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A minimalist network

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  A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-17 16:50 +0200
    Re: A minimalist network Darac Marjal <mailinglist@darac.org.uk> - 2016-08-17 17:20 +0200
      Re: A minimalist network Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2016-08-17 17:40 +0200
        Re: A minimalist network David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-08-17 19:00 +0200
        Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-17 23:20 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2016-08-17 23:50 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-18 00:10 +0200
              Re: A minimalist network Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2016-08-18 00:40 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-18 01:20 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network Henrique de Moraes Holschuh <hmh@debian.org> - 2016-08-18 01:50 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-19 14:00 +0200
              Re: A minimalist network Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2016-08-19 18:40 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network David Christensen <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com> - 2016-08-18 03:30 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network Jonathan Dowland <jmtd@debian.org> - 2016-08-19 10:20 +0200
      Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-17 23:10 +0200
        Re: A minimalist network Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-17 23:20 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-18 00:40 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2016-08-18 00:40 +0200
        Re: A minimalist network Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2016-08-17 23:20 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-18 00:30 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2016-08-18 00:50 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network David Christensen <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com> - 2016-08-18 03:30 +0200
              Re: A minimalist network Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2016-08-18 04:00 +0200
                Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-18 14:20 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network Andy Smith <andy@strugglers.net> - 2016-08-18 12:40 +0200
              Re: A minimalist network David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-08-18 22:10 +0200
              Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-19 14:10 +0200
        Re: A minimalist network rhkramer@gmail.com - 2016-08-17 23:40 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2016-08-17 23:50 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network rhkramer@gmail.com - 2016-08-18 01:30 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-18 00:50 +0200
        Re: A minimalist network Henrique de Moraes Holschuh <hmh@debian.org> - 2016-08-18 01:30 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network Pascal Hambourg <pascal@plouf.fr.eu.org> - 2016-08-18 13:00 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-08-18 19:10 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network Reco <recoverym4n@gmail.com> - 2016-08-18 19:20 +0200
              Re: A minimalist network Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-18 19:40 +0200
              Re: A minimalist network Pascal Hambourg <pascal@plouf.fr.eu.org> - 2016-08-18 20:00 +0200
    Re: A minimalist network "der.hans" <deb-user@LuftHans.com> - 2016-08-17 17:20 +0200
      Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-17 22:50 +0200
        Re: A minimalist network Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-17 23:30 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-18 14:10 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-18 16:50 +0200
              Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-19 14:00 +0200
    Re: A minimalist network Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-17 23:40 +0200
      Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-18 00:50 +0200
        Re: A minimalist network Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-18 01:10 +0200
        Re: A minimalist network Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2016-08-18 01:40 +0200
    Re: A minimalist network David Christensen <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com> - 2016-08-18 03:10 +0200
      Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-18 16:00 +0200
        Re: A minimalist network Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-18 16:10 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-19 14:50 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2016-08-19 15:10 +0200
              Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-19 15:50 +0200
                Re: A minimalist network David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-08-19 19:50 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-19 16:00 +0200
              Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-19 16:00 +0200
                Re: A minimalist network Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-19 17:00 +0200
                  Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-19 19:40 +0200
                    Re: A minimalist network Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-19 21:20 +0200
                    Re: A minimalist network Mike McClain <mike.junk@copper.net> - 2016-08-20 08:40 +0200
                      Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-20 13:30 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network Andy Smith <andy@strugglers.net> - 2016-08-20 22:00 +0200
        Re: A minimalist network rhkramer@gmail.com - 2016-08-18 17:10 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network Henrique de Moraes Holschuh <hmh@debian.org> - 2016-08-18 17:30 +0200
            RE: A minimalist network Bonno Bloksma <b.bloksma@tio.nl> - 2016-08-19 12:20 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-18 17:40 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network Tim McDonough <tmcdonough@gmail.com> - 2016-08-18 17:50 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-08-18 18:10 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2016-08-18 19:00 +0200
        Re: A minimalist network Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-18 17:40 +0200
        Re: A minimalist network David Christensen <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com> - 2016-08-18 21:00 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-08-18 21:30 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-08-18 21:40 +0200
          Re: A minimalist network Charlie Kravetz <cjk@teamcharliesangels.com> - 2016-08-18 22:40 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-18 23:20 +0200
              Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-19 15:00 +0200
                Re: A minimalist network Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-19 16:00 +0200
                  Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-19 16:10 +0200
                    Re: A minimalist network Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-19 16:50 +0200
                      Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-19 20:00 +0200
                    Re: A minimalist network Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2016-08-19 17:50 +0200
                      Re: A minimalist network Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-08-19 20:10 +0200
            Re: A minimalist network Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-18 23:20 +0200

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#171238

On 8/17/2016 4:26 PM, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> On Wednesday 17 August 2016 21:48:20 Richard Owlett wrote:
>> [snip]
>> The web hits I got for zeroconf indicated it's part of a support
>> package for KDE, I'm using Mate. Don't know if that's a problem.
>> http://manpages.debian.org/cgi-bin/man.cgi is still giving a 404
>> error so I can't check there. Didn't find any link at kde.org
>> that looked promising.
>
> Try one of these:
> http://mate-desktop.com/community/
>
> They are a helpful enthusiastic lot.
>
> Lisi

In a brief visit didn't find what I was looking for.
*BUT* searching their wiki for "networking" led to a Arch Linux 
page which listed the key modules for Mate. That will allow me to 
install a leaner Jessie. Will get a chance to experiment with 
that this afternoon. Thanks.

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#171248

On Thursday 18 August 2016 13:04:39 Richard Owlett wrote:
> On 8/17/2016 4:26 PM, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> > On Wednesday 17 August 2016 21:48:20 Richard Owlett wrote:
> >> [snip]
> >> The web hits I got for zeroconf indicated it's part of a support
> >> package for KDE, I'm using Mate. Don't know if that's a problem.
> >> http://manpages.debian.org/cgi-bin/man.cgi is still giving a 404
> >> error so I can't check there. Didn't find any link at kde.org
> >> that looked promising.
> >
> > Try one of these:
> > http://mate-desktop.com/community/
> >
> > They are a helpful enthusiastic lot.
> >
> > Lisi
>
> In a brief visit didn't find what I was looking for.

Perhaps the mailing list??

> *BUT* searching their wiki for "networking" led to a Arch Linux
> page which listed the key modules for Mate. That will allow me to
> install a leaner Jessie. Will get a chance to experiment with
> that this afternoon. Thanks.

Good!!

Lisi

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#171296

On 8/18/2016 9:46 AM, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> On Thursday 18 August 2016 13:04:39 Richard Owlett wrote:
>> On 8/17/2016 4:26 PM, Lisi Reisz wrote:
>>> On Wednesday 17 August 2016 21:48:20 Richard Owlett wrote:
>>>> [snip]
>>>> The web hits I got for zeroconf indicated it's part of a support
>>>> package for KDE, I'm using Mate. Don't know if that's a problem.
>>>> http://manpages.debian.org/cgi-bin/man.cgi is still giving a 404
>>>> error so I can't check there. Didn't find any link at kde.org
>>>> that looked promising.
>>>
>>> Try one of these:
>>> http://mate-desktop.com/community/
>>>
>>> They are a helpful enthusiastic lot.
>>>
>>> Lisi
>>
>> In a brief visit didn't find what I was looking for.
>
> Perhaps the mailing list??

That would be my preference.
Went to list of groups at http://ml.mate-desktop.org/listinfo/ .
Saw they were all described as developer list I clicked on link 
to archives of
mate-dev 	mailing list for MATE development
It appeared to be most general. I receive repeated "403 
Forbidden" errors.

>
>> *BUT* searching their wiki for "networking" led to a Arch Linux
>> page which listed the key modules for Mate. That will allow me to
>> install a leaner Jessie. Will get a chance to experiment with
>> that this afternoon. Thanks.
>
> Good!!

My first try didn't work. Haven't spent any diagnostic time on it 
yet.

>
> Lisi
>
>

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#171210

On Wed 17 Aug 2016 at 09:45:39 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:

> I wish to connect two laptops via Ethernet.
> 
> The Debian machine is having various configurations of Jessie installed.
> Consider it a laboratory experiment. It can have multiple installs in a day.
> It intentionally has *NO* internet connectivity. It has a small partition
> set aside for preseed.cfg and miscellaneous scripts.
> 
> The second machine is running WinXP Pro SP3 and serves as source of preseed
> and script files.

What is your present technique for getting files from the second machine
to the first one? Or, are you altering your setup in some way?

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#171218

On 8/17/2016 4:34 PM, Brian wrote:
> On Wed 17 Aug 2016 at 09:45:39 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
>
>> I wish to connect two laptops via Ethernet.
>>
>> The Debian machine is having various configurations of Jessie installed.
>> Consider it a laboratory experiment. It can have multiple installs in a day.
>> It intentionally has *NO* internet connectivity. It has a small partition
>> set aside for preseed.cfg and miscellaneous scripts.
>>
>> The second machine is running WinXP Pro SP3 and serves as source of preseed
>> and script files.
>
> What is your present technique for getting files from the second machine
> to the first one?

Write files a USB flash drive in format readable to other machine.
That is a nuisance!

>Or, are you altering your setup in some way?
>
>

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#171222

On Wed 17 Aug 2016 at 17:46:27 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:

> On 8/17/2016 4:34 PM, Brian wrote:
> >On Wed 17 Aug 2016 at 09:45:39 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
> >
> >>I wish to connect two laptops via Ethernet.
> >>
> >>The Debian machine is having various configurations of Jessie installed.
> >>Consider it a laboratory experiment. It can have multiple installs in a day.
> >>It intentionally has *NO* internet connectivity. It has a small partition
> >>set aside for preseed.cfg and miscellaneous scripts.
> >>
> >>The second machine is running WinXP Pro SP3 and serves as source of preseed
> >>and script files.
> >
> >What is your present technique for getting files from the second machine
> >to the first one?
> 
> Write files a USB flash drive in format readable to other machine.
> That is a nuisance!

Sneakernet. :)

You're on your way to a more wholesome file transfer method. Good luck.

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#171227

On 8/17/16 6:46 PM, Richard Owlett wrote:
> On 8/17/2016 4:34 PM, Brian wrote:
>> On Wed 17 Aug 2016 at 09:45:39 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
>>
>>> I wish to connect two laptops via Ethernet.
>>>
>>> The Debian machine is having various configurations of Jessie 
>>> installed.
>>> Consider it a laboratory experiment. It can have multiple installs 
>>> in a day.
>>> It intentionally has *NO* internet connectivity. It has a small 
>>> partition
>>> set aside for preseed.cfg and miscellaneous scripts.
>>>
>>> The second machine is running WinXP Pro SP3 and serves as source of 
>>> preseed
>>> and script files.
>>
>> What is your present technique for getting files from the second machine
>> to the first one?
>
> Write files a USB flash drive in format readable to other machine.
> That is a nuisance!

Hence the recommendation of turning on the WinXP FTP server!

-- 
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra

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#171231

On 08/17/2016 07:45 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
> I wish to connect two laptops via Ethernet.
> 
> The Debian machine is having various configurations of Jessie installed.
> Consider it a laboratory experiment. It can have multiple installs in a
> day. It intentionally has *NO* internet connectivity. It has a small
> partition set aside for preseed.cfg and miscellaneous scripts.
> 
> The second machine is running WinXP Pro SP3 and serves as source of
> preseed and script files.
> 
> My internet searches turn up too much outdated information and/or fine
> detail. Most link assume a server with multiple clients. Better
> description would be a peer to peer setup. It may be convenient to have
> the Windows machine act as a terminal for the Debian machine.

It would help if you provided more information about your network and
computers:

1.  Laptop make, model, and version, CPU make and model, RAM size,
HDD/SSD size, and Ethernet speed of Windows laptop.

2.  Experimental laptop and key parameters (as above).

3.  Internet modem or gateway.

4.  Router and/or routing software.

5.  Any other devices we should know about.

6.  Distances between devices.


David

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#171245

On 8/17/2016 8:07 PM, David Christensen wrote:
> On 08/17/2016 07:45 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
>> I wish to connect two laptops via Ethernet.
>>
>> The Debian machine is having various configurations of Jessie installed.
>> Consider it a laboratory experiment. It can have multiple installs in a
>> day. It intentionally has *NO* internet connectivity. It has a small
>> partition set aside for preseed.cfg and miscellaneous scripts.
>>
>> The second machine is running WinXP Pro SP3 and serves as source of
>> preseed and script files.
>>
>> My internet searches turn up too much outdated information and/or fine
>> detail. Most link assume a server with multiple clients. Better
>> description would be a peer to peer setup. It may be convenient to have
>> the Windows machine act as a terminal for the Debian machine.
>
> It would help if you provided more information about your network and
> computers:
>
> 1.  Laptop make, model, and version, CPU make and model, RAM size,
> HDD/SSD size, and Ethernet speed of Windows laptop.
>
> 2.  Experimental laptop and key parameters (as above).
>
> 3.  Internet modem or gateway.
>
> 4.  Router and/or routing software.
>
> 5.  Any other devices we should know about.
>
> 6.  Distances between devices.
>
>

1. ThinkPad T43 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd012235]
2. ThinkPad R61 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd013965]
3. N/A
4. TBD
5. none
6. < 1 ft.

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#171246

On Thu 18 Aug 2016 at 08:58:23 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:

> On 8/17/2016 8:07 PM, David Christensen wrote:
> >On 08/17/2016 07:45 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
> >>I wish to connect two laptops via Ethernet.
> >>
> >>The Debian machine is having various configurations of Jessie installed.
> >>Consider it a laboratory experiment. It can have multiple installs in a
> >>day. It intentionally has *NO* internet connectivity. It has a small
> >>partition set aside for preseed.cfg and miscellaneous scripts.
> >>
> >>The second machine is running WinXP Pro SP3 and serves as source of
> >>preseed and script files.
> >>
> >>My internet searches turn up too much outdated information and/or fine
> >>detail. Most link assume a server with multiple clients. Better
> >>description would be a peer to peer setup. It may be convenient to have
> >>the Windows machine act as a terminal for the Debian machine.
> >
> >It would help if you provided more information about your network and
> >computers:
> >
> >1.  Laptop make, model, and version, CPU make and model, RAM size,
> >HDD/SSD size, and Ethernet speed of Windows laptop.
> >
> >2.  Experimental laptop and key parameters (as above).
> >
> >3.  Internet modem or gateway.
> >
> >4.  Router and/or routing software.
> >
> >5.  Any other devices we should know about.
> >
> >6.  Distances between devices.
> >
> >
> 
> 1. ThinkPad T43 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd012235]
> 2. ThinkPad R61 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd013965]
> 3. N/A

You presumably have a modem/router already. The Debian machine doesn't
have to use it as gateway to the internet. Set up routing for it to send
packets to the local network only.

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#171300

On 8/18/2016 9:04 AM, Brian wrote:
> On Thu 18 Aug 2016 at 08:58:23 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
>
>> On 8/17/2016 8:07 PM, David Christensen wrote:
>>> On 08/17/2016 07:45 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
>>>> I wish to connect two laptops via Ethernet.
>>>>[snip]
>>>
>>> It would help if you provided more information about your network and
>>> computers:
>>>
>>> 1.  Laptop make, model, and version, CPU make and model, RAM size,
>>> HDD/SSD size, and Ethernet speed of Windows laptop.
>>>
>>> 2.  Experimental laptop and key parameters (as above).
>>>
>>> 3.  Internet modem or gateway.
>>>
>>> 4.  Router and/or routing software.
>>>
>>> 5.  Any other devices we should know about.
>>>
>>> 6.  Distances between devices.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> 1. ThinkPad T43 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd012235]
>> 2. ThinkPad R61 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd013965]
>> 3. N/A
>
> You presumably have a modem/router already. The Debian machine doesn't
> have to use it as gateway to the internet. Set up routing for it to send
> packets to the local network only.

As I had said in last paragraph of 
https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2016/08/msg00609.html :
"Why would I be interested in ssh as both machines are sitting on 
my desk and _neither_ will be connected to the internet when 
ethernet connection is live?"

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#171302

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 07:41:56AM -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:

[...]

> As I had said in last paragraph of
> https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2016/08/msg00609.html :
> "Why would I be interested in ssh as both machines are sitting on my
> desk and _neither_ will be connected to the internet when ethernet
> connection is live?"

Because your newest IOT lightbulb[1] or other gadget[2] is spying on
you?

Of course you may have reasons to "go simple", especially on setup,
and/or under controlled conditions; especially if you're connecting
the two boxes via one cable as has been sugested in this (monster)
thread several times, you're entitled to be somewhat secure.

But dividing the world in "insecure outside, secure inside, and at
the perimeter, the firewall takes care of things" is a pretty
outdated way of thinking. Better use secure protocols inside your
network. You never know what your network printer is doing, there
beneath the desk.

[1] <https://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/40397.html>
[2] <https://news.slashdot.org/story/16/08/18/2231244/smart-electrical-socket-leaks-your-email-address-can-launch-ddos-attacks>

Regards
- -- t
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YFMAnjBeNw2nif1ObMbC+leiPksJDYXd
=gd2p
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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#171304

On 8/19/2016 8:05 AM, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 07:41:56AM -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>> As I had said in last paragraph of
>> https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2016/08/msg00609.html :
>> "Why would I be interested in ssh as both machines are sitting on my
>> desk and _neither_ will be connected to the internet when ethernet
>> connection is live?"
>
> Because your newest IOT lightbulb[1] or other gadget[2] is spying on
> you?
>
> Of course you may have reasons to "go simple", especially on setup,
> and/or under controlled conditions; especially if you're connecting
> the two boxes via one cable as has been sugested in this (monster)
> thread several times, you're entitled to be somewhat secure.
>
> But dividing the world in "insecure outside, secure inside, and at
> the perimeter, the firewall takes care of things" is a pretty
> outdated way of thinking. Better use secure protocols inside your
> network. You never know what your network printer is doing, there
> beneath the desk.
>
> [1] <https://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/40397.html>
> [2] <https://news.slashdot.org/story/16/08/18/2231244/smart-electrical-socket-leaks-your-email-address-can-launch-ddos-attacks>
>
> Regards

*ROFL* <GRIN>
My subject line is "A minimalist network" !
The exhaustive all inclusive description of *MY* network is "A 
Lenovo T43 running WinXP Pro SP3 connected by a short Ethernet 
cable to a Lenovo R61 running experimental configurations of 
Debian Jessie (Mate desktop)." ;]!

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#171318

On Fri 19 Aug 2016 at 08:42:51 (-0500), Richard Owlett wrote:
> On 8/19/2016 8:05 AM, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:
> >On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 07:41:56AM -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
> >
> >[...]
> >
> >>As I had said in last paragraph of
> >>https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2016/08/msg00609.html :
> >>"Why would I be interested in ssh as both machines are sitting on my
> >>desk and _neither_ will be connected to the internet when ethernet
> >>connection is live?"
> >
> >Because your newest IOT lightbulb[1] or other gadget[2] is spying on
> >you?
> >
> >Of course you may have reasons to "go simple", especially on setup,
> >and/or under controlled conditions; especially if you're connecting
> >the two boxes via one cable as has been sugested in this (monster)
> >thread several times, you're entitled to be somewhat secure.
> >
> >But dividing the world in "insecure outside, secure inside, and at
> >the perimeter, the firewall takes care of things" is a pretty
> >outdated way of thinking. Better use secure protocols inside your
> >network. You never know what your network printer is doing, there
> >beneath the desk.
> >
> >[1] <https://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/40397.html>
> >[2] <https://news.slashdot.org/story/16/08/18/2231244/smart-electrical-socket-leaks-your-email-address-can-launch-ddos-attacks>
> >
> >Regards
> 
> *ROFL* <GRIN>
> My subject line is "A minimalist network" !
> The exhaustive all inclusive description of *MY* network is "A
> Lenovo T43 running WinXP Pro SP3 connected by a short Ethernet cable
> to a Lenovo R61 running experimental configurations of Debian Jessie
> (Mate desktop)." ;]!

This is a very long thread on a very short cable between two machines.
There are an unknown number of people who might read this thread to
achieve similar ends, but their situation might differ in some detail.
For example, their 'direct' connection might pass through the power
cabling in a shared rental, where a person downstairs could be
nefariously monitoring all the traffic.

When it comes to troubleshooting a problem, the specific, individual
circumstances are often essential for a fix. OTOH when it comes to
advising on a topic, it usually helps to be much more general and
inclusive, to help the most people.

[So, OP, this bears repetition:]
You frequently write in your posts something along the lines of "Off
to do homework" or "I've got some reading to do". So I would have
thought you would understand people's motives in writing for a larger
audience than just yourself, and for more than ephemeral usefulness.
The list isn't a free personal consulting service; the posts remain
permanently on the web site and other archives for anyone to search.

Cheers,
David.

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#171305

On Fri 19 Aug 2016 at 07:41:56 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:

> On 8/18/2016 9:04 AM, Brian wrote:
> >On Thu 18 Aug 2016 at 08:58:23 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
> >
> >>On 8/17/2016 8:07 PM, David Christensen wrote:
> >>>On 08/17/2016 07:45 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
> >>>>I wish to connect two laptops via Ethernet.
> >>>>[snip]
> >>>
> >>>It would help if you provided more information about your network and
> >>>computers:
> >>>
> >>>1.  Laptop make, model, and version, CPU make and model, RAM size,
> >>>HDD/SSD size, and Ethernet speed of Windows laptop.
> >>>
> >>>2.  Experimental laptop and key parameters (as above).
> >>>
> >>>3.  Internet modem or gateway.
> >>>
> >>>4.  Router and/or routing software.
> >>>
> >>>5.  Any other devices we should know about.
> >>>
> >>>6.  Distances between devices.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>1. ThinkPad T43 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd012235]
> >>2. ThinkPad R61 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd013965]
> >>3. N/A
> >
> >You presumably have a modem/router already. The Debian machine doesn't
> >have to use it as gateway to the internet. Set up routing for it to send
> >packets to the local network only.
> 
> As I had said in last paragraph of
> https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2016/08/msg00609.html :
> "Why would I be interested in ssh as both machines are sitting on my desk
> and _neither_ will be connected to the internet when ethernet connection is
> live?"

The technique I outlined is exactly that; no more and no less. Neither
machine would be connected to the internet; they would communicate only
with each other.

It would be an interesting project to undertake as part of the Education
in Retirement program; especially if it was done wirelessly, with or
without the router being involved.

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#171306

On 8/19/2016 8:51 AM, Brian wrote:
> On Fri 19 Aug 2016 at 07:41:56 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
>
>> On 8/18/2016 9:04 AM, Brian wrote:
>>> On Thu 18 Aug 2016 at 08:58:23 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 8/17/2016 8:07 PM, David Christensen wrote:
>>>>> On 08/17/2016 07:45 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
>>>>>> I wish to connect two laptops via Ethernet.
>>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>
>>>>> It would help if you provided more information about your network and
>>>>> computers:
>>>>>
>>>>> 1.  Laptop make, model, and version, CPU make and model, RAM size,
>>>>> HDD/SSD size, and Ethernet speed of Windows laptop.
>>>>>
>>>>> 2.  Experimental laptop and key parameters (as above).
>>>>>
>>>>> 3.  Internet modem or gateway.
>>>>>
>>>>> 4.  Router and/or routing software.
>>>>>
>>>>> 5.  Any other devices we should know about.
>>>>>
>>>>> 6.  Distances between devices.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 1. ThinkPad T43 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd012235]
>>>> 2. ThinkPad R61 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd013965]
>>>> 3. N/A
>>>
>>> You presumably have a modem/router already. The Debian machine doesn't
>>> have to use it as gateway to the internet. Set up routing for it to send
>>> packets to the local network only.
>>
>> As I had said in last paragraph of
>> https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2016/08/msg00609.html :
>> "Why would I be interested in ssh as both machines are sitting on my desk
>> and _neither_ will be connected to the internet when ethernet connection is
>> live?"
>
> The technique I outlined is exactly that; no more and no less. Neither
> machine would be connected to the internet; they would communicate only
> with each other.
>
> It would be an interesting project to undertake as part of the Education
> in Retirement program; especially if it was done wirelessly, with or
> without the router being involved.
>
>
As I replied to Thomas a few minutes ago:
The exhaustive all inclusive description of *MY* network is "A 
Lenovo T43 running WinXP Pro SP3 connected by a short Ethernet 
cable to a Lenovo R61 running experimental configurations of 
Debian Jessie (Mate desktop)."

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#171310

On Friday 19 August 2016 14:59:12 Richard Owlett wrote:
> On 8/19/2016 8:51 AM, Brian wrote:
> > On Fri 19 Aug 2016 at 07:41:56 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
> >> On 8/18/2016 9:04 AM, Brian wrote:
> >>> On Thu 18 Aug 2016 at 08:58:23 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
> >>>> On 8/17/2016 8:07 PM, David Christensen wrote:
> >>>>> On 08/17/2016 07:45 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
> >>>>>> I wish to connect two laptops via Ethernet.
> >>>>>> [snip]
> >>>>>
> >>>>> It would help if you provided more information about your network and
> >>>>> computers:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 1.  Laptop make, model, and version, CPU make and model, RAM size,
> >>>>> HDD/SSD size, and Ethernet speed of Windows laptop.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 2.  Experimental laptop and key parameters (as above).
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 3.  Internet modem or gateway.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 4.  Router and/or routing software.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 5.  Any other devices we should know about.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 6.  Distances between devices.
> >>>>
> >>>> 1. ThinkPad T43 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd012235]
> >>>> 2. ThinkPad R61 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd013965]
> >>>> 3. N/A
> >>>
> >>> You presumably have a modem/router already. The Debian machine doesn't
> >>> have to use it as gateway to the internet. Set up routing for it to
> >>> send packets to the local network only.
> >>
> >> As I had said in last paragraph of
> >> https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2016/08/msg00609.html :
> >> "Why would I be interested in ssh as both machines are sitting on my
> >> desk and _neither_ will be connected to the internet when ethernet
> >> connection is live?"
> >
> > The technique I outlined is exactly that; no more and no less. Neither
> > machine would be connected to the internet; they would communicate only
> > with each other.
> >
> > It would be an interesting project to undertake as part of the Education
> > in Retirement program; especially if it was done wirelessly, with or
> > without the router being involved.
>
> As I replied to Thomas a few minutes ago:
> The exhaustive all inclusive description of *MY* network is "A
> Lenovo T43 running WinXP Pro SP3 connected by a short Ethernet
> cable to a Lenovo R61 running experimental configurations of
> Debian Jessie (Mate desktop)."

You asked for advice, but seem only interested in informing.  If you already 
know everything there is to know about YOUR network, why are you asking us 
anything??

And what *precisely* do you mean by an Ethernet cable??

Lisi

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#171316

On 8/19/2016 9:56 AM, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> On Friday 19 August 2016 14:59:12 Richard Owlett wrote:
>> On 8/19/2016 8:51 AM, Brian wrote:
>>> On Fri 19 Aug 2016 at 07:41:56 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
>>>> On 8/18/2016 9:04 AM, Brian wrote:
>>>>> On Thu 18 Aug 2016 at 08:58:23 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
>>>>>> On 8/17/2016 8:07 PM, David Christensen wrote:
>>>>>>> On 08/17/2016 07:45 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
>>>>>>>> I wish to connect two laptops via Ethernet.
>>>>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It would help if you provided more information about your network and
>>>>>>> computers:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 1.  Laptop make, model, and version, CPU make and model, RAM size,
>>>>>>> HDD/SSD size, and Ethernet speed of Windows laptop.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2.  Experimental laptop and key parameters (as above).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 3.  Internet modem or gateway.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 4.  Router and/or routing software.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 5.  Any other devices we should know about.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 6.  Distances between devices.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. ThinkPad T43 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd012235]
>>>>>> 2. ThinkPad R61 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd013965]
>>>>>> 3. N/A
>>>>>
>>>>> You presumably have a modem/router already. The Debian machine doesn't
>>>>> have to use it as gateway to the internet. Set up routing for it to
>>>>> send packets to the local network only.
>>>>
>>>> As I had said in last paragraph of
>>>> https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2016/08/msg00609.html :
>>>> "Why would I be interested in ssh as both machines are sitting on my
>>>> desk and _neither_ will be connected to the internet when ethernet
>>>> connection is live?"
>>>
>>> The technique I outlined is exactly that; no more and no less. Neither
>>> machine would be connected to the internet; they would communicate only
>>> with each other.
>>>
>>> It would be an interesting project to undertake as part of the Education
>>> in Retirement program; especially if it was done wirelessly, with or
>>> without the router being involved.
>>
>> As I replied to Thomas a few minutes ago:
>> The exhaustive all inclusive description of *MY* network is "A
>> Lenovo T43 running WinXP Pro SP3 connected by a short Ethernet
>> cable to a Lenovo R61 running experimental configurations of
>> Debian Jessie (Mate desktop)."
>
> You asked for advice, but seem only interested in informing.  If you already
> know everything there is to know about YOUR network, why are you asking us
> anything??

I was emphasizing the topology. As stated previously the physical 
layer works. I expect that after reading _Networking for Dummies_ 
I'll be a lot closer to having machines communicate.

>
> And what *precisely* do you mean by an Ethernet cable??

3ft Cat6 with attached connectors.


>
> Lisi
>
>

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#171321

On Fri 19 Aug 2016 at 12:32:54 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:

> On 8/19/2016 9:56 AM, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> >On Friday 19 August 2016 14:59:12 Richard Owlett wrote:
> >>On 8/19/2016 8:51 AM, Brian wrote:
> >>>On Fri 19 Aug 2016 at 07:41:56 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
> >>>>On 8/18/2016 9:04 AM, Brian wrote:
> >>>>>On Thu 18 Aug 2016 at 08:58:23 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
> >>>>>>On 8/17/2016 8:07 PM, David Christensen wrote:
> >>>>>>>On 08/17/2016 07:45 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
> >>>>>>>>I wish to connect two laptops via Ethernet.
> >>>>>>>>[snip]
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>It would help if you provided more information about your network and
> >>>>>>>computers:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>1.  Laptop make, model, and version, CPU make and model, RAM size,
> >>>>>>>HDD/SSD size, and Ethernet speed of Windows laptop.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>2.  Experimental laptop and key parameters (as above).
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>3.  Internet modem or gateway.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>4.  Router and/or routing software.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>5.  Any other devices we should know about.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>6.  Distances between devices.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>1. ThinkPad T43 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd012235]
> >>>>>>2. ThinkPad R61 [https://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/pd013965]
> >>>>>>3. N/A
> >>>>>
> >>>>>You presumably have a modem/router already. The Debian machine doesn't
> >>>>>have to use it as gateway to the internet. Set up routing for it to
> >>>>>send packets to the local network only.
> >>>>
> >>>>As I had said in last paragraph of
> >>>>https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2016/08/msg00609.html :
> >>>>"Why would I be interested in ssh as both machines are sitting on my
> >>>>desk and _neither_ will be connected to the internet when ethernet
> >>>>connection is live?"
> >>>
> >>>The technique I outlined is exactly that; no more and no less. Neither
> >>>machine would be connected to the internet; they would communicate only
> >>>with each other.
> >>>
> >>>It would be an interesting project to undertake as part of the Education
> >>>in Retirement program; especially if it was done wirelessly, with or
> >>>without the router being involved.
> >>
> >>As I replied to Thomas a few minutes ago:
> >>The exhaustive all inclusive description of *MY* network is "A
> >>Lenovo T43 running WinXP Pro SP3 connected by a short Ethernet
> >>cable to a Lenovo R61 running experimental configurations of
> >>Debian Jessie (Mate desktop)."
> >
> >You asked for advice, but seem only interested in informing.  If you already
> >know everything there is to know about YOUR network, why are you asking us
> >anything??
> 
> I was emphasizing the topology. As stated previously the physical layer
> works. I expect that after reading _Networking for Dummies_ I'll be a lot
> closer to having machines communicate.

What does "physical layer works" mean? (That's a real question, not
a come on). Lights appear?

BTW, you seem singularly disinterested in any alternatives to your
programmed set of thought. Not that your idea is bad but it can be
realised in other ways and acknowledging them (which you implicitly
have) is all to the good. Stick with your short ethernet cable; it's
as good a method for file transfer as any other.

Somebody said that education amd retirement go together. Make the
most of it.







> 
> >
> >And what *precisely* do you mean by an Ethernet cable??
> 
> 3ft Cat6 with attached connectors.
> 
> 
> >
> >Lisi
> >
> >
> 

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#171332

Don't know if this will help but...
I have a 2 box network, Wheezy and Win2K, cable connected and able to
access directories on the Win2K box from Debian.
Never needed to go the other way.
The Linux box is named playground, the Win2K box South40.
There is a router between them but it's not necessary (belt&suspenders).

On the Linux side:
    These packages installed:
        cifs-utils
        libfilesys-smbclient-perl
        libsmbclient
        samba-common
        samba-common-bin
        smbclient

/etc/hosts has these entries.
192.168.1.1     router
192.168.1.2     playground      play
192.168.1.3     south40         s40

/etc/hostname contains:
playground

/etc/network/interfaces has these lines:
# The primary network interface
allow-hotplug eth1
iface eth1 inet static
        address 192.168.1.2
        netmask 255.255.255.0
        network 192.168.1.0
        broadcast 192.168.1.255

/etc/fstab has these entries:
//south40/H$/docs /south40/docs     cifs noauto,rw,user,credentials=/home/mike/smb.psswd,uid=1000,file_mode=0755,dir_mode=0755,nounix,noserverino       0 0
//south40/I$/MP3s /south40/MP3s     cifs noauto,rw,user,credentials=/home/mike/smb.psswd,uid=1000,file_mode=0755,dir_mode=0755,nounix,noserverino       0 0
#   docs & MP3s on different partitions

/home/mike/smb.psswd has 600 permissions and contains:
username=Win2K_user
password=Win2K_password

I have a small iptables firewall that must allow traffic to/from Win2K.

To access the Win2K files:
root@/deb73:/> mount /south40/docs

On the Win2K side:
StartMenu/ControlPanel/System/NetworkID/Properties:
    Computer Name = south40
    Member of workgroup = WORKGROUP
StartMenu/ControlPanel/System/NetworkID/NetworkID:  launches wizard
    Home use, Users must enter user name and password
StartMenu/Control Panel/Internet Options/Internet Properties/Security/Local Intranet/Sites/Advanced/:
    192.168.1.1
    192.168.1.2
StartMenu/Settings/Network and Dial-up Connections/Local Area Connection      right click
    Properties check:
        Client for Microsoft Networks
        File and Printer sharing
        Internet Protocol(TCP/IP)
    select Internet Protocol(TCP/IP)/Properties:
        Use the following IP address:
            IP Addr:            192.168.1.3
            Subnet mask:        255.255.255.0
            Default Gateway:    192.168.1.2
        Use the following DNS server addresses:
            Prefered DSN:       208.67.222.222
            Alternate:          208.67.220.220
    select Advanced/WINS/Enable NETBIOS over TCP/IP

create C:\shared & shared it (only used with smbclient to pass files back & forth).

C:\WINNT\system32\drivers\etc\hosts:     192.168.1.2    playground


HTH,
Mike
--
Seven deadly sins:
    Anger, gluttony, envy, sloth, avarice, lust and pride.
I practice most of these so guess I'll die one day.

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