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Groups > linux.debian.user > #203870 > unrolled thread
| Started by | "Stephen P. Molnar" <s.molnar@sbcglobal.net> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2019-01-03 16:00 +0100 |
| Last post | 2019-01-04 16:00 +0100 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 94 — 25 participants |
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Upgrade Problem "Stephen P. Molnar" <s.molnar@sbcglobal.net> - 2019-01-03 16:00 +0100
Fwd: Upgrade Problem "Stephen P. Molnar" <s.molnar@sbcglobal.net> - 2019-01-03 17:20 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem steve <dlist@bluewin.ch> - 2019-01-03 17:40 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Brad Rogers <brad@fineby.me.uk> - 2019-01-03 18:30 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem "Stephen P. Molnar" <s.molnar@sbcglobal.net> - 2019-01-03 18:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-03 17:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem "Stephen P. Molnar" <s.molnar@sbcglobal.net> - 2019-01-03 18:20 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-03 18:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2019-01-03 19:00 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem "Stephen P. Molnar" <s.molnar@sbcglobal.net> - 2019-01-03 20:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2019-01-03 20:50 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2019-01-03 20:50 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem "Stephen P. Molnar" <s.molnar@sbcglobal.net> - 2019-01-03 21:20 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-03 21:30 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2019-01-03 21:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-03 22:20 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Frank Weißer <linux@weisser-ol.de> - 2019-01-04 10:30 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem "Stephen P. Molnar" <s.molnar@sbcglobal.net> - 2019-01-03 21:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2019-01-03 22:30 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Roberto C. Sánchez <roberto@debian.org> - 2019-01-03 23:00 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2019-01-03 23:30 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-04 01:30 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2019-01-04 11:20 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Roberto C. Sánchez <roberto@debian.org> - 2019-01-04 13:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2019-01-04 13:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-04 19:00 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2019-01-04 19:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-01-04 20:00 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Roberto C. Sánchez <roberto@debian.org> - 2019-01-04 20:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Roberto C. Sánchez <roberto@debian.org> - 2019-01-04 21:20 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-01-04 21:20 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-01-04 20:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-01-04 22:10 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2019-01-05 08:20 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-04 20:50 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-01-04 20:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-04 20:50 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Andy Smith <andy@strugglers.net> - 2019-01-03 23:10 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2019-01-04 14:10 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-01-04 03:30 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2019-01-04 14:20 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-01-04 14:50 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2019-01-04 15:00 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-04 19:30 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2019-01-04 19:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-04 21:00 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2019-01-04 21:30 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-04 23:00 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-01-04 19:50 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-05 01:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-01-05 06:30 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2019-01-04 15:50 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-01-04 18:10 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2019-01-03 21:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2019-01-03 19:00 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem "Stephen P. Molnar" <s.molnar@sbcglobal.net> - 2019-01-03 19:00 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-03 20:20 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem "Stephen P. Molnar" <s.molnar@sbcglobal.net> - 2019-01-03 20:50 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-03 21:40 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem "Stephen P. Molnar" <s.molnar@sbcglobal.net> - 2019-01-03 21:50 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-03 22:10 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem songbird <songbird@anthive.com> - 2019-01-04 03:20 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-01-04 09:10 +0100
Re: Fwd: Upgrade Problem Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-01-04 03:40 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2019-01-04 04:50 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Andy Smith <andy@strugglers.net> - 2019-01-04 09:50 +0100
Overhead of LVM (Re: Upgrade Problem) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2019-01-04 14:20 +0100
Re: Overhead of LVM (Re: Upgrade Problem) Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2019-01-04 14:30 +0100
Re: Overhead of LVM (Re: Upgrade Problem) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2019-01-05 05:10 +0100
Re: Overhead of LVM (Re: Upgrade Problem) Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2019-01-05 08:40 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Richard Hector <richard@walnut.gen.nz> - 2019-01-04 21:10 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Stefan Krusche <linux@stefan-krusche.de> - 2019-03-10 14:30 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2019-01-04 11:20 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2019-01-03 18:20 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem "Stephen P. Molnar" <s.molnar@sbcglobal.net> - 2019-01-03 18:40 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2019-01-04 03:20 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Matthew Crews <mailinglists@mattcrews.com> - 2019-01-04 03:50 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Andy Smith <andy@strugglers.net> - 2019-01-04 10:00 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2019-01-04 10:40 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-01-04 17:30 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2019-01-04 19:50 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-01-04 21:30 +0100
Re: allocating disk space (was: Upgrade Problem) Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2019-01-05 01:40 +0100
Re: allocating disk space (was: Upgrade Problem) David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-01-10 01:10 +0100
Re: allocating disk space Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2019-01-11 08:20 +0100
Re: allocating disk space David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-01-13 14:20 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-01-04 11:50 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2019-01-04 13:00 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2019-01-04 14:30 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem songbird <songbird@anthive.com> - 2019-01-03 20:00 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem "Stephen P. Molnar" <s.molnar@sbcglobal.net> - 2019-01-03 20:40 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-01-03 21:00 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2019-01-03 21:10 +0100
Re: Upgrade Problem Michael Stone <mstone@debian.org> - 2019-01-04 16:00 +0100
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| From | Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-03 23:30 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcjEZ-JW-9@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #203917 |
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Roberto C. Sánchez (2019-01-03): > That would be like saying that someone who operates a motor vehicle > without also being a mechanic is doing so without acquiring the required > knowlege. You do realize that in most countries, a license is required to operate motor vehicles and obtaining it requires acquiring a certain amount of knowledge, right? Regards, -- Nicolas George
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| From | deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 01:30 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xclx7-1Tx-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #203920 |
Nicolas George wrote: > You do realize that in most countries, a license is required to operate > motor vehicles and obtaining it requires acquiring a certain amount of > knowledge, right? Come on, the argument of Roberto C. Sánchez holds. Operator != Mechanic. To operate a PC means you know how to power on, login, start and use application (implies knowing what is mouse and keyboard and being litterate) and so on. It has nothing to do with executing commands on the command line.
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| From | Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 11:20 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcuK6-7uH-25@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #203925 |
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deloptes (2019-01-04): > Come on, the argument of Roberto C. Sánchez holds. Operator != Mechanic. And I have not suggested that Roberto become a kernel hacker. I hope you noticed. > To > operate a PC means you know how to power on, login, start and use > application What applications can they use if nobody installed them? You have a strange opinion of how a PC works. There is no going around it: a PC is a very complex piece of technology. For everyday use, the complexity is well hidden, but not all day is everyday. There are unavoidably cases when somebody needs to deal with the complexity. In that case, there are only three options: - pay somebody competent to do the job, or else entice them to do the job for free; - become competent; - go live in a cave. Regards, -- Nicolas George
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| From | Roberto C. Sánchez <roberto@debian.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 13:40 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcwVz-hl-9@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #203949 |
On Fri, Jan 04, 2019 at 11:16:57AM +0100, Nicolas George wrote: > deloptes (2019-01-04): > > Come on, the argument of Roberto C. Sánchez holds. Operator != Mechanic. > > And I have not suggested that Roberto become a kernel hacker. I hope you > noticed. > I tried about 15 years ago. It turns out I couldn't hack it :-) I am older and wiser now, so I suppose I could, but my interests are now elsewhere. > > To > > operate a PC means you know how to power on, login, start and use > > application > > What applications can they use if nobody installed them? You have a > strange opinion of how a PC works. > > There is no going around it: a PC is a very complex piece of technology. > For everyday use, the complexity is well hidden, but not all day is > everyday. There are unavoidably cases when somebody needs to deal with > the complexity. In that case, there are only three options: > > - pay somebody competent to do the job, or else entice them to do the > job for free; > > - become competent; > > - go live in a cave. > The line between operator and administrator has been blurry since the beginning of computing. Just as people who own automobiles today need to know far less in terms of mechanical diagnosis and repair than those who owned automobiles 100 years ago, operating a Unix-like computer today can be successfully accomplished with far less in the way knowledge of system administration than was possible 20 or 30 years ago. That said, like owning an automobile, with a computer sometimes things break or quit working as expected. The machine then either has to be repaired or replaced and if the owner cannot handle the job on his or her own, then somebody else will need to handle it (and likely be paid for the service). Regards, -Roberto -- Roberto C. Sánchez
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| From | Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 13:40 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcwVz-hl-13@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #203964 |
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Roberto C. Sánchez (12019-01-04): > That said, like owning an automobile, with a computer sometimes things > break or quit working as expected. The machine then either has to be > repaired or replaced and if the owner cannot handle the job on his or > her own, then somebody else will need to handle it (and likely be paid > for the service). Exactly. And the kind of payment that is expected from you for help on this mailing-list is not pecuniary, of course. It is that you do not just consume the answers given to you but instead try to increase your knowledge and understanding so that maybe one day you would be the one helping. Regards, -- Nicolas George
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| From | deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 19:00 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcBVf-3cp-3@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #203965 |
Nicolas George wrote: > Exactly. And the kind of payment that is expected from you for help on > this mailing-list is not pecuniary, of course. It is that you do not > just consume the answers given to you but instead try to increase your > knowledge and understanding so that maybe one day you would be the one > helping. but you do not know the OP and can not estimate what he is doing with the answers, so why should you judge others statements. We just pointed out that you do not have to be a sysadmin to operate a computer. regards
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| From | Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 19:40 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcCxY-3EP-27@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #203995 |
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deloptes (12019-01-04): > We just pointed out > that you do not have to be a sysadmin to operate a computer. And you are wrong. Operating a computer requires a sysadmin, there is no way around it. If there is no dedicated one, that makes the user the sysadmin. Their choice whether they become competent or not; Regards, -- Nicolas George
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| From | Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 20:00 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcCRj-3LF-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #204003 |
On Friday 04 January 2019 13:31:05 Nicolas George wrote: > deloptes (12019-01-04): > > We just pointed out > > that you do not have to be a sysadmin to operate a computer. > > And you are wrong. Operating a computer requires a sysadmin, there is > no way around it. If there is no dedicated one, that makes the user > the sysadmin. Their choice whether they become competent or not; > > Regards, Another demonstration of TANSTAAFL Nicolas. Its a law one will obey no matter how hard you try to ignore it. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
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| From | Roberto C. Sánchez <roberto@debian.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 20:40 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcDu2-4dP-13@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #204008 |
On Fri, Jan 04, 2019 at 07:34:59PM +0000, Brian wrote: > On Fri 04 Jan 2019 at 13:49:52 -0500, Gene Heskett wrote: > > > On Friday 04 January 2019 13:31:05 Nicolas George wrote: > > > > > deloptes (12019-01-04): > > > > We just pointed out > > > > that you do not have to be a sysadmin to operate a computer. > > > > > > And you are wrong. Operating a computer requires a sysadmin, there is > > > no way around it. If there is no dedicated one, that makes the user > > > the sysadmin. Their choice whether they become competent or not; > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Another demonstration of TANSTAAFL Nicolas. Its a law one will obey no > > matter how hard you try to ignore it. > > I wish I understood that! > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TANSTAAFL -- Roberto C. Sánchez
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| From | Roberto C. Sánchez <roberto@debian.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 21:20 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcE6K-4Gr-7@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #204015 |
On Fri, Jan 04, 2019 at 08:09:55PM +0000, Brian wrote: > On Fri 04 Jan 2019 at 14:37:36 -0500, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote: > > > On Fri, Jan 04, 2019 at 07:34:59PM +0000, Brian wrote: > > > On Fri 04 Jan 2019 at 13:49:52 -0500, Gene Heskett wrote: > > > > > > > On Friday 04 January 2019 13:31:05 Nicolas George wrote: > > > > > > > > > deloptes (12019-01-04): > > > > > > We just pointed out > > > > > > that you do not have to be a sysadmin to operate a computer. > > > > > > > > > > And you are wrong. Operating a computer requires a sysadmin, there is > > > > > no way around it. If there is no dedicated one, that makes the user > > > > > the sysadmin. Their choice whether they become competent or not; > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Another demonstration of TANSTAAFL Nicolas. Its a law one will obey no > > > > matter how hard you try to ignore it. > > > > > > I wish I understood that! > > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TANSTAAFL > > TANSTAAFL wasn't what I didn't understand, I know what it means. It's > the whole post which is a mystery to me. Apart from you, perhaps. > My mistake. I think Gene's comment means something like, "people always try to get something for nothing, but it never works." Regards, -Roberto -- Roberto C. Sánchez
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| From | Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 21:20 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcE6K-4Gr-9@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #204015 |
On Fri 04 Jan 2019 at 14:37:36 -0500, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote: > On Fri, Jan 04, 2019 at 07:34:59PM +0000, Brian wrote: > > On Fri 04 Jan 2019 at 13:49:52 -0500, Gene Heskett wrote: > > > > > On Friday 04 January 2019 13:31:05 Nicolas George wrote: > > > > > > > deloptes (12019-01-04): > > > > > We just pointed out > > > > > that you do not have to be a sysadmin to operate a computer. > > > > > > > > And you are wrong. Operating a computer requires a sysadmin, there is > > > > no way around it. If there is no dedicated one, that makes the user > > > > the sysadmin. Their choice whether they become competent or not; > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Another demonstration of TANSTAAFL Nicolas. Its a law one will obey no > > > matter how hard you try to ignore it. > > > > I wish I understood that! > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TANSTAAFL TANSTAAFL wasn't what I didn't understand, I know what it means. It's the whole post which is a mystery to me. Apart from you, perhaps. -- Brian.
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| From | Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 20:40 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcDu2-4dP-15@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #204008 |
On Fri 04 Jan 2019 at 13:49:52 -0500, Gene Heskett wrote: > On Friday 04 January 2019 13:31:05 Nicolas George wrote: > > > deloptes (12019-01-04): > > > We just pointed out > > > that you do not have to be a sysadmin to operate a computer. > > > > And you are wrong. Operating a computer requires a sysadmin, there is > > no way around it. If there is no dedicated one, that makes the user > > the sysadmin. Their choice whether they become competent or not; > > > > Regards, > > Another demonstration of TANSTAAFL Nicolas. Its a law one will obey no > matter how hard you try to ignore it. I wish I understood that! -- Brian.
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| From | Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 22:10 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcET8-5cY-9@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #204016 |
On Friday 04 January 2019 14:34:59 Brian wrote: > On Fri 04 Jan 2019 at 13:49:52 -0500, Gene Heskett wrote: > > On Friday 04 January 2019 13:31:05 Nicolas George wrote: > > > deloptes (12019-01-04): > > > > We just pointed out > > > > that you do not have to be a sysadmin to operate a computer. > > > > > > And you are wrong. Operating a computer requires a sysadmin, there > > > is no way around it. If there is no dedicated one, that makes the > > > user the sysadmin. Their choice whether they become competent or > > > not; > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Another demonstration of TANSTAAFL Nicolas. Its a law one will obey > > no matter how hard you try to ignore it. > > I wish I understood that! Why not, There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free lunch. If you think the peanuts are free, check the price of the beer IOW. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
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| From | mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-05 08:20 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcOpr-2sU-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #204036 |
On 2019-01-04 21:03, Gene Heskett wrote: > On Friday 04 January 2019 14:34:59 Brian wrote: > >> On Fri 04 Jan 2019 at 13:49:52 -0500, Gene Heskett wrote: >> > On Friday 04 January 2019 13:31:05 Nicolas George wrote: >> > > deloptes (12019-01-04): >> > > > We just pointed out >> > > > that you do not have to be a sysadmin to operate a computer. >> > > >> > > And you are wrong. Operating a computer requires a sysadmin, there >> > > is no way around it. If there is no dedicated one, that makes the >> > > user the sysadmin. Their choice whether they become competent or >> > > not; >> > > >> > > Regards, >> > >> > Another demonstration of TANSTAAFL Nicolas. Its a law one will obey >> > no matter how hard you try to ignore it. >> >> I wish I understood that! > > Why not, There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free lunch. If you think the > peanuts are free, check the price of the beer IOW. What's the price of beer on the Isle of Wight to do with computers ? -- Key ID 4BFEBB31
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| From | deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 20:50 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcDDH-4h5-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #204008 |
Gene Heskett wrote: > On Friday 04 January 2019 13:31:05 Nicolas George wrote: > >> deloptes (12019-01-04): >> >We just pointed out >> > that you do not have to be a sysadmin to operate a computer. >> >> And you are wrong. Operating a computer requires a sysadmin, there is >> no way around it. If there is no dedicated one, that makes the user >> the sysadmin. Their choice whether they become competent or not; >> >> Regards, > > Another demonstration of TANSTAAFL Nicolas. Its a law one will obey no > matter how hard you try to ignore it. > > Cheers, Gene Heskett It requires sysadmin as far as a car requires a mechanic, but you could always go to the shop and buy new one. What I wanted to point out is that it is not a requirement per se for the operation of the device. You are mixing both. For the present case OP is acting as sysadmin - nothing wrong, so your point is clear, but you mistakenly presume that one should play the same role. It is not a must. It is a matter of choice and skills. Even for the car, I can repair most of it if I am skilled and have the manual, but I do not have to. regards
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| From | Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 20:40 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcDu2-4dP-11@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #204003 |
On Fri 04 Jan 2019 at 19:31:05 +0100, Nicolas George wrote: > deloptes (12019-01-04): > > We just pointed out > > that you do not have to be a sysadmin to operate a computer. > > And you are wrong. Operating a computer requires a sysadmin, there is no > way around it. If there is no dedicated one, that makes the user the > sysadmin. Their choice whether they become competent or not; Using the facilities on a computer is what a user does, just like the simple task of switching on an electric light in a house. If by "operating", deloptes means "using", I think I could agree. If he means change the bulb or mend the fuse or go down to to the local substation to fix the problem we are outside the province of a user's remit. How about deleting a power station or two to get the lights in the house working? The problem with computers is that a user says "this is *my* computer and I will do with it what I want. Consequently, the easiest way to happiness is to destroy the system and rebuild. Competence with system administration and its philosophy is hardly at the forefront in the use of computers. Having said that, a full partition does require sensitive treatment. It hasn't received it in this thread. -- Brian.
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| From | deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 20:50 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcDDI-4h5-9@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #204014 |
Brian wrote: > Using the facilities on a computer is what a user does, just like the > simple task of switching on an electric light in a house. > > If by "operating", deloptes means "using", I think I could agree. If > he means change the bulb or mend the fuse or go down to to the local > substation to fix the problem we are outside the province of a user's > remit. How about deleting a power station or two to get the lights in > the house working? > > The problem with computers is that a user says "this is *my* computer > and I will do with it what I want. Consequently, the easiest way to > happiness is to destroy the system and rebuild. Competence with system > administration and its philosophy is hardly at the forefront in the use > of computers. > > Having said that, a full partition does require sensitive treatment. It > hasn't received it in this thread. you understood correctly and I agree completely with you. I wonder no one suggested for the OP to take a backup, but I think OP knows this already.
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| From | Andy Smith <andy@strugglers.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-03 23:10 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcjlF-Dn-25@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #203914 |
On Thu, Jan 03, 2019 at 10:27:30PM +0100, Nicolas George wrote: > > > Then ask your sysadmin. > > > I have no sysadmin. > > Then you are not "only a user", you are a sysadmin, and you are trying > to be one without acquiring the required knowledge. I Have No Sysadmin And I Must Sudo
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| From | Curt <curty@free.fr> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 14:10 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcxoC-Ga-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #203918 |
On 2019-01-03, Andy Smith <andy@strugglers.net> wrote: > On Thu, Jan 03, 2019 at 10:27:30PM +0100, Nicolas George wrote: >> > > Then ask your sysadmin. >> >> > I have no sysadmin. >> >> Then you are not "only a user", you are a sysadmin, and you are trying >> to be one without acquiring the required knowledge. > > I Have No Sysadmin And I Must Sudo > > With apologies to Harlan Ellison (let 'im RIP)?
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| From | Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2019-01-04 03:30 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <xcnpf-2Yo-3@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #203908 |
On Thursday 03 January 2019 15:36:33 Stephen P. Molnar wrote: > On 01/03/2019 03:31 PM, Nicolas George wrote: > > Stephen P. Molnar (2019-01-03): > >> Thank you for your helpful comment. Unfortunately. I am an > >> Organioc Chemist, not an IT person. Therefore, I am only a user. > > > > Then ask your sysadmin. > > > > Regards, > > I have no sysadmin. Sorry to sound high and mighty, which I'm a far cry from, but if you don't have such a person in your organization, be willing to prepare yourself to be able to do that job. In this case, I hate to sound like an ass, but perhaps a re-install is in the future, doing the reinstall to a new drive so that later you may stand a chance of recovering valueable work from this drive, and by paying particular attention to whether your hardware is 32 bit or 64 bit. I suspect you got into this situation by trying to install a 32 bit main system library on a 64 bit system, or more likely, a 64 bit main system library on a 32 bit system that does understand 32 bit stuff most of the time. In either case there could be binary commands your cpu doesn't grok in the library. So again, your best bet is probably a re-install. And be more willing to become that IT person. Those of us that can help, will try, but you've got to be willing to state exactly how you arrived at this apparent impass. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
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