Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor?

Newsgroups	sci.physics
Date	2015-11-13 05:35 -0800
References	<99013d69-da41-4847-a7a4-8d259c4e5743@googlegroups.com> <4c51b93b-02b9-481d-a2cc-59b8f6010c19@googlegroups.com> <9bf1dcbc-4d88-45fe-a6e8-38e3914dff6d@googlegroups.com>
Message-ID	<e2f391bf-e4a2-41cf-ac6b-3214c2acaa9f@googlegroups.com> (permalink)
Subject	Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor?
From	"Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com>

Show all headers | View raw

On Thursday, November 12, 2015 at 4:20:01 PM UTC+2, kqui...@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Thursday, November 12, 2015 at 9:08:39 AM UTC-5, Y.Porat wrote:
> > On Thursday, November 12, 2015 at 3:52:30 PM UTC+2, kqui...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > > Colbert last night had a theoretical physicist (who he said wanted to be a real one soon arf arf) who at Colbert's request formulated general relativity in no-holds-barred language, which I didn't understand of course except that I got the impression that it all boiled down to objects obeying Newton's Law of Motion.
> > > 
> > > Consider that objects also move in curved paths in response to EM forces. Why is that not equivalent to another curvature of space - that caused by EM forces? And so on. All motion is the result of forces applied to objects. Does every force 'curve space'?
> > > 
> > > Why isn't the 'curvature of space', this brilliant insight, merely taking an easy way out? It doesn't really explain anything, it merely puts Newton's Law of Gravitation into other words. It's appealing - as poetry. I'm not sure what
> > > additional information it conveys about the real nature of gravity. It's just one of those brilliant insights we have that we later (if we have common sense and are able to look critically at our own thoughts) regretfully abandon. Maybe like this very post!
> > > 
> > > Is this gravitationally induced curvature of space different from some general univeral curvature of space, in which the whole universe has for example negative or positive curvature (not sure what that means)?
> > > 
> > > This post is merely an attempt at debunking. But I'm really curious about my last question because it could be asked even if the 'curvature of space' caused by gravity was real.
> > 
> > =================================
> > see the Y Circlon mechanism '
> > 
> > one picture is worth a thousand words ...
> > ATB
> > Y.Porat
> > ===========================
> 
> Thanks for the reply. Interesting idea. It does sort of violate Occam's Razor by adding another entity into the equation (Do Not Unnecessarily Add Entities). I'll read it in more detail.
> 
> My point was sort of that curved space doesn't add real understanding to gravity - in the Unified Field Theory sense. I didn't express it clearly, or maybe even at all.
> 
> Maybe there is no understanding other than Newton's Law (or its more complex modern equivalent which introduces not entities but more generalized mathematical structures). Same with particle physics. The math is kind of all there is, right?

========================
Welcome
one of the main points that i revealed is that
sine you cant tell in advance to which side
'space will curve'' 
(those who know basic 3D geometry  understand it
at once 'as bread and butter in basic geometry)
so
since no one can tell 'a priory ' to which direction
space will curves
than
AT THAT MOMENT -SPACE CANNOT BE AN ACTIVE FACTOR
IN FORCE MAKING 
IT CAN  BE AT MOST
A PASSIVE CAUSE TO GRAVITY
WHILE IT IS RATHER MASS THAT IS 'THE MAIN HERO IN THAT 'STORY '

and in a second deeper thought -
(after recovering from the 'shock '
you find that if so
curved space is actually
 A NONSTARTER NONSENSE PHYSICS !!
ie an insult for mankind intelligence -that
didn t get it along more than 100 years !!!

ATB
Y.Porat
=======================================

Thread

general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-12 05:52 -0800
  Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 06:08 -0800
    Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-12 06:19 -0800
      Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 06:53 -0800
        Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-12 08:41 -0800
      Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-13 05:35 -0800
  general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-12 09:05 -0800
    Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-12 09:23 -0800
      Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-12 10:15 -0800
        Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-12 11:50 -0800
    Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 11:54 -0600
      Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-12 10:14 -0800
        Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 12:24 -0600
        Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 13:42 -0600
          Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-12 11:55 -0800
        Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-12 11:43 -0800
        Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-11-17 10:09 -0800
          Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-11-17 10:12 -0800
      Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-12 10:16 -0800
      Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-13 05:50 -0800
    Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-13 05:45 -0800
  Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "reber g=emc^2" <herbertglazier0@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 09:30 -0800
    Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 11:35 -0600
      Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? benj <none@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 14:03 -0500
      Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Mahipal <mahipal7638@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 12:49 -0800
    Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? benj <none@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 13:38 -0500
  Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 13:39 -0600
  Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? omnilobe@gmail.com - 2015-11-12 13:22 -0800
    Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Yousuf Khan <bbbl67@spammenot.yahoo.com> - 2015-11-12 19:47 -0500
    Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "reber g=emc^2" <herbertglazier0@gmail.com> - 2015-11-14 13:40 -0800
      Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Double-A <double-a3@hush.com> - 2015-11-15 12:11 -0800
  Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Yousuf Khan <bbbl67@spammenot.yahoo.com> - 2015-11-12 18:03 -0500
    Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-13 06:37 -0800
    Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2015-11-14 10:00 -0800
  Re: "The speed of time" (the pulse rate). benj <none@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 18:34 -0500
  Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-13 06:19 -0800
    Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-13 10:40 -0600
      Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-13 08:44 -0800
        Re: Curved spaceTIME -- not: "curvature of space = metaphor?". "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-13 13:30 -0800
      Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-13 10:14 -0800
        Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-13 13:40 -0600
          Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-13 13:33 -0800
            Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-13 16:58 -0600
          Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-13 13:34 -0800
            Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-13 16:59 -0600
              Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-13 17:57 -0800
          Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-14 05:38 -0800
            Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-16 10:47 -0600
              Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? benj <none@gmail.com> - 2015-11-16 12:55 -0500
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-16 12:11 -0600
              Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-18 02:19 -0800
            Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-11-16 11:07 -0600
          Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-14 06:21 -0800
            phormeta noTthaTguY <abu.kuanysh05@gmail.com> - 2015-11-14 15:29 -0800
            Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-16 10:57 -0600
              Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-16 12:25 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-11-16 14:45 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-16 15:33 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-17 09:47 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-17 12:13 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-18 05:52 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-18 08:12 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-18 07:27 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-11-18 09:40 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-11-18 09:41 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-18 09:50 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-19 03:59 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-19 10:29 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-19 09:52 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-19 12:24 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-19 11:17 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-19 14:08 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-20 08:46 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-20 14:14 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-11-20 12:25 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-21 05:14 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-23 15:46 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? noTthaTguY <abu.kuanysh05@gmail.com> - 2015-11-23 17:39 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-24 03:44 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Mike Hunt" <invalid@troll-lo-lo.com> - 2015-11-24 21:03 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-11-24 22:02 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-11-25 08:25 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-11-25 07:43 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-11-25 10:36 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-11-25 09:00 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-24 23:26 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-11-25 07:41 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-26 02:57 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? noTthaTguY <abu.kuanysh05@gmail.com> - 2015-11-30 14:14 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-19 10:06 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-19 12:27 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-19 10:15 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Efftard K. Donglemeier" <invalid@troll.com> - 2015-11-19 12:01 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "fuq::hed" <invalid@troll.com> - 2015-11-20 06:30 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-18 10:18 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-18 06:06 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-18 08:14 -0600
              Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? noTthaTguY <abu.kuanysh05@gmail.com> - 2015-11-16 13:33 -0800
              Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-18 02:27 -0800
          Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-15 01:24 -0800
            Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? noTthaTguY <abu.kuanysh05@gmail.com> - 2015-11-15 10:51 -0800
        Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-11-13 15:06 -0600
        Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? noTthaTguY <abu.kuanysh05@gmail.com> - 2015-11-13 13:12 -0800
        Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Steven Carlip <carlip@physics.ucdavis.edu> - 2015-11-17 21:44 -0800
          Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-18 06:34 -0800
            Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-18 09:14 -0600
              Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-18 23:46 -0800
              Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-19 03:49 -0800
            Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Steven Carlip <carlip@physics.ucdavis.edu> - 2015-11-18 21:59 -0800
              Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-11-19 09:28 -0800
              Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-19 10:47 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-19 14:06 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? noTthaTguY <abu.kuanysh05@gmail.com> - 2015-11-19 13:45 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-20 08:23 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-20 11:56 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-21 05:20 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-23 15:48 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-11-23 14:07 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-24 11:15 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-24 17:26 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-25 07:49 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-25 10:58 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-27 01:52 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-27 12:55 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-27 13:09 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-30 14:12 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-04 02:33 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-04 07:40 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-05 05:42 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-06 14:59 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-07 07:56 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-07 11:22 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-08 05:55 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-08 08:59 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-08 11:04 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-08 14:49 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-08 16:16 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-09 01:25 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-09 13:19 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-09 13:09 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-12-13 00:03 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-12-09 13:13 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-08 16:36 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-09 13:11 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-09 07:58 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-12-09 10:07 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-09 08:28 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-12-09 10:50 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-09 13:34 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-10 05:13 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-12-10 08:56 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-12-10 09:00 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-10 09:19 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-09 13:31 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-10 05:48 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-10 09:22 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-11 12:46 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-11 15:40 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-12 05:14 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? noTthaTguY <abu.kuanysh05@gmail.com> - 2015-12-13 19:13 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-14 09:02 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-14 11:01 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-14 14:02 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-14 23:41 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Poutnik <Poutnik4NNTP@gmail.com> - 2015-12-15 11:24 +0100
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-15 07:25 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-12-15 08:47 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-15 12:45 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-15 15:59 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-17 05:19 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-17 09:51 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-12-17 10:05 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-15 12:57 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-15 15:51 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-17 04:46 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-17 09:48 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-12-09 02:47 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-11-25 08:29 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-21 05:35 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-11-23 15:44 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Steven Carlip <carlip@physics.ucdavis.edu> - 2015-11-22 23:15 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Double-A <double-a3@hush.com> - 2015-11-23 14:35 -0800
                Re: Do you _understand_ General Relativity better ? Double-A <double-a3@hush.com> - 2015-11-24 13:46 -0800
                Re: Do you _understand_ General Relativity better ? Double-A <double-a3@hush.com> - 2015-11-24 13:53 -0800
                Re: Prefering the mystical/magical. Double-A <double-a3@hush.com> - 2015-11-28 14:34 -0800
                Re: "Energy that can do work" (eXergy) unites GR and QM, no ? noTthaTguY <abu.kuanysh05@gmail.com> - 2015-11-30 14:17 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-22 23:10 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Steven Carlip <carlip@physics.ucdavis.edu> - 2015-11-22 22:49 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-24 06:35 -0800
                Re: Where does massEnergy end and spaceTime begin ? benj <none@gmail.com> - 2015-11-24 13:57 -0500
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-11-24 11:14 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-11-24 13:17 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-11-24 11:21 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-11-24 13:24 -0600
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-11-24 11:46 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Steven Carlip <carlip@physics.ucdavis.edu> - 2015-11-25 20:55 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-27 08:51 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-11-27 10:06 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "kquirici@yahoo.com" <kquirici@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-27 13:06 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-28 01:28 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Hoofington P. McSnort" <iinvalid@eksample.com> - 2015-11-29 12:22 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-29 22:44 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-24 11:00 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Steven Carlip <carlip@physics.ucdavis.edu> - 2015-11-25 18:19 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-13 13:28 -0800
            Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Steven Carlip <carlip@physics.ucdavis.edu> - 2015-11-18 22:14 -0800
              Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-19 00:40 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Steven Carlip <carlip@physics.ucdavis.edu> - 2015-11-22 22:57 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-24 11:51 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Steven Carlip <carlip@physics.ucdavis.edu> - 2015-11-27 14:48 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-11-30 02:45 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Steven Carlip <carlip@physics.ucdavis.edu> - 2015-12-03 20:58 -0800
                "Energy that can do work" (eXergy) unites GR and QM, no ? Jeff-Relf.Me <@.> - 2015-12-03 21:27 -0800
                "Energy that can do work" (eXergy) unites GR and QM, no ? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-04 01:54 -0800
                Re: What do you think of Darwin, JayMoseley ? benj <none@gmail.com> - 2015-12-04 13:47 -0500
                What do you think of Darwin, JayMoseley ? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-05 05:06 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-04 01:46 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Poutnik <Poutnik4NNTP@gmail.com> - 2015-12-04 12:54 +0100
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? jay moseley <jaymoseley@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-05 05:28 -0800
                Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-04 07:36 -0600
                e.g bingODoG noTthaTguY <abu.kuanysh05@gmail.com> - 2015-12-09 17:14 -0800
              Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-11-19 09:41 -0800
          Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "reber g=emc^2" <herbertglazier0@gmail.com> - 2015-11-27 10:29 -0800
  Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Steven Carlip <carlip@physics.ucdavis.edu> - 2015-11-17 10:01 -0800
    Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-11-17 13:10 -0600
    Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-18 02:35 -0800
  Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2015-11-18 02:15 -0800
  Re: general relativity curvature of space = metaphor? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-13 12:28 -0800

csiph-web