Groups > sci.physics.relativity > #371475

Re: On length contraction

From	Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de>
Newsgroups	sci.physics.relativity
Subject	Re: On length contraction
Date	2015-12-06 08:24 +0100
Message-ID	<dci654Fj075U1@mid.individual.net> (permalink)
References	<480b34d8-19e3-4189-a293-4cf298956389@googlegroups.com>

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Am 05.12.2015 16:55, schrieb kenseto:
> On length contraction according to SR:
> 1. A meter stick M is moving wrt observers A, B and C.
>
> 2. A predicts (SRians claim "Measures") the contracted length of M is 1/gamma_am.
>
> 3. B predicts (SRians claim "Measures") the contracted length of M is 1/gamma_bm.
>
> 4. C predicts (SRians claim "Measures") the contracted length of M is 1/gamma_cm.
>
> It is obvious that M cannot have different contracted material lengths as predicted by the different observers. That means that length contraction in SR is not material (not real). So what is length contraction in SR? SRians claim that length contraction is the geometric projection of the meter stick onto the x-axis of observer's coordinate system.
>

There is a circular definition hidden in the term 'length'.

The meter was once defined by a Platin-Iridum bar in Paris and was meant 
as 1/10000 of the distance from pole to equator.

This was a very pragmatic definition, but difficult to use, since copies 
of this bar were very expensive.

Then the speed of light was used to define length and a certain wave to 
measure time.

Now this is 'circular' and such a length could eventually shrink.

The reason is, that 'speed of light' (used in that definition) already 
contains length and time.

But we have in fact still this bar in Paris.

But could this material object shrink as well?

I would say: yes, it can vanish (in a black hole). After this 'length 
contraction' occurs.


TH

Thread

On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-05 07:55 -0800
  Re: On length contraction Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-12-05 18:40 +0100
  Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-05 15:49 -0800
  Re: On length contraction Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-12-05 22:39 -0600
    Re: On length contraction Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-12-06 10:28 +0100
    Re: On length contraction alsor@interia.pl - 2015-12-06 05:40 -0800
      Re: On length contraction Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-12-06 09:03 -0600
        Re: On length contraction alsor@interia.pl - 2015-12-09 02:37 -0800
      Re: On length contraction fuller.david@hotmail.com - 2015-12-06 08:14 -0800
        Re: On length contraction fuller.david@hotmail.com - 2015-12-06 08:27 -0800
          Re: On length contraction fuller.david@hotmail.com - 2015-12-06 10:37 -0800
    Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-06 06:21 -0800
      Re: On length contraction rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-12-06 08:19 -0800
        Stephane Baune tries to correct Ken Shito and, in the process, embarrasses himself "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2015-12-07 08:35 -0800
  Re: On length contraction Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2015-12-06 08:24 +0100
    Re: On length contraction Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2015-12-06 08:41 +0100
    Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-06 07:06 -0800
    Re: On length contraction Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-12-06 09:20 -0600
      Re: On length contraction Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2015-12-06 21:43 +0100
        Re: On length contraction Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-12-07 09:46 -0600
    Re: On length contraction Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-06 15:09 -0600
      Re: On length contraction Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-12-07 09:49 -0600
  Re: On length contraction rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-12-06 08:10 -0800
    Re: On length contraction Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-12-07 10:01 -0600
      Re: On length contraction rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-12-07 08:28 -0800
        Re: On length contraction Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-07 10:57 -0600
          Re: On length contraction mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2015-12-07 22:58 -0800
          Re: On length contraction Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2015-12-08 08:44 +0100
          Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-08 14:33 -0800
            Re: On length contraction Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-08 17:56 -0600
            Re: On length contraction moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2015-12-10 20:07 +0000
              Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-10 13:13 -0800
                Re: On length contraction Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-10 17:19 -0600
                Re: On length contraction moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2015-12-11 02:45 +0000
                Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-10 21:11 -0800
                Re: On length contraction rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-12-11 06:57 -0800
                Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-11 19:20 -0800
                Re: On length contraction moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2015-12-11 19:55 +0000
                Re: On length contraction Plexippus Kritikos <plexik@laertesegidio.org> - 2015-12-11 23:25 +0000
                Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-11 19:25 -0800
                Re: On length contraction pnalsing@gmail.com - 2015-12-11 19:48 -0800
                Re: On length contraction pnalsing@gmail.com - 2015-12-13 14:33 -0800
                Re: On length contraction moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2015-12-12 17:27 +0000
                Re: On length contraction Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-14 10:12 -0600
                Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-10 21:08 -0800
                Re: On length contraction Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-11 08:04 -0600
    Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-08 14:26 -0800
      Re: On length contraction Plexippus Kritikos <plexik@laertesegidio.org> - 2015-12-08 22:40 +0000
        Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-09 06:50 -0800
          Re: On length contraction alsor@interia.pl - 2015-12-09 09:06 -0800
      Re: On length contraction rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-12-09 09:47 -0800
        Re: On length contraction Plexippus Kritikos <plexik@laertesegidio.org> - 2015-12-09 18:11 +0000
          Re: On length contraction Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-12-09 12:32 -0600
            Re: On length contraction alsor@interia.pl - 2015-12-09 11:18 -0800
            Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-10 06:57 -0800
        Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-10 06:46 -0800
  Re: On length contraction wugi <brol@brol.be> - 2015-12-06 18:18 +0100
    Re: On length contraction Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-12-06 12:35 -0600
      Re: On length contraction wugi <brol@brol.be> - 2015-12-06 21:58 +0100
        Re: On length contraction wugi <brol@brol.be> - 2015-12-06 22:31 +0100
        Re: On length contraction Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-12-07 10:16 -0600
      Re: On length contraction John Gogo <jfgogo22@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-06 13:08 -0800
        Re: On length contraction John Gogo <jfgogo22@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-06 14:26 -0800
          Re: On length contraction John Gogo <jfgogo22@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-06 14:38 -0800
          Re: On length contraction John Gogo <jfgogo22@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-06 15:39 -0800
  Re: On length contraction Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-06 15:07 -0600
    Re: On length contraction benj <none@gmail.com> - 2015-12-14 02:21 -0500
      Re: On length contraction Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-14 10:44 -0600
        Re: On length contraction alsor@interia.pl - 2015-12-14 08:59 -0800
        Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-14 09:05 -0800
          Re: On length contraction alsor@interia.pl - 2015-12-14 09:48 -0800
          Re: On length contraction Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-14 12:18 -0600
            Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-15 05:49 -0800
              Re: On length contraction Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-15 08:21 -0600
                Re: On length contraction mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2015-12-15 23:29 -0800
                Re: On length contraction kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-12-16 07:04 -0800
                Re: On length contraction Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-16 09:14 -0600

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