly country you first use the motor as a brake, wasting energy to 
the radiator. If that is not enough, you waste energy on the brakes.

With an hybrid, assuming the battery is big enough, you instead store 
energy in the battery, to be used on the next up-slope.

And Spain is very hilly, second to Switzerland in Europe according to 
the school texts of my time.

> 
>>>
>>> Typically halving fuel used
>>> Regen braking and no idling is the key
>>>
> 


-- 
Cheers,
        Carlos E.R.
        ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.

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#70791

FromThe Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-10-09 22:32 +0100
Message-ID<11abmhd$164sk$2@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70789
On 09/10/2026 21:20, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> On 2026-10-08 14:04, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>> Only if you need to use the brakes a lot
> 
> No.
> 
> In hilly country you first use the motor as a brake,
In an automatic car, you do not

End of your thesis.


-- 
In todays liberal progressive conflict-free education system, everyone 
gets full Marx.

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#70793

FromCharlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>
Date2026-10-09 23:08 +0000
Message-ID<MteyS.65606$plMb.52713@fx42.iad>
In reply to#70791
On 2026-10-09, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> On 09/10/2026 21:20, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>
>> On 2026-10-08 14:04, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>
>>> Only if you need to use the brakes a lot
>> 
>> No.
>> 
>> In hilly country you first use the motor as a brake,
>
> In an automatic car, you do not

You can if you want.  I often downshift an automatic
on a downhill grade.

-- 
/~\  Charlie Gibbs                  |  In this world there are
\ /  <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>      |  two kinds of people:
 X   I'm really at ac.dekanfrus     |  1. Those who can extrapolate
/ \  if you read it the right way.  |  from incomplete data.

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#70806

From"Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2026-10-10 19:34 +0200
Message-ID<bi9qpmx591.ln2@Telcontar.valinor>
In reply to#70793
On 2026-10-10 01:08, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
> On 2026-10-09, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> 
>> On 09/10/2026 21:20, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>
>>> On 2026-10-08 14:04, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>
>>>> Only if you need to use the brakes a lot
>>>
>>> No.
>>>
>>> In hilly country you first use the motor as a brake,
>>
>> In an automatic car, you do not
> 
> You can if you want.  I often downshift an automatic
> on a downhill grade.

The only automatic car I have driven was recently a Fiat 600e that I 
rented. Electric. The regenerative brake is brutal.

You can set the cruise controller to 90km/h on a 2000 thousand meter 
high sierra, and it will keep the speed both going up or down. I tested it.

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.
ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺;

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#70815

FromDaniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org>
Date2026-10-11 21:15 +1100
Message-ID<11afnkn$2hgt3$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70806
On 11/10/2026 4:34 am, Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 2026-10-10 01:08, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
>> On 2026-10-09, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>> On 09/10/2026 21:20, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>>> On 2026-10-08 14:04, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Only if you need to use the brakes a lot
>>>>
>>>> No.
>>>>
>>>> In hilly country you first use the motor as a brake,
>>>
>>> In an automatic car, you do not
>>
>> You can if you want.  I often downshift an automatic
>> on a downhill grade.
> 
> The only automatic car I have driven was recently a Fiat 600e that I 
> rented. Electric. The regenerative brake is brutal.
> 
> You can set the cruise controller to 90km/h on a 2000 thousand meter 
> high sierra, and it will keep the speed both going up or down. I tested it.
> 
Are you sure, Carlos??

DuckDuckGo suggests Mount Everest (highest point on Earth) is only 8,849 
mtrs high .... somewhat less than your "2000 thousand meter high 
sierra". ;-P

Or are you meaning "2000 thousand meter on the high sierra"??

-- 
Daniel70

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#70816

FromThe Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-10-11 11:23 +0100
Message-ID<11afo3s$2hias$2@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70815
On 11/10/2026 11:15, Daniel70 wrote:
>> The only automatic car I have driven was recently a Fiat 600e that I 
>> rented. Electric. The regenerative brake is brutal.
>>
>> You can set the cruise controller to 90km/h on a 2000 thousand meter 
>> high sierra, and it will keep the speed both going up or down. I 
>> tested it.
>>
> Are you sure, Carlos??
> 
> DuckDuckGo suggests Mount Everest (highest point on Earth) is only 8,849 
> mtrs high .... somewhat less than your "2000 thousand meter high 
> sierra". 😜
> 
That's not fair! English is not his first language.

BUT daily I set my cruise control to 30mph and the only hill within 
miles will have the car at 35mph with the engine idling every time I go 
down it

> Or are you meaning "2000 thousand meter on the high sierra"??

You know what he means: 2000 metre high Sierra

And a typical meter is only about 4cm high and comes with a red lead and 
a black lead. :-)


-- 
WOKE is an acronym... Without Originality, Knowledge or Education.

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#70817

FromDaniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org>
Date2026-10-11 22:15 +1100
Message-ID<11afr48$2iu8d$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70816
On 11/10/2026 9:23 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 11/10/2026 11:15, Daniel70 wrote:
>>> The only automatic car I have driven was recently a Fiat 600e that I 
>>> rented. Electric. The regenerative brake is brutal.
>>>
>>> You can set the cruise controller to 90km/h on a 2000 thousand meter 
>>> high sierra, and it will keep the speed both going up or down. I 
>>> tested it.
>>>
>> Are you sure, Carlos??
>>
>> DuckDuckGo suggests Mount Everest (highest point on Earth) is only 
>> 8,849 mtrs high .... somewhat less than your "2000 thousand meter high 
>> sierra". 😜
>>
> That's not fair! English is not his first language.

Correct .... and the only way he/one can improve themselves is to be 
corrected when they make an error. Isn't that what Teachers are paid to 
do .... Oh, and Parents, too, although their Pay might not be so good. ;-)

> BUT daily I set my cruise control to 30mph and the only hill within 
> miles will have the car at 35mph with the engine idling every time I go 
> down it

Yeap, I've noticed that as well .... and my car struggles to maintain 
the set speed on the way up.

>> Or are you meaning "2000 thousand meter on the high sierra"??
> 
> You know what he means: 2000 metre high Sierra
> 
> And a typical meter is only about 4cm high and comes with a red lead and 
> a black lead. :-)

Oh!! That must be Modern Tech .... when I used AVO meters (thirty-odd 
years ago) they were six cm or more deep. ;-P

But the Red and Black leads were pretty common. (I think I had a Green 
lead at one stage.)
-- 
Daniel70

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#70819

FromThe Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-10-11 14:52 +0100
Message-ID<11ag4bc$2m7ll$4@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70817
On 11/10/2026 12:15, Daniel70 wrote:
> On 11/10/2026 9:23 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 11/10/2026 11:15, Daniel70 wrote:
>>>> The only automatic car I have driven was recently a Fiat 600e that I 
>>>> rented. Electric. The regenerative brake is brutal.
>>>>
>>>> You can set the cruise controller to 90km/h on a 2000 thousand meter 
>>>> high sierra, and it will keep the speed both going up or down. I 
>>>> tested it.
>>>>
>>> Are you sure, Carlos??
>>>
>>> DuckDuckGo suggests Mount Everest (highest point on Earth) is only 
>>> 8,849 mtrs high .... somewhat less than your "2000 thousand meter 
>>> high sierra". 😜
>>>
>> That's not fair! English is not his first language.
> 
> Correct .... and the only way he/one can improve themselves is to be 
> corrected when they make an error. Isn't that what Teachers are paid to 
> do .... Oh, and Parents, too, although their Pay might not be so good. ;-)
> 
>> BUT daily I set my cruise control to 30mph and the only hill within 
>> miles will have the car at 35mph with the engine idling every time I 
>> go down it
> 
> Yeap, I've noticed that as well .... and my car struggles to maintain 
> the set speed on the way up.
> 
Oh I never lose more than 0.5mph

>>> Or are you meaning "2000 thousand meter on the high sierra"??
>>
>> You know what he means: 2000 metre high Sierra
>>
>> And a typical meter is only about 4cm high and comes with a red lead 
>> and a black lead. :-)
> 
> Oh!! That must be Modern Tech .... when I used AVO meters (thirty-odd 
> years ago) they were six cm or more deep. ;-P
> 
> But the Red and Black leads were pretty common. (I think I had a Green 
> lead at one stage.)

-- 
Ideas are more powerful than guns. We would not let our enemies have 
guns, why should we let them have ideas?

Josef Stalin

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#70821

FromCharlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>
Date2026-10-11 15:54 +0000
Message-ID<7jOyS.338556$JSFb.202684@fx45.iad>
In reply to#70817
On 2026-10-11, Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:

> On 11/10/2026 9:23 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>> On 11/10/2026 11:15, Daniel70 wrote:
>>
>>>> The only automatic car I have driven was recently a Fiat 600e that I 
>>>> rented. Electric. The regenerative brake is brutal.
>>>>
>>>> You can set the cruise controller to 90km/h on a 2000 thousand meter 
>>>> high sierra, and it will keep the speed both going up or down. I 
>>>> tested it.
>>>>
>>> Are you sure, Carlos??
>>>
>>> DuckDuckGo suggests Mount Everest (highest point on Earth) is only 
>>> 8,849 mtrs high .... somewhat less than your "2000 thousand meter high 
>>> sierra". 😜
>>>
>> That's not fair! English is not his first language.
>
> Correct .... and the only way he/one can improve themselves is to be 
> corrected when they make an error. Isn't that what Teachers are paid to 
> do .... Oh, and Parents, too, although their Pay might not be so good. ;-)

Still, the best teachers manage to point out errors without
making someone feel like an idiot.  Abusive language may be
satisfying, but only for the abuser.  It certainly doesn't
accomplish the goal.

>> And a typical meter is only about 4cm high and comes with a red lead and 
>> a black lead. :-)
>
> Oh!! That must be Modern Tech .... when I used AVO meters (thirty-odd 
> years ago) they were six cm or more deep. ;-P
>
> But the Red and Black leads were pretty common. (I think I had a Green 
> lead at one stage.)

    Red to red and black to black
    Switch it on and stand well back

-- 
/~\  Charlie Gibbs                  |  In this world there are
\ /  <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>      |  two kinds of people:
 X   I'm really at ac.dekanfrus     |  1. Those who can extrapolate
/ \  if you read it the right way.  |  from incomplete data.

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#70824

From"J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk>
Date2026-10-11 18:35 +0100
Message-ID<11aghcb$2riuu$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70821
On 2026/10/11 16:54:43, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
> On 2026-10-11, Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
> 
>> On 11/10/2026 9:23 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
[]

>>> That's not fair! English is not his first language.

Yes, and I try to make allowances. Sometimes, however, the
non-native-speaker _does_ speak English so well that it's easy to forget
- Carlos being a good example. (I think the "2000 thousand" was just a
slip of the mind, the sort that we native-speakers also make.)

>>
>> Correct .... and the only way he/one can improve themselves is to be 
>> corrected when they make an error. Isn't that what Teachers are paid to 

That I do agree with. Any correction I make - unless the error-er is
being particularly obnoxious - is made with educational intent, to help
the error-maker get it right, and thus get less disrespect, in future.
(And anyone else reading who might also be prone to make that error,
especially if it's a common type.)

>> do .... Oh, and Parents, too, although their Pay might not be so good. ;-)

:-)

> 
> Still, the best teachers manage to point out errors without
> making someone feel like an idiot.  Abusive language may be
> satisfying, but only for the abuser.  It certainly doesn't
> accomplish the goal.

I try to show _why_ the error is wrong - with humour, if possible, in
the hope that that will _help_ anyone remember.

> 
>>> And a typical meter is only about 4cm high and comes with a red lead and 
>>> a black lead. :-)
>>
>> Oh!! That must be Modern Tech .... when I used AVO meters (thirty-odd 
>> years ago) they were six cm or more deep. ;-P

More like 10-15 IME!

>>
>> But the Red and Black leads were pretty common. (I think I had a Green 
>> lead at one stage.)
> 
>     Red to red and black to black
>     Switch it on and stand well back
> 
Not heard that one!

green to green or red to red - proceed with caution, slow ahead;
red to green or green to red - perfect safety, go ahead.

Running lights for boats/ships - I think I got it from my father, who
spend a little time in the navy. Unfortunately, I'm never sure whether
I've got it the right way round! (I _think_ I have - if contrasting
colours, then the other vessel is going in the same direction as you, so
collision would be less catastrophic.)
-- 
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()ALIS-Ch++(p)Ar++T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

It is dangerous to be right in matters on which the established
authorities are wrong. ― Voltaire, The Age of Louis XIV (via tnp 2026)

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#70825

FromJohn Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com>
Date2026-10-11 18:52 +0100
Message-ID<nj20ndF6jcU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#70824
On 11/10/2026 18:35, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> On 2026/10/11 16:54:43, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
>> On 2026-10-11, Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On 11/10/2026 9:23 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> []
>
>>>> That's not fair! English is not his first language.
>
> Yes, and I try to make allowances. Sometimes, however, the
> non-native-speaker _does_ speak English so well that it's easy to forget
> - Carlos being a good example. (I think the "2000 thousand" was just a
> slip of the mind, the sort that we native-speakers also make.)
>
>>>
>>> Correct .... and the only way he/one can improve themselves is to be
>>> corrected when they make an error. Isn't that what Teachers are paid to
>
> That I do agree with. Any correction I make - unless the error-er is
> being particularly obnoxious - is made with educational intent, to help
> the error-maker get it right, and thus get less disrespect, in future.
> (And anyone else reading who might also be prone to make that error,
> especially if it's a common type.)
>
>>> do .... Oh, and Parents, too, although their Pay might not be so good. ;-)
>
> :-)
>
>>
>> Still, the best teachers manage to point out errors without
>> making someone feel like an idiot.  Abusive language may be
>> satisfying, but only for the abuser.  It certainly doesn't
>> accomplish the goal.
>
> I try to show _why_ the error is wrong - with humour, if possible, in
> the hope that that will _help_ anyone remember.
>
>>
>>>> And a typical meter is only about 4cm high and comes with a red lead and
>>>> a black lead. :-)
>>>
>>> Oh!! That must be Modern Tech .... when I used AVO meters (thirty-odd
>>> years ago) they were six cm or more deep. ;-P
>
> More like 10-15 IME!
>
>>>
>>> But the Red and Black leads were pretty common. (I think I had a Green
>>> lead at one stage.)
>>
>>     Red to red and black to black
>>     Switch it on and stand well back
>>
> Not heard that one!
>
> green to green or red to red - proceed with caution, slow ahead;
> red to green or green to red - perfect safety, go ahead.
>
> Running lights for boats/ships - I think I got it from my father, who
> spend a little time in the navy. Unfortunately, I'm never sure whether
> I've got it the right way round! (I _think_ I have - if contrasting
> colours, then the other vessel is going in the same direction as you, so
> collision would be less catastrophic.)
>
When boats ahead, show your red.

The full rules are 21 pages of legalese...

-- 
Tciao for Now!

John.

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#70826

From"J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk>
Date2026-10-11 20:10 +0100
Message-ID<11agn00$2u8p7$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70825
On 2026/10/11 18:52:44, John Williamson wrote:
> On 11/10/2026 18:35, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
>> On 2026/10/11 16:54:43, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
[]
>>>     Red to red and black to black
>>>     Switch it on and stand well back
>>>
>> Not heard that one!
>>
>> green to green or red to red - proceed with caution, slow ahead;
>> red to green or green to red - perfect safety, go ahead.
>>
>> Running lights for boats/ships - I think I got it from my father, who
>> spend a little time in the navy. Unfortunately, I'm never sure whether
>> I've got it the right way round! (I _think_ I have - if contrasting
>> colours, then the other vessel is going in the same direction as you, so
>> collision would be less catastrophic.)
>>
> When boats ahead, show your red.

I think we're talking about different lights; the ones I have in mind
show which _side_ of a boat/ship is which - green on one side, red the
other.

> 
> The full rules are 21 pages of legalese...
> 
My dad had a book called "the military Eitzen", which among other things
listed various short international signals and what they mean. My
favourite one meant: "Stop. Stop engines. Do not lower boats. If you
disobey, I will open fire."
-- 
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()ALIS-Ch++(p)Ar++T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Illinc fui et illud feci, habe tunicam?

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